Hondaswap.com | Honda Technical & JDM styling Forums

caboose · 08-07-2008, 12:06 AM

take and start the car when it's completely cold. run around to the engine. feel the manifold tubes around each of the cylinders. They should warm up quickly if all cylinders are firing properly. If one is not, that pipe will me much cooler than the rest.

If this happens, then you found your misfire. Then you can limit it to fuel, spark, or compression on that cylinder

budda · 08-07-2008, 12:24 AM

That's a great idea. I just thought of doing that on my car, but on a turbo car that's a BAD idea lol.

91accordwithwork · 08-07-2008, 12:42 AM

ok so do u guys say i do check out the timing? or is it prolly not that??

and as far as touching the tubes, are u refering to me header tubes basicly fell them all and make sure?? and i hav enew plugs in just to add i put them in like 2 months ago

thanks

p.s. as so far what [part does it seem to be that went bad out of all the things???

thanks for being such a help too all!

budda · 08-07-2008, 12:46 AM

yes. basically feel each tube on the exhaust manifold. The plugs are likely not the problem, as long as you remembered to set the gaps on them.

Right now, the failure point is really looking toward the distributor in my opinion.

91accordwithwork · 08-07-2008, 12:51 AM

ok ok ok thanks so i wil buy and install a new "dizzy" then i will get a new main reley as well, and then i will tell you guys if anything has changed at all but can i have everyones opinon on what they think i should start with replaceing?

thanks guys!

budda · 08-07-2008, 12:55 AM

probably the dizzy first. Have you checked to see what fluid is on the plugs yet though?

prpprimo · 08-07-2008, 01:18 AM

If the car starts and runs the main relay is fine. Because you replaced your plugs recently does not indicate they are good. A few members have suggested to pull your plugs, which is an excellent starting point. It does sound like a misfire issue so trace it back from your plugs to wires to distributor. You may not need to replace the entire distributor. Ignitors (ICM) are notorious for failng with high mileage. You may have a faulty injector fouling a plug or 2. you will need to do some trouble shooting on your end to pinpoint the problem.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prpprimo

If the car starts and runs the main relay is fine. Because you replaced your plugs recently does not indicate they are good. A few members have suggested to pull your plugs, which is an excellent starting point. It does sound like a misfire issue so trace it back from your plugs to wires to distributor. You may not need to replace the entire distributor. Ignitors (ICM) are notorious for failng with high mileage. You may have a faulty injector fouling a plug or 2. you will need to do some trouble shooting on your end to pinpoint the problem.

This is why he needs to figure out which cylinder is misfiring. From there we can figure out why that one cylinder is misfiring (fouled plug, bad injector, bad distributor/plug wire...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Budda

That's a great idea. I just thought of doing that on my car, but on a turbo car that's a BAD idea lol.

I don't see why you couldn't do it on a turbo, just feel it on the header part before the turbo... probably be easier since you don't have an exhaust (shield)

91accordwithwork · 08-07-2008, 09:39 AM

ok thanks guys so coorect me if im wronge, but i should

1. find out what fluid is on my plugs
2. touch all 4 tubes and c if any stay cold?
3.??

thanks

4U2H8ME · 08-07-2008, 09:40 AM

I have a some what easy way for you to check your timing, if it's not too far off. First get the engine running til it's warm, and you hear the huffing sound from your cold air intake, secondly loosen the bolts that hold the distributor to the engine, then slowly move the distributor either back or forth. If the engine smooths out, hold that position and tighten bolts. If it doesn't, then set it back to it's original position. Also if it doesn't smooth out, it could be too far out of timing or you have some other problem. If it does smooth out, then you found your problem and require either some kind of timing adjustment or repair.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

I have a some what easy way for you to check your timing, if it's not too far off. First get the engine running til it's warm, and you hear the huffing sound from your cold air intake, secondly loosen the bolts that hold the distributor to the engine, then slowly move the distributor either back or forth. If the engine smooths out, hold that position and tighten bolts. If it doesn't, then it it back to it's original position. Also if it doesn't smooth out, it could be too far out of timing or you have some other problem. If it does smooth out, then you found your problem and require either some kind of timing adjustment or repair.

I thought that we were thinking that it was cam timing, ie timing belt slip, not ignition timing...

But yes, do #1, and #2. Tell us what you come up with, and we will come up with a #3.

Oil on the plugs=black and slippery
Gas=somewhat cleaner/clearer and smells like gas

4U2H8ME · 08-07-2008, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caboose

i thought that we were thinking that it was cam timing, ie timing belt slip, not ignition timing...

But yes, do #1, and #2. Tell us what you come up with, and we will come up with a #3.

Oil on the plugs=black and slippery
gas=somewhat cleaner/clearer and smells like gas

if the cam timing is not too far off, this might tell.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

if the cam timing is not too far off, this might tell.

if the cam timing was not to far off, then it wouldn't run rough. maybe sluggish, but not rough

4U2H8ME · 08-07-2008, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caboose

if the cam timing was not to far off, then it wouldn't run rough. Maybe sluggish, but not rough

i worked for honda for 8 years, you'd be surprized at some of the things i've seen that shouldn't occur.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

i worked for honda for 8 years, you'd be surprized at some of the things i've seen that shouldn't occur.

ok, 99% of the time it isn't going to work like that. MOST LIKELY the problem is going to be a miss on one or more of the cylinders.

If it is running on all four, then we can look into other things, but for now we need to stick the the basics. This kid is new to cars, so there is no need to send him on wild goose chases on things that it most likely isn't.

4U2H8ME · 08-07-2008, 11:33 AM

[quote=caboose;1078428]This is why he needs to figure out which cylinder is misfiring. From there we can figure out why that one cylinder is misfiring (fouled plug, bad injector, bad distributor/plug wire...)

DUDE, IF YOU'VE BEEN READING THIS THREAD, IT'S NOT FLUID ON A PLUG, IT'S FLUID ON "THE PLUGS", SO CHECKING TO SEE WHICH PIPE IS LESS HOT THAN THE OTHERS WON'T MATTER IF THEIR ALL MISFIRING.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

DUDE, IF YOU'VE BEEN READING THIS THREAD, IT'S NOT FLUID ON A PLUG, IT'S FLUID ON "THE PLUGS", SO CHECKING TO SEE WHICH PIPE IS LESS HOT THAN THE OTHERS WON'T MATTER IF THEIR ALL MISFIRING.

Easy now...

First the fluid could be from cranking the motor without it starting if it's gas.

Also, with the honda valve cover design, oil tends to pool up around the plugs anyways. I'm not convinced that he just didn't have oil from there leak down onto the threads of the spark plug when he removed them from the head.

It would also help to know if it was rough at idle or rough all of the time

91accordwithwork · 08-07-2008, 12:18 PM

jezz i missed a lot thanks guys, it turns out the plugs have oily substance on then, and my cold air intake huffs alot, when i turn the car off it gives off one last big HUFF and if one tube is cold on the mani, then would a new dizzy do the trick?

caboose · 08-07-2008, 12:24 PM

It could. If I were you , I would replace the distributor cap, rotor, and a new set of regular NGK plugs wouldn't hurt either. Plug wires if you are in the mood.

Shouldn't be too expensive... $20-25

If you want to be absolutely sure, you could put the spark plug into the spark plug wire and rest it somewhere on the valve cover so that the metal part of the plug is touching something metal and grounded out. Then crank over the motor and look for a spark. If you don't see any, then a new distributor cap and rotor should fix it.

4U2H8ME · 08-07-2008, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caboose

Easy now...

First the fluid could be from cranking the motor without it starting if it's gas.

Also, with the honda valve cover design, oil tends to pool up around the plugs anyways. I'm not convinced that he just didn't have oil from there leak down onto the threads of the spark plug when he removed them from the head.

It would also help to know if it was rough at idle or rough all of the time

Don't misunderstand me dude, but there are a second set of o-rings, in the cylinder head at the bottom of spark plug tube, that goes between the head and tube, that leak from these engines.

caboose · 08-07-2008, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

DUDE, IF YOU'VE BEEN READING THIS THREAD, IT'S NOT FLUID ON A PLUG, IT'S FLUID ON "THE PLUGS", SO CHECKING TO SEE WHICH PIPE IS LESS HOT THAN THE OTHERS WON'T MATTER IF THEIR ALL MISFIRING.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4U2H8ME

Don't misunderstand me dude, but there are a second set of o-rings, in the cylinder head at the bottom of spark plug tube, that goes between the head and tube, that leak from these engines.

No misunderstanding, I got all of that.

You told (shouted) that because there was fluid on all cylinders that ALL of the cylinders must be misfiring. I said that the oil was probably irrelevant because oil pools up around the spark plugs anyways.

Then you preceded to tell me why I'm right... which I already knew since I obviously posted it...

Now if you don't mind, can I continue to help him?

08-07-2008, 12:06 AM	#26
caboose I still know everything Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Hamilton, MI Age: 21 Posts: 314 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 89 CRX HF, 96 Accord EX, 88 Dodge Daytona Shelbyz T-tops Rep Power: 14	take and start the car when it's completely cold. run around to the engine. feel the manifold tubes around each of the cylinders. They should warm up quickly if all cylinders are firing properly. If one is not, that pipe will me much cooler than the rest. If this happens, then you found your misfire. Then you can limit it to fuel, spark, or compression on that cylinder __________________ Formerly the.original.kermit Back from the dead... twice I NEED PARTS!!! http://hondaswap.com/parts-sale-trade-wanted/wtb-1989-crx-parts-161172/#post1079066 Check out my progress... http://hondaswap.com/auto-multi-media/my-1989-crx-project-144941/

08-07-2008, 12:42 AM	#28
91accordwithwork kid that everyone loves! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Wauwatosa WI Age: 14 Posts: 555 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 accrod DX with a few extras : ) Rep Power: 0	ok so do u guys say i do check out the timing? or is it prolly not that?? and as far as touching the tubes, are u refering to me header tubes basicly fell them all and make sure?? and i hav enew plugs in just to add i put them in like 2 months ago thanks p.s. as so far what [part does it seem to be that went bad out of all the things??? thanks for being such a help too all! __________________ heres my mod. list -painted valve cover -new headers -new high flow obx resonator -new carbon fiber exaust tip -new p.s pump -new radiator -new belt -new injen ram intake -new strut bar -new deck (installed myself) -new speakers -not bad for learning as i went and not having shit for help besides u great guys i think thats around all i did, tok a few months but im happy with it! and after all that theres a small puddle of oil under my intake on my engine..... the fun never ends!

08-07-2008, 12:51 AM	#30
91accordwithwork kid that everyone loves! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Wauwatosa WI Age: 14 Posts: 555 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 accrod DX with a few extras : ) Rep Power: 0	ok ok ok thanks so i wil buy and install a new "dizzy" then i will get a new main reley as well, and then i will tell you guys if anything has changed at all but can i have everyones opinon on what they think i should start with replaceing? thanks guys! __________________ heres my mod. list -painted valve cover -new headers -new high flow obx resonator -new carbon fiber exaust tip -new p.s pump -new radiator -new belt -new injen ram intake -new strut bar -new deck (installed myself) -new speakers -not bad for learning as i went and not having shit for help besides u great guys i think thats around all i did, tok a few months but im happy with it! and after all that theres a small puddle of oil under my intake on my engine..... the fun never ends!

08-07-2008, 09:39 AM	#34
91accordwithwork kid that everyone loves! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Wauwatosa WI Age: 14 Posts: 555 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 accrod DX with a few extras : ) Rep Power: 0	ok thanks guys so coorect me if im wronge, but i should 1. find out what fluid is on my plugs 2. touch all 4 tubes and c if any stay cold? 3.?? thanks __________________ heres my mod. list -painted valve cover -new headers -new high flow obx resonator -new carbon fiber exaust tip -new p.s pump -new radiator -new belt -new injen ram intake -new strut bar -new deck (installed myself) -new speakers -not bad for learning as i went and not having shit for help besides u great guys i think thats around all i did, tok a few months but im happy with it! and after all that theres a small puddle of oil under my intake on my engine..... the fun never ends!

08-07-2008, 12:18 PM	#43
91accordwithwork kid that everyone loves! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Wauwatosa WI Age: 14 Posts: 555 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 accrod DX with a few extras : ) Rep Power: 0	jezz i missed a lot thanks guys, it turns out the plugs have oily substance on then, and my cold air intake huffs alot, when i turn the car off it gives off one last big HUFF and if one tube is cold on the mani, then would a new dizzy do the trick? __________________ heres my mod. list -painted valve cover -new headers -new high flow obx resonator -new carbon fiber exaust tip -new p.s pump -new radiator -new belt -new injen ram intake -new strut bar -new deck (installed myself) -new speakers -not bad for learning as i went and not having shit for help besides u great guys i think thats around all i did, tok a few months but im happy with it! and after all that theres a small puddle of oil under my intake on my engine..... the fun never ends!


Welcome, Guest! Please Register or Login: User Name Password Members have access to more features, better search, and see fewer ads! It's free, what are you waiting for?

08-07-2008, 12:24 AM	#27
budda Brilliant Schizophrenia Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Cincinnati Age: 19 Posts: 406 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 1987 Chrysler lebaron turbo Rep Power: 25	That's a great idea. I just thought of doing that on my car, but on a turbo car that's a BAD idea lol.

08-07-2008, 12:46 AM	#29
budda Brilliant Schizophrenia Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Cincinnati Age: 19 Posts: 406 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 1987 Chrysler lebaron turbo Rep Power: 25	yes. basically feel each tube on the exhaust manifold. The plugs are likely not the problem, as long as you remembered to set the gaps on them. Right now, the failure point is really looking toward the distributor in my opinion.

08-07-2008, 12:55 AM	#31
budda Brilliant Schizophrenia Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Cincinnati Age: 19 Posts: 406 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 1987 Chrysler lebaron turbo Rep Power: 25	probably the dizzy first. Have you checked to see what fluid is on the plugs yet though?

08-07-2008, 01:18 AM	#32
prpprimo Hondaholic Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: ABQ Posts: 157 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 hatch z6/ 98 coupe z7 Rep Power: 3	If the car starts and runs the main relay is fine. Because you replaced your plugs recently does not indicate they are good. A few members have suggested to pull your plugs, which is an excellent starting point. It does sound like a misfire issue so trace it back from your plugs to wires to distributor. You may not need to replace the entire distributor. Ignitors (ICM) are notorious for failng with high mileage. You may have a faulty injector fouling a plug or 2. you will need to do some trouble shooting on your end to pinpoint the problem.

08-07-2008, 09:40 AM	#35
4U2H8ME Beer its whats for dinner Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: BRONX, NY Posts: 98 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 Accord LX coupe, Jdm H22a with LSD trans. Rep Power: 4	I have a some what easy way for you to check your timing, if it's not too far off. First get the engine running til it's warm, and you hear the huffing sound from your cold air intake, secondly loosen the bolts that hold the distributor to the engine, then slowly move the distributor either back or forth. If the engine smooths out, hold that position and tighten bolts. If it doesn't, then set it back to it's original position. Also if it doesn't smooth out, it could be too far out of timing or you have some other problem. If it does smooth out, then you found your problem and require either some kind of timing adjustment or repair.

08-07-2008, 11:33 AM	#41
4U2H8ME Beer its whats for dinner Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: BRONX, NY Posts: 98 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 Accord LX coupe, Jdm H22a with LSD trans. Rep Power: 4	[quote=caboose;1078428]This is why he needs to figure out which cylinder is misfiring. From there we can figure out why that one cylinder is misfiring (fouled plug, bad injector, bad distributor/plug wire...) DUDE, IF YOU'VE BEEN READING THIS THREAD, IT'S NOT FLUID ON A PLUG, IT'S FLUID ON "THE PLUGS", SO CHECKING TO SEE WHICH PIPE IS LESS HOT THAN THE OTHERS WON'T MATTER IF THEIR ALL MISFIRING.

08-07-2008, 12:24 PM	#44
caboose I still know everything Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Hamilton, MI Age: 21 Posts: 314 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 89 CRX HF, 96 Accord EX, 88 Dodge Daytona Shelbyz T-tops Rep Power: 14	It could. If I were you , I would replace the distributor cap, rotor, and a new set of regular NGK plugs wouldn't hurt either. Plug wires if you are in the mood. Shouldn't be too expensive... $20-25 If you want to be absolutely sure, you could put the spark plug into the spark plug wire and rest it somewhere on the valve cover so that the metal part of the plug is touching something metal and grounded out. Then crank over the motor and look for a spark. If you don't see any, then a new distributor cap and rotor should fix it. __________________ Formerly the.original.kermit Back from the dead... twice I NEED PARTS!!! http://hondaswap.com/parts-sale-trade-wanted/wtb-1989-crx-parts-161172/#post1079066 Check out my progress... http://hondaswap.com/auto-multi-media/my-1989-crx-project-144941/

Hondaswap.com | Honda Technical & JDM styling Forums

please help car wont start dont no why?