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rsaeini · 09-26-2003, 07:02 PM

is it true that you can use a B18C crank, rods, and pistons to stroke a B16A to 1797cc ???
if you're going to answer this question please back it up with facts.

i was reading up on the Toda B16 stroker kit and it mentioned that it will make the stroke 87.2 from it's stock 77.4mm. if i'm not mistaken, the b18c has a stroke of 87.2, right? so wouldn't it make sense that you could use the b18c components and have a home-made stroker kit?
the bore of the 2 engines are the same so it doesn't really matter which piston you use...well, sort of...i know you need to worry about piston-to-valve clearance whenever you change the stroke of it and you'll probably have to get it blue-printed.

any thoughts???

now, i know the B16B and B18C blocks are the same so this concept will definitely work on the CTR block but i'm curious to know if it will work on a B16A block.

a B18C crank goes for about $400-500+/- and you can get some eagle rods for about $350 +/-, get some ITR pistons for $300+/-.
do the labor yourself and you just got a b16 stroker kit for about $1200+/-, roughly half the price Toda charges.

Calesta · 09-26-2003, 07:10 PM

The deck height on the B18C is higher, and the stroker kit probably uses custom length rods and pistons. If you really want a 1.8L B series block, just go buy the B18C.

rsaeini · 09-26-2003, 07:17 PM

i was just curious about that.

does any have specs on the different components of the 2 engines in question? deck height, rod lenght, crank specs, etc...

also, what's is the rod ration on the B18C ?

Calesta · 09-26-2003, 07:21 PM

I don't know exact deck height (B18C is like 8mm taller or something), but the information you're looking for is in the reference section...

B16A
Rod = 134.36 mm
Stroke = 77mm
Ratio = 1.745

B18C
Rod = 137.90 mm
Stroke = 87.2mm
Ratio = 1.581

rsaeini · 09-26-2003, 07:24 PM

thanks for the specs.

PS- rod lenght and rod ratio aren't in the reference section. it only lists the following:

Displacement (cc): 1595
Power (bhp@rpm): 160@7600
Torque (ft/lbs@rpm): 111@7000
Compression Ratio: 10.4:1
Bore (mm): 81
Stroke (mm): 77.4
Cam Design: dohc

Calesta · 09-26-2003, 07:30 PM

Oh, I thought I put rod length in there. Oh well.

rsaeini · 09-26-2003, 07:55 PM

has anyone ever known someone who had a stroked B16. i'm curious what the outcome/performance differences would be.

i was thinking about stroking my B16 but i decided against. i'm still interested in learning about the concepts behind stroking.

so from my under standing, if you install the Toda stroker kit you will basically have a stock B18C.
basically here is what the kit is promising compared to a stock B18C. it's nearly the same as a stock gsr block.

B16 with Toda stroker kit:
rod ratio = 1.54
displacement = 1797cc
compression = 11.0:1
stroke = 87.2

stock B18C:
rod ration = 1.58
displacement = 1797cc
compression = 10.0:1
stroke = 87.2

i just want to know what the benefits are to stroking the tiny B16.

kingwilly · 09-26-2003, 08:20 PM

i think more torque but im not sure....

khrisb · 09-26-2003, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rsaeini@Sep 26 2003, 06:55 PM
i just want to know what the benefits are to stroking the tiny B16.

Well, you get to have the 1.8 liters of displacement and still have the B16 stamp on the block...sleeper...

MaaseyRacer · 09-26-2003, 08:32 PM

there is a guy that drives around where i live with a b16 crx, and he put a b17 crank shaft into the b16, and ctr pistons. He said it was a nice power gain, and a good source for getting a little bit of torque out of the b16. i cannot say much more than that, as i have only talked to him once and i have not riden in his car.

Calesta · 09-26-2003, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rsaeini@Sep 26 2003, 06:55 PM
has anyone ever known someone who had a stroked B16. i'm curious what the outcome/performance differences would be.

Based on your information, it looks like Toda's using rods that are slightly shorter than the B16 units, and pistons with higher wrist pin mounts and/or shorter compression heights. The only real advantage you have there is getting 1.8L in a block that's stamped "B16", and one point of compression. It's not that hard to get to 11.0:1 compression in a GSR engine though...

So you gain displacement, lose rod/stroke ratio compared to stock without gaining the benefit of the crank girdle that the B18C comes with, and you have to worry about spec'ing out new bearings for your crank and rods (most likely, dunno for sure). The way I see it, you basically turn your B16 into an LS/VTEC (geometry) with a B16 head, and slightly higher compression.

**Tonyd0821** · 09-26-2003, 11:49 PM

me personally?

I would sell the b16 and buy something....
oooh, more "exotic"

JDMilan · 09-27-2003, 01:53 PM

resleeve it with a larger displacement bottom and the cost will be the same but you will get a 2.0 instead of a 1.8,,,fuck the sleeper stamp..

rsaeini · 09-27-2003, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tonyd0821@Sep 26 2003, 07:49 PM
me personally?

I would sell the b16 and buy something....
oooh, more "exotic"

wink...good one tony. i need that new position to be able to afford something "exotic".

92b16vx · 09-27-2003, 02:22 PM

Deck height for the B18C1 is 8.347" B16A is 7.998"

rsaeini · 09-27-2003, 05:50 PM

good stuff John. coming through with the answer i was looking for. thanks.

jspecivicsi · 09-27-2003, 05:52 PM

iv read in HCI that you can use b18 crank but im pretty sure that you have to get custom rods made ill find out and let you know

JDMilan · 09-27-2003, 07:42 PM

you can get all the custom stuff done but it is much cheaper to just a used GSR shortblock, see those going for 500 from time to time and you can't beat that plus you can sell your b16 bottom for like 200-300 and bammm, you have a 1.8 for literally 300 or so bucks if you do all the work.

good luck.

B16 · 09-28-2003, 06:29 PM

don't you have to notch the bottom of the cylinder walls for the rods to clear from the extra stroke?

97CTR · 09-29-2003, 08:10 AM

I have a b16b and I just bought a gsr crank and some eagle rods. I plan on doing the work my next free weekend. I will let you know what gains I make. It should be a little better than an ITR becuase of the higher compression pistons and the ctr cams. I can't wait.

B16 · 09-29-2003, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 97CTR@Sep 29 2003, 04:10 AM
I have a b16b and I just bought a gsr crank and some eagle rods. I plan on doing the work my next free weekend. I will let you know what gains I make. It should be a little better than an ITR becuase of the higher compression pistons and the ctr cams. I can't wait.

well, your situation is slightly different, the b16b block has the same deck height as the b18c blocks, the b16a blocks are shorter.

92b16vx · 10-01-2003, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jspecivicsi@Sep 27 2003, 10:52 PM
iv read in HCI that you can use b18 crank but im pretty sure that you have to get custom rods made ill find out and let you know

That engine was bored to use 81.5 piston, and had custom rod length of 5.05". They used a custom crank, but it was the same as the B18A/B crank. I don't know if it would fit without notching the block when using a stock bore or not. But they did say they retained the stock rod ends, and just used a custom length. The Probe pistons were modelled after the ITR ones. So I guess if you used a 81.5 bore ITR piston, a B18B crank, and the custom length rods, all you have to deal with is boring it, but the head was milled, so that may need some checking into.

Calesta · 10-01-2003, 05:54 AM

Yeesh... 5.05" rod with an 89mm stroke- painful in a B16.

09-26-2003, 07:10 PM	#2
Calesta Admin with a big stick Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Dallas / Fort Worth, TX Age: 32 Posts: 24,525 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 2003 S2000 Rep Power: 291	The deck height on the B18C is higher, and the stroker kit probably uses custom length rods and pistons. If you really want a 1.8L B series block, just go buy the B18C. __________________ DO NOT PM me with tech questions! Use the forums! Intercrew Auto Salon - (972) 485-8688

09-26-2003, 07:17 PM	#3
rsaeini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,417 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 28	i was just curious about that. does any have specs on the different components of the 2 engines in question? deck height, rod lenght, crank specs, etc... also, what's is the rod ration on the B18C ? __________________ "let those who judge me burn in hell until their Hondas are repossessed" - ME 1.6-1.8

09-26-2003, 07:21 PM	#4
Calesta Admin with a big stick Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Dallas / Fort Worth, TX Age: 32 Posts: 24,525 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 2003 S2000 Rep Power: 291	I don't know exact deck height (B18C is like 8mm taller or something), but the information you're looking for is in the reference section... B16A Rod = 134.36 mm Stroke = 77mm Ratio = 1.745 B18C Rod = 137.90 mm Stroke = 87.2mm Ratio = 1.581 __________________ DO NOT PM me with tech questions! Use the forums! Intercrew Auto Salon - (972) 485-8688

09-26-2003, 07:24 PM	#5
rsaeini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,417 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 28	thanks for the specs. PS- rod lenght and rod ratio aren't in the reference section. it only lists the following: Displacement (cc): 1595 Power (bhp@rpm): 160@7600 Torque (ft/lbs@rpm): 111@7000 Compression Ratio: 10.4:1 Bore (mm): 81 Stroke (mm): 77.4 Cam Design: dohc __________________ "let those who judge me burn in hell until their Hondas are repossessed" - ME 1.6-1.8

09-26-2003, 07:30 PM	#6
Calesta Admin with a big stick Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Dallas / Fort Worth, TX Age: 32 Posts: 24,525 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 2003 S2000 Rep Power: 291	Oh, I thought I put rod length in there. Oh well. __________________ DO NOT PM me with tech questions! Use the forums! Intercrew Auto Salon - (972) 485-8688


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09-26-2003, 07:02 PM	#1
rsaeini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,417 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 28	is it true that you can use a B18C crank, rods, and pistons to stroke a B16A to 1797cc ??? if you're going to answer this question please back it up with facts. i was reading up on the Toda B16 stroker kit and it mentioned that it will make the stroke 87.2 from it's stock 77.4mm. if i'm not mistaken, the b18c has a stroke of 87.2, right? so wouldn't it make sense that you could use the b18c components and have a home-made stroker kit? the bore of the 2 engines are the same so it doesn't really matter which piston you use...well, sort of...i know you need to worry about piston-to-valve clearance whenever you change the stroke of it and you'll probably have to get it blue-printed. any thoughts??? now, i know the B16B and B18C blocks are the same so this concept will definitely work on the CTR block but i'm curious to know if it will work on a B16A block. a B18C crank goes for about $400-500+/- and you can get some eagle rods for about $350 +/-, get some ITR pistons for $300+/-. do the labor yourself and you just got a b16 stroker kit for about $1200+/-, roughly half the price Toda charges.

09-26-2003, 07:55 PM	#7
rsaeini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,417 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 28	has anyone ever known someone who had a stroked B16. i'm curious what the outcome/performance differences would be. i was thinking about stroking my B16 but i decided against. i'm still interested in learning about the concepts behind stroking. so from my under standing, if you install the Toda stroker kit you will basically have a stock B18C. basically here is what the kit is promising compared to a stock B18C. it's nearly the same as a stock gsr block. B16 with Toda stroker kit: rod ratio = 1.54 displacement = 1797cc compression = 11.0:1 stroke = 87.2 stock B18C: rod ration = 1.58 displacement = 1797cc compression = 10.0:1 stroke = 87.2 i just want to know what the benefits are to stroking the tiny B16. __________________ "let those who judge me burn in hell until their Hondas are repossessed" - ME 1.6-1.8

09-26-2003, 08:20 PM	#8
kingwilly Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: arizona Posts: 349 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 17	i think more torque but im not sure....

09-26-2003, 08:32 PM	#10
MaaseyRacer Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Francisco, Ca. Posts: 2,975 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 44	there is a guy that drives around where i live with a b16 crx, and he put a b17 crank shaft into the b16, and ctr pistons. He said it was a nice power gain, and a good source for getting a little bit of torque out of the b16. i cannot say much more than that, as i have only talked to him once and i have not riden in his car. __________________ 2004 Toyota Tacoma 3.4L V6 TRD Package 4WD ----------------------

09-26-2003, 11:49 PM	#12
Tonyd0821 Banned Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5,089 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 0	me personally? I would sell the b16 and buy something.... oooh, more "exotic"

09-27-2003, 01:53 PM	#13
JDMilan Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 6,733 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 81	resleeve it with a larger displacement bottom and the cost will be the same but you will get a 2.0 instead of a 1.8,,,fuck the sleeper stamp.. __________________ <span style=\"color:red\">"92 Blue EG"</span> -Project 3 - Motor A (NA stock SiR longblock B16 EG/S1tran) 14.3@97 15" radial tires & Gutted -Project 3 - Motor B (NA stock SiRII longblock B16 EG/S4tran) 13.3@103 MT's & Gutted <span style=\"color:red\">"Goldy S13"</span> -Project 4 - Motor A (FI SR20DET w/T28 "Under Construction&quot <span style=\"color:red\">"Silver E46"</span> -Project 5 - Motor A (???)

09-27-2003, 02:22 PM	#15
92b16vx B happy Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Location: Location: Location: Age: 38 Posts: 13,020 iTrader: 1 / 100% Ride: dohc 95 egg Rep Power: 186	Deck height for the B18C1 is 8.347" B16A is 7.998" __________________ 95 CX\|B16A2 XBL \| binary xj0hnx \| Halo 3

09-27-2003, 05:50 PM	#16
rsaeini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,417 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 28	good stuff John. coming through with the answer i was looking for. thanks. __________________ "let those who judge me burn in hell until their Hondas are repossessed" - ME 1.6-1.8

09-27-2003, 05:52 PM	#17
jspecivicsi Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 71 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 13	iv read in HCI that you can use b18 crank but im pretty sure that you have to get custom rods made ill find out and let you know

09-27-2003, 07:42 PM	#18
JDMilan Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 6,733 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 81	you can get all the custom stuff done but it is much cheaper to just a used GSR shortblock, see those going for 500 from time to time and you can't beat that plus you can sell your b16 bottom for like 200-300 and bammm, you have a 1.8 for literally 300 or so bucks if you do all the work. good luck. __________________ <span style=\"color:red\">"92 Blue EG"</span> -Project 3 - Motor A (NA stock SiR longblock B16 EG/S1tran) 14.3@97 15" radial tires & Gutted -Project 3 - Motor B (NA stock SiRII longblock B16 EG/S4tran) 13.3@103 MT's & Gutted <span style=\"color:red\">"Goldy S13"</span> -Project 4 - Motor A (FI SR20DET w/T28 "Under Construction&quot <span style=\"color:red\">"Silver E46"</span> -Project 5 - Motor A (???)

09-28-2003, 06:29 PM	#19
B16 Super Moderator Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: yay area, CA Age: 31 Posts: 6,759 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 126	don't you have to notch the bottom of the cylinder walls for the rods to clear from the extra stroke? __________________ 2005 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution 8 2004 BMW 325i 2000 Mercedes Benz ML 430 1994 Honda Civic Del Sol VTEC (race kaa)

09-29-2003, 08:10 AM	#20
97CTR Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 745 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 20	I have a b16b and I just bought a gsr crank and some eagle rods. I plan on doing the work my next free weekend. I will let you know what gains I make. It should be a little better than an ITR becuase of the higher compression pistons and the ctr cams. I can't wait. __________________ 97 ex coupe Wire tuck in progress....

10-01-2003, 05:54 AM	#23
Calesta Admin with a big stick Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Dallas / Fort Worth, TX Age: 32 Posts: 24,525 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 2003 S2000 Rep Power: 291	Yeesh... 5.05" rod with an 89mm stroke- painful in a B16. __________________ DO NOT PM me with tech questions! Use the forums! Intercrew Auto Salon - (972) 485-8688

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