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TAGURIT · 09-28-2006, 01:16 AM

how high can you rev an ls motor w/ stock rods, stock pistons, w/ dual valve springs at a compression of 11:1:1 with arp rod bolts and arp head studs?

97hatch · 09-28-2006, 08:08 AM

how do you get 11:1 and use stock pistons

me must know (just pore in a botle of compression boost or what )

MikeBergy · 09-28-2006, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97hatch

how do you get 11:1 and use stock pistons

me must know (just pore in a botle of compression boost or what )

lol, yeah, you haven't seen that compression boost additive at kragen?

TAGURIT · 09-28-2006, 06:59 PM

radius the head.....

97hatch · 09-29-2006, 05:51 PM

if you take material out of the head it would lower compresion

TAGURIT · 10-01-2006, 06:43 PM

trust me, my compression is 11:1:1 with stock rods and pistons.....

reikoshea · 10-01-2006, 07:27 PM

milling to .06 would do it, but valve tap might become a problem. id definitely clay the motor before hand (like you should do anyway).

i dont know the answer to this question, but i will say you want to use a type r oil pump if you plan on going over the stock red line.

TAGURIT · 10-01-2006, 07:34 PM

actually all the work is done and only used to rev to 7200 before valve float with stock rod bolts and head bolts. i have since then upgraded with arp rod bolts and head studs and added dual valve springs. so i was just curious how high could i go (safely) with the upgrades.

tartymctang2357 · 10-03-2006, 02:42 AM

changing the head doesn't change your redline, the thing that determins your redline is the rod stroke ratio of the block, a stock ls block (b18a/b) has a r/s of 1.54 a GOOD r/s ratio is typically 1.66-1.78, so unless you change the stroke of the crank or the length of the rod you should only rev it as high as the redline on a stock ls block which is 6500 any more and you risk damaging the bottom end, and if you don't take my advice at least change the rod bolts to arp that'll help with higher then stock redlining

lsvtec · 10-03-2006, 03:35 PM

This is not true. Actually, with good rods you can rev the LS bottom end much higher. I had mine at 8200 reliably. R/S ratio determines side load and after you work out the amout of side load placed by a GSR bottom end, the increase to the LS is insignificant (IIRC it was less that 1% different). Before you quote answers like this make sure that they are correct.

tartymctang2357 · 10-03-2006, 03:37 PM

right and the side loading creats vibrations in the cylinders, thats why a gsr has a block girdle to help with those vibrations, a stock ls block doesn't have one

lsvtec · 10-03-2006, 03:42 PM

I understand, but are you trying to tell me that a difference on less than 1% is going to tear an engine up?

reikoshea · 10-03-2006, 03:54 PM

its not....the big reasons you cant overrev the ls:

oiling.

people try and use the standard ls oil pump, instead of the itr. the ls doesnt have oil squirters so the friction is increased...hence the melted piston problems

Its a piece of engine building fact that the longer the stroke. Thats kind of a cop out of a reason, but it works

even though lsvtec can be made reliable, you have to realize that you are using parts that were never meant to be together and shit does happen. timing belts might skip teeth, cam lift maybe too high....you never really know.

you are right to a point tarty, rs has something to do with it, but there are plenty of other factors involved.

lsvtec · 10-03-2006, 05:40 PM

There is the key, proper lubrication. The LS oil pump is woefully undersized for high RPM. I didn't want the oil squirters becase I ran forged internals and didn't need the heat dissapation that they provide (they don't provide much more lubrication than you get without them).

MikeBergy · 10-04-2006, 05:13 AM

Not to threadjack, but what about the pr3 b16a oil pump? I am using one on my b18a, and haven't had any issues after almost 30k on the build, and I rev to around 7500 (where my redline is set).

TAGURIT · 10-06-2006, 11:16 AM

ok, so if we go back to the top, my post.....how high would i be able to rev with the new hardware??

lsvtec · 10-06-2006, 12:37 PM

Without the cams to breathe any higher there is no point. I have seen LS rods go to 8000 with ARP bolts. I haven't personally seen any higher.

HatchSpeeD · 10-06-2006, 10:34 PM

For future reference, I believe the GSR & R have the same part number for oil pump. No difference. Thats only been maybe the last few years acura made that move.

reikoshea · 10-06-2006, 10:40 PM

yup, youre right, they are. good info.

LateApex31 · 10-15-2006, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAGURIT

ok, so if we go back to the top, my post.....how high would i be able to rev with the new hardware??

It should rev past 8k no problem. However, you should put it on a dyno to see where/if it makes any power.

pubes2942 · 10-15-2006, 10:13 PM

Im very interested in this too. Hey Tagurit, is the b18a1 in ur sig, is it in a DA??And is this the B18a1 ur refering to in this thread?

TAGURIT · 10-16-2006, 06:35 PM

yeah just upgraded some parts, like the valve springs and arp hardware and it is in a da chassis

TAGURIT · 10-16-2006, 06:48 PM

going to try and see which cam will make more power. the bullfrog cams i got with the head package pulls really hard but im also going to try the crower 403's and see how they perform with the headwork....

pubes2942 · 10-16-2006, 10:15 PM

Do you have a traction bar, or is ur car stripped or something? Cuz that is a good quarter mile time for the horsepower you think you have!!!
Let me guess. Just that good of a driver???Ehhhhh????LOL

TAGURIT · 10-16-2006, 10:22 PM

only the back half is gutted....

09-28-2006, 01:16 AM	#1
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	How High Can You Go how high can you rev an ls motor w/ stock rods, stock pistons, w/ dual valve springs at a compression of 11:1:1 with arp rod bolts and arp head studs? __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

09-28-2006, 08:08 AM	#2
97hatch ? Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Anderson IN Age: 26 Posts: 1,589 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: i have 14 cars i drive my sohc turbo ef Rep Power: 34	how do you get 11:1 and use stock pistons me must know (just pore in a botle of compression boost or what ) __________________ SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS.

09-28-2006, 06:59 PM	#4
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	radius the head..... __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

09-29-2006, 05:51 PM	#5
97hatch ? Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Anderson IN Age: 26 Posts: 1,589 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: i have 14 cars i drive my sohc turbo ef Rep Power: 34	if you take material out of the head it would lower compresion __________________ SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS.

10-01-2006, 06:43 PM	#6
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	trust me, my compression is 11:1:1 with stock rods and pistons..... __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/


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10-01-2006, 07:34 PM	#8
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	actually all the work is done and only used to rev to 7200 before valve float with stock rod bolts and head bolts. i have since then upgraded with arp rod bolts and head studs and added dual valve springs. so i was just curious how high could i go (safely) with the upgrades. __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

10-03-2006, 02:42 AM	#9
tartymctang2357 Grand High Wizard Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: philadelphia Posts: 149 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 10	changing the head doesn't change your redline, the thing that determins your redline is the rod stroke ratio of the block, a stock ls block (b18a/b) has a r/s of 1.54 a GOOD r/s ratio is typically 1.66-1.78, so unless you change the stroke of the crank or the length of the rod you should only rev it as high as the redline on a stock ls block which is 6500 any more and you risk damaging the bottom end, and if you don't take my advice at least change the rod bolts to arp that'll help with higher then stock redlining

10-03-2006, 03:35 PM	#10
lsvtec GNU/Linux Evangelist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Greater Portland, OR Posts: 5,497 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: The Cheapest Road Bicycle I could get Rep Power: 69	This is not true. Actually, with good rods you can rev the LS bottom end much higher. I had mine at 8200 reliably. R/S ratio determines side load and after you work out the amout of side load placed by a GSR bottom end, the increase to the LS is insignificant (IIRC it was less that 1% different). Before you quote answers like this make sure that they are correct. __________________ v3sw7+9Chw6ln3pr7Ock4ma9w3TXm3l7GDF i7Ce6+8t4MNb8Oen6g6RAOa26s5MRp6 hackerkey.com

10-03-2006, 03:37 PM	#11
tartymctang2357 Grand High Wizard Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: philadelphia Posts: 149 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 10	right and the side loading creats vibrations in the cylinders, thats why a gsr has a block girdle to help with those vibrations, a stock ls block doesn't have one

10-03-2006, 03:42 PM	#12
lsvtec GNU/Linux Evangelist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Greater Portland, OR Posts: 5,497 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: The Cheapest Road Bicycle I could get Rep Power: 69	I understand, but are you trying to tell me that a difference on less than 1% is going to tear an engine up? __________________ v3sw7+9Chw6ln3pr7Ock4ma9w3TXm3l7GDF i7Ce6+8t4MNb8Oen6g6RAOa26s5MRp6 hackerkey.com

10-03-2006, 05:40 PM	#14
lsvtec GNU/Linux Evangelist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Greater Portland, OR Posts: 5,497 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: The Cheapest Road Bicycle I could get Rep Power: 69	There is the key, proper lubrication. The LS oil pump is woefully undersized for high RPM. I didn't want the oil squirters becase I ran forged internals and didn't need the heat dissapation that they provide (they don't provide much more lubrication than you get without them). __________________ v3sw7+9Chw6ln3pr7Ock4ma9w3TXm3l7GDF i7Ce6+8t4MNb8Oen6g6RAOa26s5MRp6 hackerkey.com

10-06-2006, 11:16 AM	#16
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	ok, so if we go back to the top, my post.....how high would i be able to rev with the new hardware?? __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

10-06-2006, 12:37 PM	#17
lsvtec GNU/Linux Evangelist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Greater Portland, OR Posts: 5,497 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: The Cheapest Road Bicycle I could get Rep Power: 69	Without the cams to breathe any higher there is no point. I have seen LS rods go to 8000 with ARP bolts. I haven't personally seen any higher. __________________ v3sw7+9Chw6ln3pr7Ock4ma9w3TXm3l7GDF i7Ce6+8t4MNb8Oen6g6RAOa26s5MRp6 hackerkey.com

10-06-2006, 10:34 PM	#18
HatchSpeeD ...Hi... Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Beantown Posts: 1,237 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 26	For future reference, I believe the GSR & R have the same part number for oil pump. No difference. Thats only been maybe the last few years acura made that move.

10-15-2006, 10:13 PM	#21
pubes2942 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 10 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 7	Im very interested in this too. Hey Tagurit, is the b18a1 in ur sig, is it in a DA??And is this the B18a1 ur refering to in this thread?

10-16-2006, 06:35 PM	#22
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	yeah just upgraded some parts, like the valve springs and arp hardware and it is in a da chassis __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

10-16-2006, 06:48 PM	#23
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	going to try and see which cam will make more power. the bullfrog cams i got with the head package pulls really hard but im also going to try the crower 403's and see how they perform with the headwork.... __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

10-16-2006, 10:15 PM	#24
pubes2942 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 10 iTrader: 0 / 0% Rep Power: 7	Do you have a traction bar, or is ur car stripped or something? Cuz that is a good quarter mile time for the horsepower you think you have!!! Let me guess. Just that good of a driver???Ehhhhh????LOL

10-16-2006, 10:22 PM	#25
TAGURIT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 148 iTrader: 0 / 0% Ride: 91 TEG Rep Power: 8	only the back half is gutted.... __________________ B18A1 13.46@97MPH ALL MOTOR NON VTEC 1.9 60ft W/STOCK 91 RS TRANNY 12's HERE WE COME........... http://www.gude.com/

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