Silverchild79

well here ya go, reality isn't always as dramatic as the one the news would paint for us but here are some facts you might have not yet heard, so before you call the war a failure and condem "dubbya"...

Since President Bush declared an end to major combat on May 1...



... the first battalion of the new Iraqi Army has graduated and is on active duty.



... over 60,000 Iraqis now provide security to their fellow citizens.



... nearly all of Iraq's 400 courts are functioning.



... the Iraqi judiciary is fully independent.



... on Monday, October 6 power generation hit 4,518 megawatts-exceeding the prewar average.



... all 22 universities and 43 technical institutes and colleges are open, as are nearly all primary and secondary schools.



... by October 1, Coalition forces had rehab-ed over 1,500 schools - 500 more than scheduled.



... teachers earn from 12 to 25 times their former salaries.



... all 240 hospitals and more than 1200 clinics are open.



... doctors salaries are at least eight times what they were under Saddam.



... pharmaceutical distribution has gone from essentially nothing to 700 tons in May to a current total of 12,000 tons.



... the Coalition has helped administer over 22 million vaccination doses to Iraq's children.



... a Coalition program has cleared over 14,000 kilometers of Iraq's 27,000 kilometers of weed-choked canals which

now irrigate tens of thousands of farms. This project has created jobs for more than 100,000 Iraqi men and women.



... we have restored over three-quarters of prewar telephone services and over two-thirds of the potable water production.



... there are 4,900 full-service telephone connections. We expect 50,000 by year-end.



... the wheels of commerce are turning. From bicycles to satellite dishes to cars and trucks, businesses are coming to life in

all major cities and towns.



... 95 percent of all prewar bank customers have service and first-time customers are opening accounts daily.



... Iraqi banks are making loans to finance businesses.



... the central bank is fully independent.



... Iraq has one of the worlds most growth-oriented investment and banking laws.



... Iraq has a single, unified currency for the first time in 15 years.



... satellite TV dishes are legal.



... foreign journalists aren't on 10-day visas paying mandatory and extortionate fees to the Ministry of Information

for minders and other government spies.



... there is no Ministry of Information.



... there are more than 170 newspapers.



... you can buy satellite dishes on what seems like every street corner.



... foreign journalists (and everyone else) are free to come and go.



... a nation that had not one single element - legislative, judicial or executive - of a representative government, now does.



... in Baghdad alone residents have selected 88 advisory councils. Baghdad's first democratic transfer of power in 35 years

happened when the city council elected its new chairman.



... today in Iraq chambers of commerce, business, school and professional organizations are electing their leaders all over

the country.



... 25 ministers, selected by the most representative governing body in Iraq's history, run the day-to-day business of

government.



... the Iraqi government regularly participates in international events. Since July the Iraqi government has been represented

in over two dozen international meetings, including those of the UN General Assembly, the Arab League, the World

Bank and IMF and, today, the Islamic Conference Summit. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs today announced that it is

reopening over 30 Iraqi embassies around the world.



... Shia religious festivals that were all but banned, aren't.



... for the first time in 35 years, in Karbala thousands of Shiites celebrate the pilgrimage of the 12th Imam.



... the Coalition has completed over 13,000 reconstruction projects, large and small, as part of a strategic plan for the

reconstruction of Iraq.



... Uday and Queasy are dead - and no longer feeding innocent Iraqis to the zoo lions, raping the young daughters of local

leaders to force cooperation, torturing Iraq's soccer players for losing games, or murdering critics.



... children aren't imprisoned or murdered when their parents disagree with the government.



... political opponents aren't imprisoned, tortured, executed, maimed, or are forced to watch their families die for

disagreeing with Saddam.



... millions of longsuffering Iraqis no longer live in perpetual terror.



... Saudis will hold municipal elections.



... Qatar is reforming education to give more choices to parents.



... Jordan is accelerating market economic reforms.



... the Nobel Peace Prize was awarded for the first time to an Iranian -- a Muslim woman who speaks out with courage for

human rights, for democracy and for peace.



... Saddam is gone.



... Iraq is free.



... President Bush has not faltered or failed.



... Yet, little or none of this information has been published by the Press corps that prides itself on bring you all the news

that's important.



Iraq under US lead control has come further in six months than Germany did in seven years or Japan did in nine years following WWII. Military deaths from fanatic Nazi's, and Japanese numbered in the thousands and continued for over three years after WWII victory was declared.



It took the US over four months to clear away the twin tower debris, let alone attempt to build something else in its place.



Now, take into account that almost every Democrat leader in the House and Senate has fought President Bush on every aspect of his handling of this country's war and the post-war reconstruction; and that they continue to claim on a daily basis on national TV that this conflict has been a failure.



Taking everything into consideration, even the unfortunate loss of our sons and daughters in this conflict, do you think anyone else in the world could have accomplished as much as the United States and the Bush administration in so short a period of time?

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E_SolSi

great post

Slammed89Integra

:AWESOME POST: YAY!

BUSH IS THE MAN!

BUSH FOR 2004!!!

W0000t for Mr. President Bush!!!!


W00000000000000000000t

EDIT: THIS IS SARCASM to the dumb folk.

K2e2vin

didnt read the whole thing but great post. nowonder i never saw any satellite dishes out there, i just thought they couldnt get that, but they can get mp3 players and stuff.

Silverchild79

now I hate to hijack my own thread but serious I have a hard time understanding this. Why don't you like Bush? What has he failed to do. He has revived the economy, reformed medicare, the War in Iraq was a resounding, although ongoing, success. Yes he has failed so far to prove that there were WMD in Iraq but look at the list of things he has done with this war. People always bitch about the WMD thing but I haven't heard ANYONE outside myself claim that the war was a success because we liberated millions of people from a terrible dictator. Since when did we as a people become so selfish that this becomes a sencond tier justification?

Seriously mang where's the beef? You don't really still want that pussy Gore in there do you?

__________________
You can do anything you want to in this world, unless Jay Leno wants to do it too...

Slammed89Integra

Personally, just seeing him represent our country doesn't do it for me. I know there are way better people suited for the job.

I don't have facts in front of me, but really, he stole the election in the 1st place. He has maybe "revived" the economy in some eyes, but really I have yet to see this. Don't call me a liberal, because in no way I am, but really this is what I've heard. He has also to have been said, to have abolished more environmental protection laws in his term then there have been put up in the last 12 years if I recall.


I can't defend my self really at this moment on my views. I'm shooken up.
Sorry, I just rear ended someone about 2 hours ago, I shouldn't be typing. I fucked my car for good, I don't have full coverage or anything, left a scuff on the person's taurus, but ripped off my front end. I was doing 20 on I-5 SB, merging, saw a big gap to my left, did a head check, looked forward, locked up the breaks, and slid into the lady in a matter of 6 seconds. I got written up for "following too close" even though I was atleast 4-5 seconds away. I couldn't do anything. The officer treated me like shit. Didn't call a tow truck or anything, didn't look at my car, just said here's your shit, drive home, when I live like 12 miles of highway home. I had to zip tie my hood down, my bumper ripped off, etc. I got it home but the body's fucked. Fender's bent, etc. I'm so fucked, I have very little money, and I have a 158 ticket. My mom is disabled so she doesn't work, and we live off my pay checks and child support so she can't help me. My dad might give me a loan or something to fix it but I don't know if I really want to rebuild it again. I'm only 16, so I'm uber fucked in the long run. I don't know what I did wrong, but yeah, Sorry I can't actually give you an argument worth it.

[/Whipes eyes]

__________________
When this is all over I think we should get an apartment together.

Slammed89Integra

But upon furthe inspection it looks fucking totaled. The fender line on passenger side is bent in all the way, and the frame area around the passenger side mount is all cracked, and when I drove it home, it kept shaking when I left off the gas.

Sabz5150

now I hate to hijack my own thread but serious I have a hard time understanding this. Why don't you like Bush? What has he failed to do. He has revived the economy, reformed medicare, the War in Iraq was a resounding, although ongoing, success. Yes he has failed so far to prove that there were WMD in Iraq but look at the list of things he has done with this war. People always bitch about the WMD thing but I haven't heard ANYONE outside myself claim that the war was a success because we liberated millions of people from a terrible dictator. Since when did we as a people become so selfish that this becomes a sencond tier justification?

Seriously mang where's the beef? You don't really still want that pussy Gore in there do you? [/b][/quote]
I'm game.

What has Bush failed to do? Here we go.

HE WONT STOP SPENGING MONEY! We're half a trillion dollars in debt!!!

Failed to uphold the Geneva Convention. Disallowing inspectiors into Guantanimo did this one.

Failed to handle the Enron scandal properly. Ken Lay got away with it all.

Failed to handle corruption in the oil industry.

He destroyed our relations with other countries, totalled our UN relations, Attacked a country with false evidence, REGUARDLESS OF WHETHER IT WAS UNDER THE RULE OF AN EVIL DICTATOR. Props for bringing Saddam to justice, but the evidence of WMDs was FALSE. BUSH LIED. END OF LINE.

Bush did not win the election. Gore got it by half a million votes.

If every vote counts, count every vote. You 'Pubs would have been pissed if the shoe were on the other foot.

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lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 2007-09-24 10:32 /dev/thisissparta -> /dev/null

nealo

I'm gonna try to defend Bush on these accounts. Forgive me if I suck.

-massive debt. we've been in a debt for a long time. half a trillion isn't half bad considering it's been like that for just about forever.

-those prisoners are not U.S. citizens and are therefore not entitled to our rights. yes they may be mistreated then again maybe they arent. who knows?

-enron...blah. you win this one. im not really familiar with that issue.

-ditto

-the u.s. couldnt sit on their asses allowing such violence in iraq to continue. thinking back to the ww2 era. the u.s. waited and waited for hitler to just stop. 6 million dead jewish people later, and an attack on pearl habor before they decided to enter into war. why wait for worse to come.

-saddam did have wmd. its a fact. the u.s. gave the weapons to them during the cold war (?). the action now is to find out where/who saddam gave the wmd to.

-Bush did win the election. The original founders of the constitution set up the Electoral college. This was set to settle the debate between the popular vote and votes of the elite. some wanted a direct election, while others wanted a selected few to select the president. they settled with the electoral college in which every vote would count towards the states electoral votes. this is the way it was set up, who's to say it's wrong.

-I did the best I could. I'm still learning. I'm not here to critisize.

__________________
Hiiiiiii

Slammed89Integra

If I recall correctly, if nader drawed 1 electoral vote, then the election would have gone to the Senate and House. I also heard from my AP US History teacher, that if nader hadn't ran, Gore would have won much easier. Not sure the logic, but yeah. I know he won a few votes, that probably would have gone to gore.

nealo

Yeah. thats true. Ralph Nader, member of the green party, was an extreme liberal. He did take away many votes from Gore, presumably costing Gore the election.

94RedSiGal

Silverchild79- Interesting thread. I was wondering where you got all of these numbers from? Your source(s)? That's a huge list. Good if it's all true, but still won't be voting for Bush in the next election.

92b16vx

Wow, you thought of five things that a guy who is in charge of the most powerful nation in the world did wrong. I bet you make more mistakes in a single day.

1. No president stops spend money dumbass, that's what nations do. We have been in debt forever, but we still aren't as far in relative debt as most countires.

2. Sorry terrorist don't deserve rights, and security is more important than, making sure terrorist are treated well.

3. Who cares

4. Corruption in the oil industry has been around a lot longer than Bush has, don't expect that one man is going to do shit about that.

5. Destroyed relations with who, France, Germany who cares, or maybe you mean the countries that are kissing our ass's now so they can make a few billion getting the contracts to clean up Iraq, fuck em. And the UN is useless anyway, they couldn't wipe their own ass without help, not to mention they are about as corrupt as any corporation.

6. Who's the president, Bush right, so I guess he did win.

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Tonyd0821

pissedoffsol

Havok

now I hate to hijack my own thread but serious I have a hard time understanding this. Why don't you like Bush? What has he failed to do. He has revived the economy, reformed medicare, the War in Iraq was a resounding, although ongoing, success. Yes he has failed so far to prove that there were WMD in Iraq but look at the list of things he has done with this war. People always bitch about the WMD thing but I haven't heard ANYONE outside myself claim that the war was a success because we liberated millions of people from a terrible dictator. Since when did we as a people become so selfish that this becomes a sencond tier justification?

Seriously mang where's the beef? You don't really still want that pussy Gore in there do you? [/b][/quote]
Wheres the weapons of masss destruction?! He has YET to find those, the whole reason he started this shit.

after 7 months of searching, we finally caught...the man that hadnothing do to wih 9/11.

and brian that pic rocks hahah.

__________________
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and with glowing pride I'll wear my scars.
I'm honored by your hatred!

She wanted love, I taste of blood.
She bit my lip and drank my warmth from years before.

smooth_criminal

Wheres the weapons of masss destruction?! He has YET to find those, the whole reason he started this shit.

after 7 months of searching, we finally caught...the man that hadnothing do to wih 9/11.

and brian that pic rocks hahah. [/b][/quote]
Did you not see or hear about the 300,000 + graves that were found of people that had been gassed, with the chemical bombs he was setting off on his own people. Did you not hear the horror stories about him wiping out whole towns just to see if his new chemical worked?

How much more proof do you people need? He may have not had WMD when we attacked but he had them at one point in time and he never said he wouldn't do it again, Did any of you ever watch with Barbara Walters interview back in the early 90’s when he stated that Hitler was the greatest leader the world has ever know, And he would only be so lucky to follow in his foot steps?

Read the Fuck up people, Wake the fuck up. Have you ever personally been in a firefight 4,000 miles from home? Had you ever been the minority by 1500 to 1? Have you ever look over a bunker and watched 4 of you friends and 35 hostels wiped out in a blink of an eye? Have you seen the horror face to face of little kids under the age of 8 only knowing fear and anger, That haven't eating in weeks and will have NO CHOICE about what they become in life? For all of you that answer NO you have no right to debate about bush doing the right thing. You don't have to like the guy but good dam nit bush made the best choice that was available, He saved the life of millions of people, and the life’s of millions to come, And he is protecting US,

God bless Iraq,
And let god continue to bless AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

__________________
You hate me because i'm different;
I hate you because your all the same!
G-Driver.

94RedSiGal

STFU about this God crap. Stupid talk like this will keep the Middle East crazies targeting us. Keep church and state separate in the US. Bush was stupid for saying to the troops that God is with us. No he's not. This is NOT some holy war.

There are many organized religions. Christianity is not the only one. And then there are some, like me, who don't believe in God. Saddam was an evil man who needed to be deposed, religion had nothing to do with it. As Bush used WOD as the sole reason for invading Iraq, he will continued to be criticized about that until WOD are found in Iraq.

In life, the lesson here is "choose your words wisely".... <_<

__________________
&quot;When the going gets weird, the Weird turn pro.&quot; - Hunter S. Thompson
<a href=\'http://www.prebmw.com/clubsi/patwtf.jpg\' target=\'_blank\'>The sheer insanity that is Texas</a>
<span style=\'font-size:7pt;line-height:100%\'>94 Milano Red Civic Si original SOHC engine 330K miles w/JDM LSD tranny, DC 4-2-1 header, ES poly engine mounts, OEM exhaust... tuned on a dyno w/Crome software by nfn15037 to 126 whp with 93 octane!!!

94 Stealth Grey Pearl GS-R Sedan 221K miles w/LSD
93 White DX Hatchback 145K miles... future rallycar
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<div class=\'quotetop\'>QUOTE(pissedoffs ol @ Mar 21 2004, 05:00 PM)</div><div class=\'quotemain\'> women + wheels = bad </div>

Wycked Sniper

If you do not beleive in God, how do you know that he's not with us? You have every right in the world to have your beliefs. My only question is how can you tell someone that God is not with them all the while beleiving that there is no God. I personally do not beleive that anyone has turned the Iraq war into a religious or holy war. If the thought that God is above and somehow watching out for you makes someone get through the day a little easier, what's the problem with it?

Who's to say that "God bless Iraq and let God continue to bless America" was an unwise choice of words? It was simply smooth_criminal's closing statement as to his beliefs. There was no malice. Once again, just my .02....and regardless of your atheism, I'll close with a God Bless you, simply because it makes me feel better.

__________________
&quot;Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6&quot;

2000Si

hahahahaha I love that picture

2000Si

and this one is even better. LMAO

Guy

Wow, you thought of five things that a guy who is in charge of the most powerful nation in the world did wrong. I bet you make more mistakes in a single day.

1. No president stops spend money dumbass, that's what nations do. We have been in debt forever, but we still aren't as far in relative debt as most countires.

2. Sorry terrorist don't deserve rights, and security is more important than, making sure terrorist are treated well.

3. Who cares

4. Corruption in the oil industry has been around a lot longer than Bush has, don't expect that one man is going to do shit about that.

5. Destroyed relations with who, France, Germany who cares, or maybe you mean the countries that are kissing our ass's now so they can make a few billion getting the contracts to clean up Iraq, fuck em. And the UN is useless anyway, they couldn't wipe their own ass without help, not to mention they are about as corrupt as any corporation.

6. Who's the president, Bush right, so I guess he did win.[/b][/quote]
1. True the US is and has been in debt but when you take a budget surplus, that could have been used to help pay off the national debt, and squander it on nonsensical tax rebatesone can only ask what is going through his mind.

2. If we deny these people, terrorists or not, the basic rights allocated to them in the geneva convention, a document which we agreed to abide by, then we are no better than any other dictatorship in the world. Think of it this way, the Geneva convention also protects American troops in other countries if they happen to become POWs (provided that country signed the pact as well). If we don't have that, we cease to stop acting with some humanity and become lower than animals. A strict code of conduct is needed because it is exactly that which seperates the US from other dictatorships.

3. Who cares that the president is covering for his friend who screwed thousands of hard working Americans of their jobs as well as their retirements? I should hope that you and everyone else does, these were people who worked for what they had, and all the money and time they invested was ruined by a small greedy group of people. The fact that Bush protects these people who deny americans that which they have earned is nothing short of a travesty. You dont care? maybe you would if it was your retirement that went out the window.

4. Oil corruption has been around since about its inception, but that doesnt mean that this illegitamite president should be helping them out. I mean the no-bid contracts halliburton got are clear signs of bush's only interests, which are simply helping out his big business friends which by the way circumvents the notion of free market, and also costs our government more money.

5. The UN as an independant coalition serves a purpose, and that is to prevent tragedies like world war II. The UN's function is to settle problems before they come to war, and if you cant appreciate that function i really dont know what to tell you. The US being in good standnig with other countries is important, because if tragedy on a massive scale happens it is these countries who will be offering assistance.

6. following that logic if someone stole your car it would be theirs because they are in it and not you. are you ok with that?

__________________
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1990 Mazda Miata
1992 Nissan NX2000
1995 Ford Mustang Cobra
2005 Toyota Prius

smooth_criminal

STFU about this God crap. Stupid talk like this will keep the Middle East crazies targeting us. Keep church and state separate in the US. Bush was stupid for saying to the troops that God is with us. No he's not. This is NOT some holy war.

There are many organized religions. Christianity is not the only one. And then there are some, like me, who don't believe in God. Saddam was an evil man who needed to be deposed, religion had nothing to do with it. As Bush used WOD as the sole reason for invading Iraq, he will continued to be criticized about that until WOD are found in Iraq.

In life, the lesson here is "choose your words wisely".... <_< [/b][/quote]
Lets look at your ignorance for a minute. I never said Jesus did I? I said God!! I never specified which religion he belonged to. How retarded do people sound when they say holy war, thats one of the biggest oxy morons I’ve ever heard, And if your so against God and the speaking of him and you feel so offended why do you send the money with IN GOD WE TRUST on it. Every courthouse, federal document, dollar and coin printed in the USA has this printed on it. I never understood people that only post because they have something negative to say or want to bitch about something. So please don't try and flame me, I did nothing to attack you or anyone on this board, or there beliefs. So until you have served your country in active duty i think you should shut your hole and show a little respect to the people that keep this nation free.

__________________
You hate me because i'm different;
I hate you because your all the same!
G-Driver.

Guy

Well then, what exactly did you mean in saying God bless Iraq, and let god continue to bless America? Please fill us in.





Also plenty of the stuff on this list are just things we destroyed under false pretenses, so isnt it out job to repair it? You know, instead of destroying and repairing these peoples stuff, why dont we help defenseless and starving people out in Africa? A place where little girls are forced into positions as sex slaves. Of course I know why we dont. With the exception of the kurds these people who were beaten tortured and murdered were people who were against the baathist party. These people knew what would happen if they vocalised their opinions and in knowing they have to take on responsibility for their actions. Make no mistake, I am not condoning Saddam's actions but simply stating that the people who were beaten/tortured spoke out of their own volition and had to have known the consequences. That being said did any of you know that Saddam did not persecute christians? He was more than ok with them, which is a far cry to how Iraqs soon to be theocracy will treat them. Women who Enjoyed numerous rights under Saddam's "regime" will soon be denied any rights at all when Iraqs Islamic government takes hold.

__________________
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1990 Mazda Miata
1992 Nissan NX2000
1995 Ford Mustang Cobra
2005 Toyota Prius

92b16vx

Still a moot point.

Maybe you need to have some family members killed by these kind of people, or spend some time as a POW yourself before you touting that kind of sentimental shit for those fucks.

Don't you just love capitalism? Enron, nor hardly any major corporations and their scams affect me, or how I live, so yes maybe I should care because one day it might, but right now, I could careless.

There are sooo many other things to worry about that this, which as said before doesn't affect me. I'm sorry you got left behind by big business, and are bitter you're not making billions.

Like I said, another usless corrupt organization, that does nothing but further their own agenda. And to tell you the truth, they worry me more than Enron or Bush's oil madness, as they should you and everyother freedom loving person on earth.

My car was not given to me by a large number of people, nor are there whole legislative branch's that were created to work in conjunction with it. So, no it isn't even close to the same thing, you gotta come up with a better one than that.

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