180-200 whp - turbo or swap?

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Matts96HB said:
My b18b says otherwise :)

+1 for turboing the D-Series though.

I really wish I would have done that in the first place.
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unless you have a super built n/a b18b or turbo. s/c or nos you dont have torque
 
:werd: I've had 3 b18b1's in my 3 hatches, there's no real torque with the stock LS.
 
AHHVTEC said:
unless you have a super built n/a b18b or turbo. s/c or nos you dont have torque
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MMM I have the b16 tranny.. Low/Mid range is nice.

And yes I know a tranny doesnt add torque or power or anything, but the gearing definately does help the pull.

If I had a stock LS tranny it'd be slow as shit.
 
LS + LS tranny + stripped down EG coupe = not slow. Non-vtec D15 + 2500 lb car = slow. For the record though, it is not as torquey as people report. I mean, I can power up a hill on the highway in 5th, but, it's not like, pull-a-house-down torquey...
 
Thank you for the feedback everybody.

Blanco said:
Hahaha. I see that my reputation precedes me. :D

For $1500-2000 you can easily hit your goal with your stock engine. Make sure it's healthy and if it is you can put a turbo on it, tune it, and have fun. Any B-Series will cost you around $600-1000 just to drop in, in stock form. You can use that to rebuild your Z6. However, if you don't feel comfortable swapping an engine I don't think you'll be anywhere near comfortable rebuilding an engine.

You won't get 8500rpm out of a D16 without serious and seriously expensive head modifications. With their 90mm stroke these engines provide strong low and midrange power. You can make the same power at a lower RPM and your engine will be that much more reliable because of it.
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That price is very nice ($2000). I used incorrect terminology obviously; by rebuilding I meant replacing all the wear parts, belts, installing lighter pullies etc., not actually tearing down the block and rebuilding the valve train or whatever.

My rpm goal was set by looking at my tach and deciding that I want to rev it into red without worrying about blowing anything up, so if it's unrealistic that's ok. How exactly do you "build bottom end"? Is that where port & polish, boring and I/H/E come into play?


AHHVTEC said:
ahh hell man if your doing a rebuild your good to go, just get better rods and you can go for 200+
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Perfect. A rebuild isn't what I thought it was though, what exactly gets done when you rebuild an engine? And do I remove the engine myself, or is it kind of like a drop the car off and come back deal?

My main concern is building a reliable, fast, clean engine. I don't want to fuck around trying to fix it and I can't have it breaking down or overheating, I work 28-31 days a month and I have no time to deal with that shit.

I've heard people mentioning rods, head studs, block sleeving / guards, high flow radiators etc. - my bad if I'm being ignorant here but what all would I need? I've been trying to read through turbod16.com but I don't have time to do the research on how big the turbo will need to be and what kind of reinforcement I will need to do to the engine. Tomorrow I'm out for another 40-50 days and I'd like to have the info and get all this underway on my next day off.
 
Blanco said:
Wow, you are a newbie. (no offense meant.)

There are two main parts to an engine, the cylinder head and the block. The ports are how fresh air enters the cylinder head, into the cylinders, and then back out of the head. A port and polish job opens the ports up to create different air flow characteristics and the polish smooths out the exhaust ports so carbon buildup has a harder time building up.

Building the block means taking the head off of and then replacing the stock cast pistons and connecting rods with forged aftermarket units. Further you can replace the actual cylinder sleeves, the crankshaft, oil pan and pretty much anything else. Rebuilding the block would be installing new piston rings, new connecting rod and main bearings, along with new gaskets and seals...possibly new pistons and over-boring the cylinders to ensure that they're perfectly round. What you're talking about is a major tune-up and is an excellent idea.

I/H/E are intake/header/exhaust and what they do is allow your engine to breathe easier. Imagine trying to run while breathing through a straw. That's how your engine is right now. Put the intake on and it's like you're able to inhale with your mouth but still have to exhale through the straw. The header and exhaust finish the analogy. Furthermore, a well designed header will not only have larger diameter piping but its design will help the scavenging effect that will pull the spent charge (exhaust) out of the engine more quickly and thus pull the fresh intake charge in quicker.

This is a good article to get you familiar with the process: Howstuffworks "Internal Combustion"

That said, I recommend you buy either a GReddy or Edelbrock turbo kit along with a Walbro 255lph fuel pump and call it a day. Let those guys do the thinking for you since you barely have time to breathe, yourself. Those kits are designed to be used on a completely stock engine with a completely stock cooling system. Upgrading wouldn't be a bad idea, but it's not really necessary. Beyond that I do recommend that you find someone who can tune your ECU with Crome instead of using the supplied FMU (fuel management unit) that comes with either kit. The engine will make more and smoother power along with being more reliable for it.

Edelbrock.com | Edelbrock Sport Compact - TURBOS - Performer X
Greddy Bolt On Turbo Kits - GReddy Turbo Kits
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No offense taken, before November of last year I didn't even know how to change my own oil. Thank you for getting me all the info before the night is out and for explaining the acronyms, it's a pain tabbing back and forth between google and the forums whenever I don't recognize something.

A kit sounds like a good plan, I'll have to look into that.
 
LightWeightChamp said:
yep! but he says he dosnt mind spending cash, and there is only so much you can do with a d, and with k series coming up fast b series is getting cheaper by the day!
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werd

LightWeightChamp said:
true, if he wont go b, the turbo the d right fully built head, block, then hes got room to work with when he has more $$ like bigger turbo, and could make 300+
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huh?

92civicb18b1 said:
His goal is extremely feasible with the D series, the turbo D will also have nice all around power, with a correctly sized turbo, minimal lag as well. With his reasonable HP goal he also will have decent driveability.

.
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yeah dude, a small turbo is way awesomer than a big one. And that d will way have some torque on a N/A motor

AHHVTEC said:
trannys do help gear wise, but theres still no torque
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but theres is torque multiplication

LS motors on short trannys are way fun.
 
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92civicb18b1 said:
Sorry lightweightchamp, you have ideas/opinion and input.......they're just poor and thoughtless.

Your mind is in Bling city, you're picking a motor for the Type Rness. The motor in itself isn't anything too spectacular. A GSR or poor man's C5 are much better choices if he was going the swap route.

His goal is extremely feasible with the D series, the turbo D will also have nice all around power, with a correctly sized turbo, minimal lag as well. With his reasonable HP goal he also will have decent driveability.

I have plenty of knowledge on both routes, but my opinion would be to rebuild and turbo the D
.
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i get what your saying, im not stuck in the R-ness, they are just great motors, thats why they were put in the highest performing model at the time, yes depwnding on my position i would more then likely go with the turbo d, but if he has the $$ hes gonna be more happy with a b in the end.

Now, for turboing the d, i would build the whole thing from theground p, if you have the money dont waste your time with a log mani, in the end they will never make as much power as a equal length, also sleving the blockhas been proven to oval out your cylinders, if your motor is gonna pop it will pop weather you have sleves or not, i wopuldnt waste my time with those either, thats my input
 
EvoTec1 said:
but theres is torque multiplication

LS motors on short trannys are way fun.
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ya until you have to do a road trip, let me tell you driving 1hour + at 4k+ rpms is not fun what so ever, good by gas, good buy being able to hear the radio/passengers, i hate my trans so much, anyone want it?.... :confused:
 
EvoTec said:
LightWeightChamp said:
yep! but he says he dosnt mind spending cash, and there is only so much you can do with a d, and with k series coming up fast b series is getting cheaper by the day!
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werd
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Yes, but I also mentioned two things: A very specific power goal, and that I would like to use the most economical option. From what I've heard so far b-series will give me more power than I need and cost a lot more money to do.
 
it depends, a stock type r with bolt ons and a tune will make power exactly where you want it. but turboing a d you will more then likely make more then 200, which isnt a bad thing;)
 
LightWeightChamp said:
it depends, a stock type r with bolt ons and a tune will make power exactly where you want it. but turboing a d you will more then likely make more then 200, which isnt a bad thing;)
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not true it depends on the tune, and with a bolt on b there is still no torque
 
lol its a honda, you buy it knowing you will never make a lot of torque, but yes i agree a turbo d will make more torque then a bolt on b, but what happens when you turbo the b:D
 
You end up spending a LOT more money on any of your suggested options than the original poster wants to drop into his engine.
 
i agree! k ftw! although with the k popping up pretty soon b will be at the prices the d is now. i cant wait!
 
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