'90 Civic HB DX Mini-Me

[blink182house]

Alright, so my buddy is getting me to do a mini-me swap on my 1990 Civic HB DX (1.5l D15b2 engine) and told me I need to buy a head from a D16Z6 and the ECU. Well, other than the head and the gaskets what else will I need? Do I need a new intake manifold and exhaust? How about new belts? Please, if anyone can list all parts that I'll need to pick up.

 

[ryan89crx]

you will need an obd0-obd1 conversion harness, you will have to convert to mpfi, if the head does not come with intake mani, you will need that along with the injectors, and change your timing belt. always use the belt that goes with the head you are using.
another good thing to do to feel the power gains is to switch to an si tranny. way better gearing than the dx

 

[blink182house]

Yeah, I found a couple ebay auctions with the harness, and my friend told me we can find the diagrams online on how to do our own conversion if we can't buy one... what's MPFI?

I know to get the intake mani., injectors, distributor, ecu, and all the gaskets.

My friend said I'd need a new diagram to rewire, or an adapter of some sort, for the ECU... is this true? Where can I find that?

Didn't know about the timing belt, any reliable and cheaper sites I can get one? I would like to get a red one if possible.

Also, my speedometer isn't calibrated correctly... We've changed clusters to see if it was the plastic gears in it, and it did the same thing... we pulled the end of the cable that goes into the tranni itself out and it has all it's teeth too, so my dad suspects that it's the gears inside the transmission that are missing a tooth or two... so looks like I'll need a new tranni anyways (a speedo is a requirement for my dad, to work). So I'll definately keep a lookout for the Si tranni at local junkyards.

 

[formby]

tell your dad not to help...have any of you ever worked on a car?

 

[blink182house]

Hmm... let me just say screw you for that comment about my dad because he's extremely experienced with cars.

My dad has been working on cars on his own since age 16, and is now 50. He completely restores cars from rust buckets that don't run, to new cars... which means he specializes in motor swaps, motor work, body work, and electonics. My dad has worked on Honda's, VW's, Chevy's, Ford's, and tons of other cars in his life and I'm sure has quite a few more years on engines than you do.

Sorry to blow up on you if you're just trying to help, but insulting my father and even myself is just crossing the line.

Honestly this will be my first major engine job, but I've helped on many other engine rebuilds and swaps before... but I'm trying to figure this one out on my own, and do most of it myself (with my father and friend who is a honda guru watching my back to make sure I dont make any mistakes).

 

[reckedracing]

whoa, slow your roll N00B

if you dad is the alimighty god himself then why aren;t you asking him what conversion harness you need, or what parts you need...
and a red timing belt? what in the holy hell???
i smell.... riiiiccceeee

the converter your friend is talking about is to go from OBD0 to OBD1
your car = obd0 the z6 head is obd1, and you need an obd1 p28 to run the vtec and fueling correctly...

check jdmshit.com, when i was looking up prices that was the place that sold it the cheapest online...

MPFI is MULTI POINT FUEL INJECTION
as compared to DPFI which is dual point
the z6 head requires MPFI, this is a whole wiring cluster fuck by itself, i recommend you do this conversion first if you need to do it... that way if shit don't run right you know its not a vtec/p28/obd0->obd1 issue

and just so you know, motor swaps are not for your normal mechanic, there is a lot of compatability issues, as well as wiring issues out the ass, so be aware that your old man or your friend may not have all the answers, and if they do, they very well could be the wrong answers

this swap adds up to a LOT of money with gaskets, the head, intake mani, conversion harness, etc etc etc so make sure you get all the prices down before you start, you may find a cheaper better alternative... for example a twin cam zc swap...

and what do you mean that your speedo is off? can i ask what size tire you're running? does the speedo work? is it a constant misread or does it fluctuate...

oh, and before you go posting more ridiculous questions i advise you SEARCH this site, or at least read some more on this site, ALL OF YOUR QUESTIONS HAVE ALREADY BEEN ANSWERED BEFORE for someone else in the same position as you... its annoying to retype these answers over and over again...

 

[blink182house]

Thanks. My old man is almighty to me, but I'm trying to tackle this on with him just looking over my shoulder to make sure i dont fuck up, not directing my every move. My otehr friend, he's doing a b16 swap, and is so far successful so I trust his word, but I know nobody knows everything.

The red belt, I was just going to match that with some other little red dress ups just to sprooce things up a bit, the exterior of my car is staying the same (no rice there)... i cant be drawing attention of cops.

My rims are the stock rims.

I know i need the p28 ecu now, but other than getting it will I need to rewire anything to make it work?

I'm just trying to gain as much info on it now as possible for any errors I may run into.

Also, i know swaps take a lot of trouble shooting and thinking out, and time. This is not my every-day driver right now, I've decided to continue driving my POS toyota tercel for now and keep this one parked so I can work on it and do the job right without rushing.

Thanks for your help, and yes I did try searching. Let's please stop the n00b bashing.

 

[reckedracing]

you know the little timing belt cover? yea, thats there for a reason, i dunno about you but its not really a great idea to have dirt and shit going by the most important belt keeping mr psiton from ass ramming mr valve...
but whatever floats your boat... i would prefer a QUALITY belt as opposed to a red one...


keeping your honda parked to take your time gets an A+ from me, smart thinking there

and yes, there will be wiring issues after you have the P28...
just so you know, you have three choices for fuel and vtec managment...
the first would be a vtec controller, prob the cheapest solution to your problem, but you should still need to upgrade to MPFI if your car is not equiped, and you should run an SI ecu along with the vtec controller... just my opinion

your second option is to get a pr3 or pw0, these are both OBD0 vtec enabled ecu's but they are strictly jdm and will run you about 350 last time i checked...
to run this ecu you would only need to convert to MPFI if needed, and then run your vtec wires and such... OBD0 injectors and distributors would be needed...

your third option and probably the most reliable, or closest to stock would be the OBD0->OBD1 converter, running a P28 ecu, with OBD1 engine electronics such as injectors and distributor, you will also need to run the various wires for vtec and such...

you need to think of it this way, your car didn;t have vtec, it was never even equipped with the wires for it, so you need to make your cars wiring resemble the wiring of a 92-95 civic's with vtec...
pinouts and wire diagrams will help you a lot, just see whats diffrent between the two diagrams and you'll see what wires you need to change or add...

again, i would advise you look into the costs of this project, a mini me should net you about 130 horses, i have heard as much as 135 perhaps...
and for this increase you need a vtec head, injectors, dist, intake mani, whole head gasket set, timing belt, water pump since its apart, conversion harness, ecu, and wiring... all this to reach 135...

a twin cam zc, or a twin cam D16A8 or D16A9 has 140 horse i think... in stock form... this swap might end up being cheaper in the long run...

check your options and figure HP vs cost...
unless you are a vtec junkie and just need that Z6 head...

 

[jginter]

There is a easier way than converting to obd1.
Parts Needed are
88-91 civic si-intake manifold,injectors,injector resistor box,pm6 ecu, distributor(will hve to be modified)
im pretty sure the dx exhaust manifold will bolt up to the z6 head also you will need an msd rpm activated switch to activate vtec. Also i suggest switching to an si tranny to for performance reasons
if there is anything else i am missing please correct me

 

[reckedracing]

There is a easier way than converting to obd1.
Parts Needed are
88-91 civic si-intake manifold,injectors,injector resistor box,pm6 ecu, distributor(will hve to be modified)
im pretty sure the dx exhaust manifold will bolt up to the z6 head also you will need an msd rpm activated switch to activate vtec. Also i suggest switching to an si tranny to for performance reasons
if there is anything else i am missing please correct me

thats some ghetto shit right there, but it would work...

one HUGE problem though... how would you suggest adjusting the fuel maps for when vtec kicks in...? your idea would activate vtec but then you'd be running lean with the extra air flow...

 

[jginter]

it is ghetto,im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map, there is also an even more ghetto way by wiring it through an auto gage monster tach.

 

[reckedracing]

it is ghetto,im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map, there is also an even more ghetto way by wiring it through an auto gage monster tach.

thats basically the same thing there bub...
vtec engagement only requires a 12v feed, you could hook up a manual switch if you wanted, but this will NOT correct your fuel maps...

im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map

that is the most RETARDED thing i have ever heard, i think you lack the theory or the basic concepts behind what an ecu does...

a FPR could possibly be used to make sure you don't run lean in vtec, but then you're running rich when nonvtec, i would advise you to find a better method than this hack job...

 

[blink182house]

My friend did this head swap on his 91 dx and said it will run around $400 to maybe $500 give or a take a few bucks. I understand what you're saying I'll have to rewire my car for vtec, but I'm up for the challenge. Any guides online to help, or am I just going to have to ask my honda buddy to do it for me?

Thanks for all your help, you've really helped, thanks for the educated answers! THANKS!

 

[hcivic.com]

Originally posted by jginter+Jan 14 2005, 09:12 AM-->

it is ghetto,im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map, there is also an even more ghetto way by wiring it through an auto gage monster tach.

[post=445570]Quoted post[/post]​

Originally posted by reckedracing@Jan 14 2005, 09:29 AM

it is ghetto,im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map, there is also an even more ghetto way by wiring it through an auto gage monster tach.

thats basically the same thing there bub...
vtec engagement only requires a 12v feed, you could hook up a manual switch if you wanted, but this will NOT correct your fuel maps...

im not sure but im pretty sure the rpm activated switch corrects the fuel map

that is the most RETARDED thing i have ever heard, i think you lack the theory or the basic concepts behind what an ecu does...

a FPR could possibly be used to make sure you don't run lean in vtec, but then you're running rich when nonvtec, i would advise you to find a better method than this hack job...

[post=445576]Quoted post[/post]​

Airjockie@Jan 14 2005, 11:16 AM
I think mother nature went on strike.....


IT was nice and warm this morning...then it rained all day...and now it's friggen snowing again outside...


and the garage is leaking

[post=445653]Quoted post[/post]​

well the rpm activated switch is a good solution but then you would need to chip the pm6 to acomidate the extra fuel.

 

[reckedracing]

lol, nice quotes...

if there's not a write up on here in the refrence section, then try to google for it, they are everywhere

or search the civic forums aways back, i;m sure you will find it