A Good Debate On Street Racing Crash In Ca

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Negligence doesn't = intent.

I don't think any court would declare 2nd degree murder. Say if you're just speeding at 10-15mph over the speed limit. If someone cut in front of you and you hit and killed them, you wouldn't be tried for 2nd murder just because you made the decision to speed.
 
I don't know. But what I do know, is about a year ago in Ocala, Florida a kid was street racing someother kid, a car pulled out infront of him, both of the passengers in the car being hit were killed. The two people in the car were his mother, and mother's friend. He was charched with manslaughter. I don't think it's right, if you break the law and someone dies, 2nd Degree. Speed and kill someone, drink and drive, buy a gun and shoot someone, it's all the same.
 
this happened in my town a couple of years ago. an turbo II RX-7 was smoking a 5.0 mustang on the bottle and a girl pulled out from a stop and the mustang hit her, killing her instantly. Both of them got manslaughter. The guy with the rx-7 still races now in a AWD Talon, even on probation. The worst part is that for 2 years after the accident, every police officer was told that everyone 16-25 who drives an import races, and therfore is guilty of manslaughter. It has died down now though.
 
Originally posted by TRuggiero_@May 17 2003, 09:06 PM
2nd Degree. Speed and kill someone, drink and drive, buy a gun and shoot someone, it's all the same.

Dude,in no way is it the same.If I buy I gun and go shoot someone,that is aforethought and malice.If I have one and someone breaks into my house,and I blow thier head off,that is self defense.You CAN NOT get me to believe that you have never pushed the limits,whether in a race or on your own in your car for fun,and what if some dumbass had pulled out in front of you and when you hit them,they died.GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!Sorry,but it is manslaughter,no,ifs ands,or buts.
 
Both drivers are at 100% fault in the situation. If someone tries to race you, and you respond by racing, you both now share 100% fault of whatever happens from that point on. If the 2 cars had started 100 feet further back, the other car may have hit the saturn. It was complete chance that that the one guy hit it. When you race someone, you intend to win, if you tell me you've never responded to someone pulling in front of you, cuting you off, or trying race you... you are lieing. You may not know it, but dont pull a holyier that thou routine and say it wouldnt have been you, because honestly, it probably woundnt have been you, but it could have. When someone drinks and drives, there judgment is badly impared, people all have different physiological reactions to alcohol so you cant really know what they're experienceing that made them drive. Granted its usually stupidity or ignorance, but not always. Realistically, If i was on the jury of a DUI case, i could only convict guilty for a repeat offender. The STATE sells the liquor! Then they punish people for a product they supply, seems like a bit of a scam. Again, im not saying drinking and driving is good, so dont think that. As for this case, manslaughter, clearly. Its the letter of the law, if you somehow are speeding and someone pulls out in front of you while your looking at the cd player and changing the cd, oh and you were speeding a bit too...would you say 2nd degree. Im sure ya wouldnt. As for this being a letter of the law case, that is usually not true. Prosecuters are out to make a name for themselves. Ive been to court, tried and the whole deal. They want blood, cause it looks good on their resume, but they will relent usually. This happens all the time sadly, just this time, they went for blood right off to make an example of this person who made a a very VERY stupid judgement call, and now someone has paid for it with a life.
 
vehicular manslaughter...
they're being charged with second degree because in Cali the law hates street racers and especially in SoCal...
what the D.A is doing is making an example out of them -- he or she (the D.A) is sending a message to street racers...
this is how the justice system works... i hope those guys won't go down for Murder 2 because that was an accident... it wasn't planned...
i know the law and as it stated the D.A is makin an example out of them...
Fuck D.A's and Cops... they're all brain washed by they're fuckin training and...
i had my share with dealin wit cops and D.A's and this is how i know...
you see, the D.A knows that what they did doesn't classify as murder two but this is his chance to send a message and why not use these guys to do it...
 
Originally posted by tripple sik@May 18 2003, 07:53 PM

what the D.A is doing is making an example out of them -- he or she (the D.A) is sending a message to street racers...

Bad call,if they stick with,they are going to lose and get it reduced anyway,then look like a fool.Even an incompetent lawer could get them, out of it.
 
And I thought karnash wouldn't be able to stay out of this one. :)

karnash, what do you think and why?

Personally I think manslaughter because there is no way to prove intent. What they did was collosally(sp?) stupid, but not premeditated. This case does not even fit the intent of the law in regards to murder 2, much less the letter of the law.
 
knowing our judicial system, these guys will get a slap on the wrist...like 2 years probation or something...and then they will be back to their stupid racing during the day...fucktards man, who the hell races during the day? If i could change the law, i would make those retards live with the family of the victim just to make them feel so guilty that they straighten up their lives and then send them to prison for 5 years so they can get an ass raping....
 
Originally posted by lsvtec@May 18 2003, 03:40 PM
And I thought karnash wouldn't be able to stay out of this one. :)

:lol:
i was thinking the same thing

personally, i don't give a shit, cuz it doesn't involve me or anyone i know :ph34r:
 
Just to clear things up,
1st degree = Premeditated
2nd degree = spur of the moment.... example: catch your wife cheating and without thinking, you grab your gun and kill her and the guy. NO premeditation, whoever said that was wrong!!!

manslaughter = you were breaking a law and ended up killing someone through your own neglegence. no malice and forethought.

voluntary manslaughter: you get in a barfight and the guy you end up fighting with, falls down, hits his head on something and dies.

involuntary: drunk driving, street racing, or something that causes the accidental death of another...

The DA can charge anyone with anything they want, what sticks in court is another story... When all is said and done, they will be found guilty of involuntary manslaughter at most.
 
If it was my son or daughter killed because of some kid racing... I'd pushing for manslaughter.. Its diffrent when it hits home.. thats why they have drag stips..
 
I think it is funny that all the mods are pushing for 2nd degree, and all the street racers are pulling for a slap on the wrist. This has nothing to do with the racing accident that happened this weekend with the prelude does it? I can barely keep up with all the "street racing" accidents. And when is 87 mph stupid and negligent? I do 95 on the way to work... :p I don't think anyone should be racing and putting other people's lives in danger, but I also think that 98% of ALL drivers are idiots. I'm sure it was the saturn's fault. How many times have you been speeding and watching that idiot about 4 cars up slowly start inching into your lane? You start screaming "NO!" and swerve into someone ELSE's lane to avoid an accident. All because not enough people are aware of thier suroundings. I'm just rambling now. I'll shut up. and if I've said it once, I've said it a hundred times... "FUCK SATURNS!" (I want a smiley that says FUCK SATURNS. Hint, Hint.)
 
the fact of the matter is
when street racing you are knowingly doing something illegal
the illegal act that you are engaged in endangers others
sure you might do it 100 times with nothing bad happening
but there is always that chance
and when something finally does happen and someone ends up losing their life
you now have to pay the price

2nd degree murder is not the right charge
its manslaughter all day
throw whatever the hell you want to in front of it (vehicular, unintentional, blah blah blah)
 
If You're committing a crime (holding up a lickher store or street racing for examples.) any deaths that occur as a result of or durring that crime, even you're accomplisses, can be charged as murder.
 
Originally posted by doofnoil@May 19 2003, 09:56 PM
If You're committing a crime (holding up a lickher store or street racing for examples.) any deaths that occur as a result of or durring that crime, even you're accomplisses, can be charged as murder.

Street racing and holding a liquor store up are two very different things... A person WILL NOT be charged with murder for street racing. That's the bottom line. If you ever read any books about laws or took any law classes, you'll understand why.
I got these definitions from my law book:

Murder: an unlawful killing of a human being with malice
Malice: a legal term that refers to the intentional doing of a wrongful act without just cause or legal excuse. In the case of homicide the term means "an intention to kill.".... do street racers intend to kill people?
Malice Aforthought: A historical term that connotes a malicous design to kill or injure.

Involuntary Manslaughter: an unintentional killing for which criminal liability is imposed but which does not constitute murder. Also, the unintentional killing of a person during the commission of a lesser unlawful act (street racing), or the killing of someone during the commission of a lawful act, which nevertheless results in an unlawful death.
 
Originally posted by doofnoil@May 19 2003, 07:56 PM
If You're committing a crime (holding up a lickher store or street racing for examples.) any deaths that occur as a result of or durring that crime, even you're accomplisses, can be charged as murder.

By your logic someone killed by a drunk driver would be charged with murder, but they never are. And I think you mean liquor, but I am not sure.
 
:lol: You haven't been there??? Lickher in the front pokeher in the back!!! :p
 
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