Another shooting... :(
- Thread starter Airjockie
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I consider myself a law abiding citizen (other than speed limits 
). I've never been to jail, hell, i've never even been in cuffs.
I have 0 desire to carry a gun with me on a day to day basis.
If there comes a time where i need to use it, chances are, the other guy already has a gun pointed at me anyway, so reaching for it is out of the question.
That, and there's too much red tape involved.
get a speeding ticket while packing, and a 15 min ordeal turns into 5 guns pointed at your head and an hour stop.... and that's if you don't get a rookie.
IMO, other than the first 2 or 3 who got shot, the rest were in a state of panic.
If anything, I think schools should teach some steven segal shit on how to properly get the fuck out of the way.
). I've never been to jail, hell, i've never even been in cuffs.I have 0 desire to carry a gun with me on a day to day basis.
If there comes a time where i need to use it, chances are, the other guy already has a gun pointed at me anyway, so reaching for it is out of the question.
That, and there's too much red tape involved.
get a speeding ticket while packing, and a 15 min ordeal turns into 5 guns pointed at your head and an hour stop.... and that's if you don't get a rookie.
IMO, other than the first 2 or 3 who got shot, the rest were in a state of panic.
If anything, I think schools should teach some steven segal shit on how to properly get the fuck out of the way.
So the reason you don't want to own a gun is because our liberal government has made it inconvenient. Hmmm.
Sounds like CT police shouldn't be allowed to carry guns. I've never had a problem in AK. You tell the officer that you have a gun, he says "ok don't take it out into the open and I won't have to shoot you" then the stop proceeds as usual. Officers up here actually tend to respect you more if carry a weapon as long as you don't have felonies/warrants.
NY state has given campus security the power of state troopers
click clack kapow
Ok now i am not normally one to chime in on things of this nature but i have to agree with steve here. If there was one other person in that campus that was "carrying" this could have ended alot better than it did. I for one think that everyone should carry a gun but it shouldn't be concealed like how it has to be in most states. For example look at texas, do you ever hear of acts of violence like this happening there no you don't why you say well that is because every body and i mean everbody walks around with a gun down there. if eveybody carried them and they were in plain sight at all times there would be less random shooting because people wouldn't be so dumb as to pop someone in the head when 20 other people around you have a gun that are gonna shoot if some one where to open fire in a public place. Cops cannot be everywhere at every moment of the day. and this is why you need to take your personal protection into your own hands.
I am very pro gun. I feel that carrying is not just about protection of ones self. You are helping to defend and protect those around you. I will try and find an article i read on why people carry. In most cases it is not about being cool. It is about the love you have for humanity. And for the comments about not being trained / prepared for carrying. I am positive there are police officers that the only time they pick up there weapon it is to qualify. Just some thing to think about.
and 
ding ding ding almost all the cops in our town are like that i wouldn't trust em to shoot beer cans off a fence post
the reason for such a high body count in this case. first 2 people killed at 7:15 am and email and phone calls were not sent out to students and teachers for a lock down of class rooms and entrance and exits to dorm rooms untill 9:30. if i were a shooter running around tring to kill people and need to go in and out of dorms and class rooms and it is all locked up, i dont think i am going to accomplish much. personally i believe the the president of this univ. is to blame... he should of had the word out of this when he knew at 7:20.
i wouldn't place the blame on the president of the school cause honestly what good would locking down the dorms and classsrooms do. the only thing it would have done was lock in the killer and he would have had more casualties if that where the case. granted steps could have been taken but the fact is they weren't. i can see it now all colleges are going to have armed guards now.
smarty009
Senior Member
well...for all they knew...it was just a confontation between a boyfriend and girlfriend leaving 2 dead...they had no idea it was aimed to be a massacre on the school...that is most likely why they kept quiet about it...but i do believe they should not have kept quiet...at least inform everyone of what happened in that dorm...then everyone could have been on their toes instead of just being sitting ducks...
Where to begin here.
The first major campus shooting happened in Texas. The gunman that took the tower and shot 11 people down with a rifle and was up there for quite awhile before he was stopped.
Don't under estimate the stupidity of the laymen. Guns won't stop crimes from happening, they'll mean that people are just that much more likely to solve their problems via force or retaliate to problems.
Sure what if someone was carrying on that campus and what if they shot and missed the gunman and killed an innocent bystander. How would the situation be then? You have to look at both sides of the coin.
The situation may have ended sooner if someone happened to be carrying a weapon but just as easily it could have ended worse. Whats the statistic about the percentage of shots missed, compared to those fired when the shooter is in a face to face situation and confronted. Its pretty damn high. Also, you have to be able to pull the gun without being seen in the first place. Too many people watch too many movies and think that they're the ultimate action hero and can save all.
I'm not anti-guns, I think they're fine when they're used to hunt with but not for protection. It scares me that a small guy like Steve carries a gun, because what would he do if a big guy were about the wail on him? The situation would then escalate to a level of life or death - which isn't a good situation and its difficult to tell how someone will act when faced with that situation.
Guns had a time and place and thats not on college campuses or in large cities, its for hunting and providing for your family not so the average schmuck that is insecure and feels the need to have a lethal weapon for protection at his or her disposal.
Someone in the VT administration is to blame.
If emails were sent out to cancel classes right when gunshots were first heard from the "gunman on the loose" (at 7:15), then all those classrooms could have possibly been empty. The delay of these important emails from the administration directly cost 30+ innocent lives.
edit: We didn't receive ANY emails of any shooting activity until 9:26... after the executions in Norris Hall had taken place and entire "massacre" was already done and over with.
But hey, it could happen anywhere, I suppose...
If emails were sent out to cancel classes right when gunshots were first heard from the "gunman on the loose" (at 7:15), then all those classrooms could have possibly been empty. The delay of these important emails from the administration directly cost 30+ innocent lives.
edit: We didn't receive ANY emails of any shooting activity until 9:26... after the executions in Norris Hall had taken place and entire "massacre" was already done and over with.
But hey, it could happen anywhere, I suppose...
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but there is where the problem lies, your tellin me that the guy that did all this shooting had his guns for hunting purposes i didn't think so. Guns are not only for providing for you family since when was the last time that hunting was the sole means that you ate by, guns are used for anything from recreation target shooting to protection. Now i am not sayin that they belong on a school campus but the fact is they are there and they are not there so the college kids can go hunting on the weekend. and why would it scare you that steve carries a gun i am sure that if someone were about to wail on him he would not pull the gun on him but if the supposed huge guy pulled a gun on him it would be ok for him to get shot and have no way to defend himself, i think not. we can argue the fact of who should and shouldn't carry guns and how they should be used for ever and ever. the fact of the matter is it wasn't the gun who killed anybody it was some sick twisted asshole who probably never got hugged from his mother enough that killed all these people. and i don't care but even if he had no access to a gun you don't think he would have found another way to do what he did today, granted it wouldn't have been as high a number by the time he was taken down but he still would have been able to do damage without a gun.
And how long do you think he would have lasted up there had he been in an armed populace?
While I recognize your appreciation for the stupidity of the common American, this is the most ignorant statement I have heard you make. I almost stopped reading here, but I'll say this and move on:
Guns don't stop crimes? then why the fuck do the police carry them?
In addition, carrying a firearm does not make you irrational or "more likely to solve your problems via force" or to retaliate. When you have that kind of power in your posession, you realize that without respect for the consequences of using it, you can easily destroy not only your life but the lives of those around you.
And what if no one on the campus had a means to defend themselves allowing the attacker to kill as many people as he wished? O wait, that's what happened.
It definitely would have ended sooner. I can't think of a single reasonable senario where an armed student would have made the situation worse. If he missed 5 times and accidentally killed 5 innocents (extremely unlikely) before bringing the attacker down, 20 some peoples lives would still have been saved.
Obviously it varies by person based on their amount of experience and skill with their weapon.
IMO too many people's only experiences with guns are the gun bashing liberal media stories that never seem to report on the thousands of times that armed citizens prevent crimes and save lives
In my experience the mere sight of a gun makes an assailant very submissive and eager to explore more peaceful alternatives.
Sounds like someone has been watching too many action movies without any real life experience.
couldn't disagree more. It sounds cliche, but were it not for the armed citizen, this country would not exist. So the right to keep and bear arms was only meant to be temporary? How many other constitutional rights are you willing to put an expiration date on?
Sorry man, your views come from living a sheltered life in a college dorm. Live in the real world for about 5 years and make your own judgements instead of believing all the bullshit that your peers and the media have obviously been shitting all over you. You're not doin yourself any favors. Sorry if I got worked up, but I see this kind of attitude as a huge problem with the generation that is about to be running this country and it really worries me.
smarty009
Senior Member
well...i wouldnt say the admin should have shut down the school...they should have just alerted everyone about it...so they would be aware of what HAD happened. They did not know it was going to turn into a school shooting...i assume they thought it was over and done with since it was just a boyfriend/girlfriend incident...the school admin isnt the police...i highly doubt this is something that happens everyday to them...they were prollie in shock and didnt know what to do...and who knows...maybe their first thought of telling everyone is that everyone would panic...and you definitely dont want a lot of people in panic running around...
now...if they knew it wasnt over yet..then yes..they should have shut the school down so they could locate the shooter...
BLACKSBURG, Va. - A Virginia Tech senior from
South Korea was behind the massacre of at least 30 people locked inside a campus building in the deadliest shooting rampage in modern U.S. history, the university said Tuesday.
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The Virginia Tech Police Department identified him as Cho Seung-Hui, 23, a senior in the English department.
South Korea was behind the massacre of at least 30 people locked inside a campus building in the deadliest shooting rampage in modern U.S. history, the university said Tuesday.
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The Virginia Tech Police Department identified him as Cho Seung-Hui, 23, a senior in the English department.
phyregod
!!YTINASNI
Wow. You mean a white kid didnt shoot everyone up this time?
An armed populace would be bad. Someone would loose their cool and shoot someone. then there would be guns everywhere and everyone would shoot everyone. Think about it, A bunch of nervous college kids with guns.
Now, ARMED and well trained security guards could very well be the answer. Read "And well trained" again. Metal detectors wouldnt work. Unless you had one at every entrance and every window that were being monitored 24/7. You simply cannot secure a campus that size. Not possible unless you have a full on military style shake down of everyone everyone every day. There could be lots of guns already inside. And knives. You cant take kitchen knives away from college students. And those are almost as deadly in the right hands.
This guy was obviously very experienced with guns. You cant generally shoot 50 people and get 33 kill shots. Humans are very resiliant. I personally know several people who have been shot on more than one occasion and are walking, talking, perfectly fine people. This guy was placing his shots very well which hints to me that he has had training somewhere. Especially if this was a pistol. (Glock was the rumor last I heard, no idea if that is true or not) Well, I assume glock. "Asian kid dressed like a boyscout, with a plastic gun" is what the chick said.
I have had some training, and shoot regularly, and shoot very well, but I'm not certain I could walk into a classroom and pull off 30 kill shots. Not unless you were shooting like a crazy man. But from the sound clips, It sounds like he aimed every shot. This wasnt "powpowpowpowpow" It was Pow.... pow..... pow.. An ex-cap glock 9mm magazine only holds I believe 17. Well, 15 with the old mags, a +1 extender on the bottom, and a round in the chamber. Unless he had those auto-glock mags that hold 30. But those are only readily available to law-enforcement. We all know how that goes, though. Even then he had to reload several times.
As far as the "executions".. I have my doubts. Take any 10 people and put them in a line, and start executing them one by one. By the time you shoot the second person you are going to have 8 people all over you. That is what I'd like to believe, anyway. I mean, I dont know anyone who would allow that to happen. Just watch your classmates get killed like sheep. Everyone does what the gunman says, until the gunman starts shooting people. We all have a survival instinct. Its built in. Hard wired.
And the dude that posted 4 gunmen and a bomb.. I'd be willing to bet its just some random dude screwing with people on the intardnet.
An armed populace would be bad. Someone would loose their cool and shoot someone. then there would be guns everywhere and everyone would shoot everyone. Think about it, A bunch of nervous college kids with guns.
Now, ARMED and well trained security guards could very well be the answer. Read "And well trained" again. Metal detectors wouldnt work. Unless you had one at every entrance and every window that were being monitored 24/7. You simply cannot secure a campus that size. Not possible unless you have a full on military style shake down of everyone everyone every day. There could be lots of guns already inside. And knives. You cant take kitchen knives away from college students. And those are almost as deadly in the right hands.
This guy was obviously very experienced with guns. You cant generally shoot 50 people and get 33 kill shots. Humans are very resiliant. I personally know several people who have been shot on more than one occasion and are walking, talking, perfectly fine people. This guy was placing his shots very well which hints to me that he has had training somewhere. Especially if this was a pistol. (Glock was the rumor last I heard, no idea if that is true or not) Well, I assume glock. "Asian kid dressed like a boyscout, with a plastic gun" is what the chick said.
I have had some training, and shoot regularly, and shoot very well, but I'm not certain I could walk into a classroom and pull off 30 kill shots. Not unless you were shooting like a crazy man. But from the sound clips, It sounds like he aimed every shot. This wasnt "powpowpowpowpow" It was Pow.... pow..... pow.. An ex-cap glock 9mm magazine only holds I believe 17. Well, 15 with the old mags, a +1 extender on the bottom, and a round in the chamber. Unless he had those auto-glock mags that hold 30. But those are only readily available to law-enforcement. We all know how that goes, though. Even then he had to reload several times.
As far as the "executions".. I have my doubts. Take any 10 people and put them in a line, and start executing them one by one. By the time you shoot the second person you are going to have 8 people all over you. That is what I'd like to believe, anyway. I mean, I dont know anyone who would allow that to happen. Just watch your classmates get killed like sheep. Everyone does what the gunman says, until the gunman starts shooting people. We all have a survival instinct. Its built in. Hard wired.
And the dude that posted 4 gunmen and a bomb.. I'd be willing to bet its just some random dude screwing with people on the intardnet.
