B16b install in a EE8 crx vtec

[clanny]

Hi there. I am just about to purchase a B16b to install in my ukdm mk2 crx vtec. My car is running pretty well at the moment but it was too good an opportunity to pass up. The engine is the only thing that I'll be getting (well, with the inlet) but no, dizzy or ecu or loom.

I understand that the mounts will be the same. I will have to use my b16a dizzy to prevent obd conflict (I'm planning on running it with my obd0). I have also been told that I may have to use my b16a inlet and t/b for the same obd reasons (the map sensor is different?). I will have to use a b18c5 cam belt when I put it on due to the different size of the b16b (7mm higher and 7mm lower I believe). I'm hoping I can use my supersprint manifold without it contacting the bottom of the block. I have a lsd gearbox from an sir that has had the vss replaced for one from a vtec gearbox so that should work fine with my driveshafts and speedo. I have a new exedy organic clutch that I bought before I decided to buy the b16b. Will this fit the new engine/gearbox combo?

I have been reading everything I can find on b16b swaps but haven't come across the b16b into EE8 swap. Can anyone shed some light/confirm or deny any or all of the above/recommend any sites or reading material?

I am keen to find out if anyone is running obd0 with a b16b and if so, do they have a bigger intake/injectors etc? Is anything out of the ordinary?

If all goes well, I'm hoping to borrow a digital camera and post up a "how to" for the full swap and setup. We'll need to see how it goes

p.s. sorry if anyone reads this post on other forums (I'm looking for advice from anyone who has more idea than me (that'll be most of you then ))

 

[brian11to1]

Read up in Honda Tuning, they did this swap... good luck

Page 70, August 2003.

Their swap was in a 91 Si, as well...

 

[bossman032]

you can run obd0 chipped.

umm the b16b block and head are same as 97+ ITR so all parts are same.
you wrote to much I couldn't read all that.

pm me if you have any questions.

 

[clanny]

Thanks for the info guys, I'm off to google for Honda tuning. Cheers.

 

[posol]

Originally posted by clanny@Oct 20 2004, 03:15 PM
Hi there. I am just about to purchase a B16b to install in my ukdm mk2 crx vtec. My car is running pretty well at the moment but it was too good an opportunity to pass up. The engine is the only thing that I'll be getting (well, with the inlet) but no, dizzy or ecu or loom.

Neat-o

I understand that the mounts will be the same.

nope, the rear mount is different on EK's. you're going to have to use your stock b16a's rear mount

I will have to use my b16a dizzy to prevent obd conflict (I'm planning on running it with my obd0). I have also been told that I may have to use my b16a inlet and t/b for the same obd reasons (the map sensor is different?).

yup- you're going to want to use your obd0 electronics if you are using the obd0 computer. The injectors, alternator, and distrobutor must match the computer. Also, be careful, on the injectors, that you use the resistor box on your car with the obd0 injectors (peak/hold), but REMOVE it and bypass it if you use the obd2 (saturated) injectors off the b16b.
you can use either intake manifold. the map sensor's are different, and yes you need to use the obd0 map sensor (the voltages are off slightly, obd0 uses a 1.7bar, obd1/2 uses a 1.8bar map -> voltage translation table).. you CAN use the b16b intake materials, but the electronics must match. It's possible to convert the b16b intake manifold to accept the obd0 electronics. its your call. the obd0 b16a Intake will bolt right onto the head if you chose to go that way as well.

I will have to use a b18c5 cam belt when I put it on due to the different size of the b16b (7mm higher and 7mm lower I believe).

yup. the b16b deck height is equal to the b18c1/c5 motors.

I'm hoping I can use my supersprint manifold without it contacting the bottom of the block.

most b-series exhaust headers will fit both the b18/b16b deck height as well as the b16a deck height, however a couple companies make differnt parts for the two applications. consult their website to see fitament and part numbers.

I have a lsd gearbox from an sir that has had the vss replaced for one from a vtec gearbox so that should work fine with my driveshafts and speedo. I have a new exedy organic clutch that I bought before I decided to buy the b16b. Will this fit the new engine/gearbox combo?

yes to both.

I have been reading everything I can find on b16b swaps but haven't come across the b16b into EE8 swap. Can anyone shed some light/confirm or deny any or all of the above/recommend any sites or reading material?

We here in the Us have ED chassis's, but commonly refer to the whole 88-91 generation as EF's, but they are all basically the same chassis. so just keep that in mind while looking for info.

I am keen to find out if anyone is running obd0 with a b16b and if so, do they have a bigger intake/injectors etc? Is anything out of the ordinary?

its been done tons of times, b16b's, b18c5's, and so forth are in hundreds if not thousand's of obd0 cars on the streets. the stock injectors wll be more than enough for the stock motor- even using the b16a's on the b16b. they are all 240cc.

If all goes well, I'm hoping to borrow a digital camera and post up a "how to" for the full swap and setup. We'll need to see how it goes

p.s. sorry if anyone reads this post on other forums (I'm looking for advice from anyone who has more idea than me (that'll be most of you then ))

[post=405243]Quoted post[/post]​

good luck with the swap- i dont think it will be that hard. can't wait to see some pics

 

[GSRCRXsi]

if you are mating it with your stock y1 trans then the only thing you will have to change mounts wise will be the drivers side mount bracket. thats the peice that bolts to the block. the b16a one is angled, whereas the b16b one is straight. you need the b16a one so it will all bolt onto your stock mount. use your stock rear and upper tranny mounts/brackets.

 

[clanny]

Thanks for the replies guys. I was planning to us ethe stock b16a mounts but probably didn't make that very clear. It sounds too good to be true and very probably won't be as easy as it sounds. Gonna fill all my engine mounts with polyeurathane when they're out (cheaper than new mounts all round and apparently just as good). I'm now on the lookout for an engine stand and hopefully find a place that I can hire an engine lift from.

No doubt I'll be posting back up when it all goes wrong

Does anyone have any advice on other things to do while the engine is coming out (other than upgrade the mounts). Oh yeah, and what should I buy next? Hondata stage 3 or itb's? <_<

 

[GSRCRXsi]

id vote on hondata. the pr3 or pw0 ecu (dont know which one sorry lol) i dont think will run the b16b optimally. have you considered converting to obd1? it would make everything easier. you wont have to deal with dual o2 sensors, besides i dont think you can run hondata on obd0.

some ideas for long term...

ITR or GSR crank and then ITB's. it will be sick.

 

[posol]

hondata + ITB's = Sin(x).

seriously. the air/fuel curve ends up looking like a basic sin graph. Having seen my buddy Tom's setup with ITB's and hondata, he gained barely 3 whp over the JG intake, and his air fuels are just a huge wave, 12, 13, 14, 13, 12, 13, 14, 13, 12.... etc. one minor change, and the whole thing just shifts... sin(x) + 1. lol

even more so, his motor is 13.6:1 compression, 2.1L dart block, the works. putting itb's on a stock b16b is not a good choice. you will probably loose a lot of power. and look into a speed pro, accel dfi, or motec or some other full-fledged standalone.

I also would not run hondata on the obd0 ecu. it can run on the pw0/pr3, but not the new s100 or s200 systems. only the old stage 2/3/4 systems are compatible, and they are VERY obsolete. its like running windows 95 instead of xp. many changes have been made to the rom editor software.

either do an obd1 conversion (p30) and go hondata--
or just go to a full standalone now.

 

[clanny]

My pwo ecu is socketed and chipped. I have been offered a jdm b16b ecu (can't remember which one it is) as a direct swap for mine. Then all I have to do is run a knock sensor wire and my car should be running the jdm ecu. A custon chip comes with the ecu so I don't have to worry about the 112mph limiter. I'm not sure if it's obd1 or 0. My understanding is that you CAN run any of the b series on obd0 but they run better on their own obd. I guess it must be obd0 or I'd have to change the dizzy. The hondata would go in then and it would give me the option of launch control and full throttle changing along with the tuning bits and bobs too but I wasn't sure if it was worth as much (power/tuning wise) as a set of itb's which I have been offered for about twice as much as the hondata.

 

[posol]

top to bottom, obd2b, obd2a, obd1, and obd0 on the bottom

 

[posol]

just about any honda ecu will run any honda motor.

how WELL it runs it is a different story, and certain things need to match.

the obd of the ecu, distributor, and map sensor must match, either all obd0, or all obd1/2 (1 and 2 are interchangeable electronically, just use different plugs)

 

[clanny]

Originally posted by pissedoffsol@Oct 25 2004, 08:29 PM
hondata + ITB's = Sin(x).

seriously. the air/fuel curve ends up looking like a basic sin graph. Having seen my buddy Tom's setup with ITB's and hondata, he gained barely 3 whp over the JG intake, and his air fuels are just a huge wave, 12, 13, 14, 13, 12, 13, 14, 13, 12.... etc. one minor change, and the whole thing just shifts... sin(x) + 1. lol

Did he connect all the vac sensors into one accumulator to straighten out (as far as possible) the pulsing effect of all four tb's? I understand that this is a good way to run them. I am prepared to be flamed on this one 'cos I know so little about it.

thanks for the picsa nd info. I'm gonna have to look into it a bit more when it arrives but at least for now I'm aware that the mechanics are sound.

 

[clanny]

Came across this website:-

b16a/b info

It may come in useful.