1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Boost & HP Level

Discussion in 'Forced Induction' started by Turbo&Auto, Jul 28, 2006.

  1. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    I read on here a lot how you shouldnt shoot for a boost level but a power level. I've also read alot that conflicts with this though.

    Here's my question:
    There's a few boosted F22's out there making 300ish WHP. If I'm running 12psi, and I make 250whp, could I increase boost to 14-15psi to try and make 300 safely? That's not too much boost for a stock block to handle?
     
  2. phunky.buddha

    phunky.buddha Admin with a big stick Admin VIP

    Messages:
    28,465
    Likes Received:
    228
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2002
    Location:
    Dallas / Fort Worth, TX
    Nope, it's not too much boost if your block can handle the power level. Your tuning will determine everything.
     
  3. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    power breaks stuff.

    psi is simply a number, measuring the resistance of air flow getting in by the map sensor.
     
  4. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    Thanks for the info.

    I like reading about Turbo stuff a lot, the more theories you hear the better IMO.
     
  5. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
  6. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

    Messages:
    21,057
    Likes Received:
    1,180
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2002
    Location:
    NY
    lol
    :thumbsup:

    what were you shooting for B? 500 whp? or more?
     
  7. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    as much as i could on pump 93
     
  8. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    Maybe theory was the wrong word, I didnt mean it in any kind of negative way :)

    I'm going to try and run 15psi when I get the new clutch next week. A guy on another site is running a T3/T4 at 14.5psi daily and claims no issues after a bunch of miles. That had me thinking about what we're talking about here and I just wanted to hear some reasoning behind it.
     
  9. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

    Messages:
    21,057
    Likes Received:
    1,180
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2002
    Location:
    NY
    how many miles are on the motor again?
    and how many miles on the headgasket? and do you know if its a stock head gasket or not?

    once you start getting up there towards 300hp you might want to consider a 3 layer metal head gasket, new timing belt and water pump, and some arp head studs...
     
  10. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    Motor has 180K on it, new Tbelt at 120K. Original head gasket too :(

    STOP IT RECKED, you're making me second guess cranking it up :lol:
     
  11. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

    Messages:
    21,057
    Likes Received:
    1,180
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2002
    Location:
    NY
    lol, go and crank away
    they are stong motors...
    i have yet to see one thats tossed a rod
    just beware if your temps start to rise or you get white smoke...
    as long as you don't overheat or run it with water in the oil you won't hurt anything

    and if you do pop the head gasket it'll give you a reason to get a 3 layer, some ARP's, and a hondata intake manifold gasket...
    and a DIY PnP on the head too :)

    i like seeing your progress...
    i was going to start wiring the wideband etc last night but got involved with helping a friend lower an S10 so my evening was shot...
    saturday is a dedicated setup and tuning day... wooo hooo
     
  12. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    If it does pop the head gasket, I'm going to try the Aluminum High-flow intake manifold with the hondata IMG. :)
     
  13. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    you got like 8 cars. crank it up and run it till it pops :D
     
  14. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    ^You speak the truth man, what does it rly matter in the end right? ;)
     
  15. hondarin

    hondarin Please enter a value using 50 characters or fewer. VIP

    Messages:
    1,955
    Likes Received:
    125
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2005
    Location:
    Texas; where else?
    BUT, if you run so much psi that the turbo is overworked, you'll lose efficiency and heat the air too much, which could result in pinging, which could break stuff. although we're talking ALOT of psi with an undersized intercooler. so, pos is pretty much right until you add some stupid circumstances.
     
  16. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    True- but you sholdn't be running a turbo out of it's efficiency range anyway :)
     
  17. hondarin

    hondarin Please enter a value using 50 characters or fewer. VIP

    Messages:
    1,955
    Likes Received:
    125
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2005
    Location:
    Texas; where else?
    touche. lol
     
  18. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    This turbo is most effeciect in the 18psi area. I would be making less heat the closer I get to that number right? Less heat and more airflow too?
     
  19. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    i'd have to see the compressor map...
     
  20. Turbo&Auto

    Turbo&Auto Nick Go FAST!!

    Messages:
    3,269
    Likes Received:
    29
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Location:
    East Burg, PA!
    I'll see if I can find it.

    Here's what a guy wrote on MatrixOwners, we were talking about the same topic. Only difference there is, there's only like 4 or 5 people that actually have or have had a turbo car. Not a whole lot of knowledge on FI but makes for "interesting" reading.

    Quote from LHO-RTS:
    OK here is the deal with this:

    Boost is boost, no matter how big the turbo is. If you have a big turbo making 4 psi, it will make the same power as a small turbo making 4 psi. The size of turbo does not effect power if the boost is exactly the same.

    I have proven this with my 94 cavy turbo. I had a smaller t3 KKK K26 turbo that made my car run a 14.85 1/4 mile when it was setup at 4psi boost. I ran the exact same time, 14.85 1/4 mile with the current turbo i'm running which is a HUGE-a** GM5 turbo from a 6.5L diesel, and i was running, you guessed it, only 4 psi boost.

    Boost is boost, you will get the same amount of power from the same level of boost no matter what size the turbo is.

    The main diff from large to small turbos is where the power comes in and where it falls off.

    Case closed! [​IMG]

    So I wrote back:
    Case re-opened, this is SO NOT TRUE! Please dont post info thats so friggin false its not even funny.

    A. Now that you have a Mack truck turbo it takes longer to spool it up, thus making slower launches with better top end. Kinda equals itself out.

    Let's not compare drag times as power examples, thats just shooting in the dark. If you have a dyno comparison then show it.

    If a T3 makes 300cfm at 4psi and a T25 only makes 200cfm at 4psi, you're trying to tell me that will be the same power? I think not mang. Thats why people buy big a$s turbos, higher HP [​IMG]

    LHO writes:
    ^^ No man, I took fluid dynamics in school.

    You must understand, 4 psi is 4 psi going into the engine. It doesn't matter what is putting it in there. 4psi from a larger turbo just means there is more volume and less velocity.

    And don't rag on a car you've never seen. My cavy actually has no lag that way it setup. I have the vids to prove it!! I got the turbo for free and decided to throw it on for run. The reason it only make 4psi is that it is too inefficient for the engine. Its on an engine with less than have the displacement of the engine the turbo came off of. The V6 simply doen't have the exhaust pressure to spool it fast enough to make more than 4-5psi.

    When you read a boost gauge it's taking the reading from the intake manifold pressure, correct? So if the pressure in the manifold is the same, the engines power will be the same.

    I finished the debate with:
    An engine is a air/fuel pump, the more air/fuel you get in there the more power you make.

    If you have 200cfm of air and the correct amount of fuel, you'll make 200whp(VERY GENERAL ASSUMPTIONS HERE)

    If you have 300cfm of air and the correct amount of fuel, you'll make 250+whp.

    The more air/fuel you cram in there and correctly ignite, the MORE POWER IS MADE. SO, the size of the turbo directly effects the power output.
     
Verification:
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page