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drag racing being competitive? i thought that was what bracket racing was for. all makes models and walks of life running to get as fast as they can... in that bracket.
i raced at bristol int'l dragway once...
i raced at bristol int'l dragway once...
made plenty of sense, considering DSP was getting a huge hurting from vtec civics. could not make up the ground with my little d15 :/ just was not possible on the huge firestone lot.
Celerity
Well-Known Member
Oh, it was within the rule books. I just felt it wasn't very sportsman-like. Just the same way I feel about drag racing, F1 racing, and other sports where winning and losing is such a small margin due only to ignorant rules and regulations.
For instance, I recall you removed your strut brace to class down. I had the Supra at the time, and it was stock except for a strut bar. I got classed up and HOUSED on the course. I still did it because it was competitive.
So just because the class seemed to out-invest me, it would have been kinda pussyish for me to downclass just because I wasn't guaranteed a win. Hell, I even asked to upclass in the CRX at Waterbury FCSCC because my non-strut barred 12.x:1 compression CRX on street tires was walking all over my class.
For instance, I recall you removed your strut brace to class down. I had the Supra at the time, and it was stock except for a strut bar. I got classed up and HOUSED on the course. I still did it because it was competitive.
So just because the class seemed to out-invest me, it would have been kinda pussyish for me to downclass just because I wasn't guaranteed a win. Hell, I even asked to upclass in the CRX at Waterbury FCSCC because my non-strut barred 12.x:1 compression CRX on street tires was walking all over my class.
So... You say things are getting too competitive in racing due to the rules, but got bored dominating lesser modded cars (that by the rules fell into your car's same class) and wanted to move to a more competetive class huh? Quite the contradiction...
Starburst Contradictions Dog - YouTube
"Don't listen to them (Cel). You're not weird, you're an innovator." "Nah, he's weird."
That quote is full of contradictions but I'll focus on that part because it fits so perfectly with this one.
double0Si said:
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Celerity
Well-Known Member
How is that contradictory ? That's EXACTLY what I'm saying !
I absolutely mauled people in a technical class that I belonged to. So I asked if I could be bumped into the next class to provide some sort of challenge to myself, and the others in the class that I just left.
Both sides of the argument :
"Then it just comes down to who has the most money to throw at a car"
Answer: The team has the ability to modify their car in any way they can. If they want it to run on split atoms and corner using Higgs Boson cannons, they should be able to. That's their innovation. To just build a car with severely regulated parts (Everyone runs the same car) is just unsportsman like. If you don't like it, don't compete, or get off your ass and start inventing stuff.
I demonstrated how I dealt with the situation from two sides :
My Supra was stock, except for a strut tower bar. That single modification took me out of a class, and put me into a class that was dominated by more dollars and modifications. I still competed, and accepted my low placing.
My CRX was heavily modified, but all of my mods didn't make it sit outside of the stock class. I walked on everyone. I didn't like being able to get a trophy for just showing up (Which a LOT of people seem to do) so I asked to be up-classed to actually compete. I didn't take first place there either.
I absolutely mauled people in a technical class that I belonged to. So I asked if I could be bumped into the next class to provide some sort of challenge to myself, and the others in the class that I just left.
Both sides of the argument :
"Then it just comes down to who has the most money to throw at a car"
Answer: The team has the ability to modify their car in any way they can. If they want it to run on split atoms and corner using Higgs Boson cannons, they should be able to. That's their innovation. To just build a car with severely regulated parts (Everyone runs the same car) is just unsportsman like. If you don't like it, don't compete, or get off your ass and start inventing stuff.
I demonstrated how I dealt with the situation from two sides :
My Supra was stock, except for a strut tower bar. That single modification took me out of a class, and put me into a class that was dominated by more dollars and modifications. I still competed, and accepted my low placing.
My CRX was heavily modified, but all of my mods didn't make it sit outside of the stock class. I walked on everyone. I didn't like being able to get a trophy for just showing up (Which a LOT of people seem to do) so I asked to be up-classed to actually compete. I didn't take first place there either.
Because what you're calling for would create that in most arenas. And it just isn't fun to watch or be a part of after the newness of a fast vehicle wears off.
You should also see that the regulations aren't so tight that there is no room for innovation. You're contradicting yourself saying that having class rules means that every win is going to be down to the millisecond. That with rules you cant still be innovative. Obviously there is a lot of room to play with if you're willing to learn the book and find what you can get away with within the rules to give yourself the best shot at a win. Your CRX scenario shows that. Your Supra also shows that if you don't know the rules and what will cause you to be outclassed you'll have your ass handed to you.
And how do you think rules come to be, they just decide one day to outlaw a certain mod or put it in a specific class? NO! It's because someone innovates a new trick mod, and let's say it works. It either becomes the new class got to have it standard part or it gets banned/sent to another class.
Again though, the biggest thing wrong with all of this is you basing your argument off of the results of one race. Especially after taking in to consideration the exact opposite things happening in a couple of your other experiences.
Look up the results of the rest of the races this season. They post up each race E.T.s round by round. You'll find that this is one case where it was that close. It's most definitely not the norm. That's why it was so newsworthy. Because it rarely happens.
"If you don't like it, don't compete, or get off your ass and start inventing stuff." Make your own racing series. I'm sure you'll find some like-minded people and maybe some of them will have millions to throw at a car to build them to your far fetched liking. Until then quit bitching about what works for a lot of people and not for you.
You should also see that the regulations aren't so tight that there is no room for innovation. You're contradicting yourself saying that having class rules means that every win is going to be down to the millisecond. That with rules you cant still be innovative. Obviously there is a lot of room to play with if you're willing to learn the book and find what you can get away with within the rules to give yourself the best shot at a win. Your CRX scenario shows that. Your Supra also shows that if you don't know the rules and what will cause you to be outclassed you'll have your ass handed to you.
And how do you think rules come to be, they just decide one day to outlaw a certain mod or put it in a specific class? NO! It's because someone innovates a new trick mod, and let's say it works. It either becomes the new class got to have it standard part or it gets banned/sent to another class.
Again though, the biggest thing wrong with all of this is you basing your argument off of the results of one race. Especially after taking in to consideration the exact opposite things happening in a couple of your other experiences.
Look up the results of the rest of the races this season. They post up each race E.T.s round by round. You'll find that this is one case where it was that close. It's most definitely not the norm. That's why it was so newsworthy. Because it rarely happens.
"If you don't like it, don't compete, or get off your ass and start inventing stuff." Make your own racing series. I'm sure you'll find some like-minded people and maybe some of them will have millions to throw at a car to build them to your far fetched liking. Until then quit bitching about what works for a lot of people and not for you.
a strut bar isnt going to make and break a car in a class 
being overpowered by faster, lighter cars will. moving from DSP to HSTOCK was a good decision for the civic. later I was back in DSP due to changing out my shocks.
the two mirage coupes, on the other hand, are underdog FSP cars and i dominated NE region FSP events due to the fact that i built those cars up to the edge of SM-class, but never went to SM considering the lowest powered vehicle had almost double the HP. not only did i win at CART but i also won at FCSCC and devens... posting decent DSP times in my FSP car. can't really shake a stick at that, especially when it was all 1.5L power up against 1.8L/2.0L dohc cars with comparable weight and more power.
its no deception though. i've only been autocrossing with the same type of car and rules for almost a decade now. the corolla and veloster are both HSTOCK / FSP cars. most nationals people do the same thing. they pick a class and try to master it . i'm just better at this particular motorsport than most.
being overpowered by faster, lighter cars will. moving from DSP to HSTOCK was a good decision for the civic. later I was back in DSP due to changing out my shocks.the two mirage coupes, on the other hand, are underdog FSP cars and i dominated NE region FSP events due to the fact that i built those cars up to the edge of SM-class, but never went to SM considering the lowest powered vehicle had almost double the HP. not only did i win at CART but i also won at FCSCC and devens... posting decent DSP times in my FSP car. can't really shake a stick at that, especially when it was all 1.5L power up against 1.8L/2.0L dohc cars with comparable weight and more power.
its no deception though. i've only been autocrossing with the same type of car and rules for almost a decade now. the corolla and veloster are both HSTOCK / FSP cars. most nationals people do the same thing. they pick a class and try to master it . i'm just better at this particular motorsport than most.
Oh I know. lol I looked into auto-x and scca events for the Camaro a while back but found my tubular strut tower brace, A-Arms, and k-member would have put me in a class I was far underpowered for. I looked at the rules ahead of time and it changed my plans. I'm ok with that.
and truly, that is ideal. i see alot of folks build up a car, then end up in SM because of stupid shit.
build a car for a class, never for fun. you won't have any that way.
Yea. Those were mods I was doing just to have a more fun DD that could be fun/quick to run at Mid Ohio. Competing was a second thought. That's why I was ok with it. Besides, once it's done it will be far more car than my current skill level in a track setting is ready to take full advantage of. So racing it will wait.
I've thought about stripping the Si and building it into track car since its pretty much a stock blank canvas with a lot of potential, and I don't care for it much as a DD anyway. Also since its on the lower end of speed it'd be a good car to learn how to drive fast, not just be driving a fast car.
I've thought about stripping the Si and building it into track car since its pretty much a stock blank canvas with a lot of potential, and I don't care for it much as a DD anyway. Also since its on the lower end of speed it'd be a good car to learn how to drive fast, not just be driving a fast car.
Celerity
Well-Known Member
So you won't compete ? Why not ?
I can see budget being a factor for not competing, or just not being interested in car competition. But you're obviously interested in it. So the only thing left for me to think is : You won't compete because you don't think you'll win.
Is that true ?
Nope. You're completely wrong... First off, the car isn't done. So unless they've got a class where you are to push the car around the track I plain can't. Second, yes budget. I don't know why you'd bring it up then simply overlook it. Big factor. I couldn't afford to mod and maintain a race car right now. And most importantly, if you read my post, my Camaro was being modded to play the role of fun/fast car I'd still DD. I wasn't building it to race. The thought of racing it came along later and mostly because races could serve as just another reason/time to get on the track in addition to track days.
See, for me, being on the track and putting all the time and money I've spent to its purpose is the fun. I don't need a trophy to justify it. Not taking home a trophy couldn't wipe the smile off my face that taking laps in the car I built would bring.
So yes, I would still compete. Whether or not I'd be competitive is a moot point. I don't know what class my car would fall into because It's all over the place, and because I don't care. It's not being built to fit a class and I can have fun anyways. You don't have to let rules stifle your build. You just make your own game to play.
See, for me, being on the track and putting all the time and money I've spent to its purpose is the fun. I don't need a trophy to justify it. Not taking home a trophy couldn't wipe the smile off my face that taking laps in the car I built would bring.
So yes, I would still compete. Whether or not I'd be competitive is a moot point. I don't know what class my car would fall into because It's all over the place, and because I don't care. It's not being built to fit a class and I can have fun anyways. You don't have to let rules stifle your build. You just make your own game to play.
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some people are all about the competition, some all about the sport, and some all about the win
this thread reads like a bad "i live my life a quarter mile at a time" joke
at least the personal insults like final fantasy and pet shooting were sort of funny, from my twisted perspective
and to all the Cel haters, you gotta read that shit with a grain of salt
its equal parts logic and bat shit insanity, i imagine its a true representation of what it would be like to talk to him in person, you might scratch your heard and get the ole dafuq did i just read, but its always entertaining
this thread reads like a bad "i live my life a quarter mile at a time" joke
at least the personal insults like final fantasy and pet shooting were sort of funny, from my twisted perspective
and to all the Cel haters, you gotta read that shit with a grain of salt
its equal parts logic and bat shit insanity, i imagine its a true representation of what it would be like to talk to him in person, you might scratch your heard and get the ole dafuq did i just read, but its always entertaining
Nah f that. You don't pretend not to smell the giant shit a retard just dropped in his pants just because he's "special." When you're a pompous d-bag you deserve to get called out on it from time to time. Not singling out this thread, just speaking in general.
Also, I think your scale may need re-zero'd.
Also, I think your scale may need re-zero'd.
great movie.