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EF Bswap Project Questions

Discussion in 'HYBRID -> ED-EF / DA' started by Vtec Veteran, Jan 19, 2011.

  1. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    Hey guys,

    I'm working on a EF track car & have a few questions regarding my BSwap
    I've spent several nights online & whilst i managed to get a few questions answered, a few others remain un-answered or left me uncertain.
    Hoping you guys can offer some insight.

    My car is a 1990 EF & came with a D16A6 motor running off a PM6 ECU.
    My donor B16 motor comes from a '92 civic EG running off a P28 ECU.
    I'm going with a YS1 cable tranny so the mechanical swap was pretty basic (to me). I went with Hasport mounts, Resized shift linkage, SIR Rear bracket, & i'm waiting on the right engine bracket.

    Now that the motor is pretty much in the car, I'm looking for advice on wiring issues.
    Firstly, I need to ascertain if I have DPFI or MPFI.
    From what I'v researched online, the fact that I have a D16A6 with a PGM-FI Intake mani, I deduced that I have MPFI.
    However, the note at the top of the PGM-FI plate stating DUAL POINT is what left me uncertain.
    I've attached a pic of the intake
    [​IMG]

    Is there any other way to confirm if I have DPFI or MPFI?

    My other question revolves the actual wiring of the new B16 motor to the ECU.
    I pulled the B16 motor out of the EG with the harness still connected to the motor.
    The harness has a seperate Vtec Solenoid wire spliced onto the main wiring harness just before it plugs into the P28 ECU. I'm not sure but does this indicate this is an OBD1 or OBD0???

    Now, I figured it would be as simple as bringing the motor across to the new shell then simply plugging in th P28 ECU & i'll be good to go.
    Unfortunately not!
    The original EF harness not only plugs into the ECU but after entering the cabin through the firewall, also splits & plugs into a harness that runs behind the dash.

    Does this mean I need to run the original EF harness & simply connect to the P28 ecu by using some sort of jumper harness? (or is there some other way of using the original B16 harness in which case i need direction on how to link to the dash harness)

    Thanks for any help you guys can offer.
     
  2. skellagher

    skellagher Elder Driver

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    its mpfi
     
  3. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    The dpfi will only have two fuel injectors, that weird that intake manifold says that.. For the ecu get a pw0 its for the obd0 b16, and you will need to change the dizzy to a obd0 b16 one. Then you will just have to run two wires to the ecu for vtec and ground the third vtec wire
     
  4. skellagher

    skellagher Elder Driver

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    obd0-obd1 jumper harness
     
  5. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    well yeah that to but then you need to get a 4 wire o2 and wire it up also..
     
  6. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    Thanks for the quick responses guys.

    @Hondafreak513...I still have some uncertainty:
    -Would I then run the EF harness or the B16 harness?
    -Is my current b16 harness OBD0 or OBD1?
    -Is there a way to wire my current dizzy to work instead of buying another dizzy?
     
  7. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    Actually i think you will have to use the ef engine harness cause the plugs at the shock tower are different than ones from a eg.. You might be able to change plugs on the dizzy to the obd0 style.. but to save from getting different injectors I would get the obd0-obd1 jumper and use the p28 if it is chipped for the b16..

    your current b16 harness will be a obd1 if its out of a eg..
     
  8. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    I'm sorry for all the stupid questions but i need clarity...
    If I rewired the dizzy to OBD0 (the EF harness) then the injector plugs wont fit the B16 injectors? Can I not simply cut the wires & change the plugs to match the injectors? (basically swap the plugs between the 2 harnesses)

    Lastly, are there any downsides to going OBD0 cos my eventual aim is to go B20vtec with Hondata. My reasons for installing the B16 is to iron out all the wiring issues & get the car to the paintshop....then when it returns, I can simply do the motorswap & if i run into idle or starting issues, I can almost rule out wiring as the cause.
     
  9. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    Yes you can swap out the injector plugs, my bad i totally forgot about them.. it will still be obd1 if you keep the obd1 injectors in it and put the p28 in with the jumper harness, and don't forget you will need to wire up a 4 wire o2 sensor. the ef has a one wire o2.
     
  10. BrokenRex

    BrokenRex New Member

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    you can buy an obd0 to obd1 conversion harness that includes a distributor adapter and the additional plugs for a 4wire o2 sensor, knock sensor, vtec pressure switch, vtec solenoid, and vtec ground. then you'd use the harness that came with your d16a6 (you'd only need to extend a few wires, and change the fan switch connector. on the d16a6 it was a two post sensor on the back of the block. on the b16 it's on the thermostat housing and is a plug similar to the knock sensor plug.) then cut off your injector resistor and solder all the five wires together and swap over the obd1 injector plugs to your harness.

    if you actually plan on backdating, you'll need to extend the same wires, use your obd0 injectors, keep the injector resistor. buy a obd0 b16 distributor (which was never made in the USA mind you) add all the necessary wires for knock, vtec press, vtec solenoid, and ground. and buy an obd0 ecu.... this isn't the route i'd recommend.

    but either way you're going to be using your d16a6 wiring harness. so the obd1 harness will only be used for plugs. either route is really easy to do, but the first is cheaper (150 for a conversion harness vs. 300ish for the obd0 distributor, ecu and wiring) and it will have better control over the engine. there's a reason tuners prefer obd1, you'll be happy with your decision if you choose to go that route.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2011
  11. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    ^^^ good explanation I didn't know that they had a jumper harness that came with all that... that works out better... Yeah OBD1 is way better..
     
  12. skellagher

    skellagher Elder Driver

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    my b16 is still on dpfi engine harness that was modified for mpfi then i used a jumper harness for the ecu and i put obd1 style dizzy connect on the harness side of the plug pretty easy for you because ur already mpfi all u have to do is get the jumper harness wire vtec and ur o2 sensor up and ur good to go..
     
  13. Rtsvtec2004

    Rtsvtec2004 New Member

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    once you know if you have either mpfi or dpfi you can go to boomslang and get a specific conversion harness. It comes with all the connectors and its a really clean intall and comes with good instructions. I used it on my crx b16a3 swap and it worked great
     
  14. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    Wow.
    Thanks for the responses guys.
    Now I have a pretty good idea of how to go about doing this.

    Its also my luck that i found more info on this in Project Car magazine....However, the one thing that confused me in their article was the part about injectors. they said the EF came with low impedance injectors & therefore had resistors in the circuit. The B16 has hi impedance injectors & therefore these resistors need to be removed during a Bswap
    Can any of you that did this swap verify this for me please?

    As far as doing the actual wiring, im uncertain if i should:
    -bite the bullet, buy the ecu jumper & dizzy jumper harnesses
    -buy just the ecu jumper & rewire the dizzy plugs (or maybe makeup a dizzy jumper considering i have both EF & EG harnesses & dizzy's)
    -attempt to de-pin & rewire the EF harness onto the EG plug so that it plugs straight into the P28 ecu (havn't researched this option yet so not 100% sure if its even an option)
     
  15. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    Don't attempt to re-wire the ecu plugs..My friend tried that because he was to cheap and lazy to buy the jumper, and ran into to many problems... Just buy the jumper setup and be done with it.. As for the injectors the ones in the b16 don't use the resistor box, and the ones in the EF use a resistor box that is located in the far right corner by the brake master cylinder...
     
  16. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    I'm going to look for the resistor box tomorrow when i get back to working on the swap.
    I guess its settled that I'm gona have to go with a jumper.
    Its currently a Toss up between a Boomslang Harness for $110 excl shipping outa US (i'm in canada) OR Frog Harness 2nd hand but never been used, for $100 excl shipping (a few hours away from me)

    Any of you heard of FROG Ecu jumper harness & have any good/bad stories to share.
    The only thing pushing me in that direction is I'll have the harness within 2 days.
    Shipping outa the US can take as much as 14days as it did with my Hasport Mounts
     
  17. FNG Clint291

    FNG Clint291 New Member

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    buying an ecu, dizzy and 4 wire o2 sensor jumper will save you tons of headaches when it comes to the swap, you could always use the jumper set but still use the obd0 injectors and keep the resistor box. as far as the FROG(?) ecu jumper have never heard of them so not sure about the build quality or the reliability of them, if you want to be certain your getting the good quality call the guys at rywire.com, $104 for the ecu jumper with instructions, and also order from them the dizzy jumper as well which is $30
     
  18. dirt

    dirt New Member

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    Don't forget, if you go to the obd1 injectors, when you take out the injector resistor box, you have to cut the connector off of the harness side, strip the wire and connect all of them. Otherwise the injectors won't fire.
     
  19. Vtec Veteran

    Vtec Veteran New Member

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    Thanks Dirt...
    That's some vital bits of info conveniently left out on quiet a few forums i been playing on.
     
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