1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

ls turbo

Discussion in 'Forced Induction' started by Speedracer228, Mar 4, 2004.

  1. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    ive been debating on vtec n/a or ls turbo in a civic hatch or crx. I havent started the project yet because i want to get everything in order before i do something stupid. my goal is to have a daily driver that can run 12s on the weekend. my first question is which hondata system would be best, i was looking at the s100 with the boost option. also what extent of block work would need to be done so that i wont have to worry about it taking a shit on me. :huh:

    i knew a kid around me that was running an ls vtec turbo on about 12lbs on stock internals. it was fast as shit and ran low 12's in his gutted crx but it wouldnt the stock internals give out under that type of boost from a t3/t4?
     
  2. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    12s all motor = $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

    12s on a turbo = $$$$$

    ls turbo > all motor vtec IMO

    the s100 sucks. most tuners hate them too.
    just pay the extra 100 bucks for the s200/b
    it will save it self cost in tuner time costs.


    first thing first- you need a car.
    i suggest the 92-95 hatch for each of swappage and parts.
    the crx is going to be a pain to work with with a b-series and a turbo system.

    after you have a car, you need a budget. running 12s is going to cost you at LEAST 5 grand in parts, and most likely much more
     
  3. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    yeah i have heard great things about hondata systems, but i dont know jack about em :blink:

    well im gonna have about 8 grand for everything, and my friends dad owns a repo business so i can get a car for cheap, and sometimes there are some already swapped civics rollin through. also, if im rebuilding the bottom end, it doesnt really matter the milage on the motor does it?
     
  4. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    naw, i wouldn't worry too much about mileage... 250k well maintained will probably be in better shape than 100k prroly maintained.
     
  5. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    i read that thread on honda-tech (low compression vs high) and i was still kind of confused. from what i gathered there and what i have read elsewhere is that for the setup im looking to produce, daily driver with track capabilities, it would be best to keep it around 9:1, or so. that way i have more of a cushon when its tuned.

    is that somewhat correct or am i way off?
     
  6. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    Facts:

    low compression: 9.5-
    - more 'room' for air to get into chamber
    - less off-boost (vacuum) power, more lag
    - more room for error
    - great for huge power setups, not as great on the street

    high compression: 9.5+
    - less room for air to get into chamber
    - more power off boost, less response time (lag)
    - less room for error
    - runs hoter
    - great for low-power, low boost, properly-tuned street setups.


    That said, I went with 9:1 on my setup. it will give you more coushion, but at the same time, it will require more boost to make the same power as a 10:1 motor.
    IMO, use the boost- not the motor. I can deal with lag, and thus, get better gas milage on the highway and such anyway.

    but, the option is yours for the picking.
     
  7. cycloneb18c3

    cycloneb18c3 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,056
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Location:
    New Jersey
    the fastest dragsters are forced induction. you dont see all motor drag cars running 5 second quarters like forced inductions can do. not that yours is gonna be that fast, but its cheaper and you can go faster.
     
  8. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    i wouldnt have a problem giving up that low end power running 9:1 to make it more streetable, and i like the idea of having that cushon.

    With the block, would i have to re-sleeve it, or would i be ok with just upgrading to forged pistons and rods?
     
  9. cycloneb18c3

    cycloneb18c3 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,056
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Location:
    New Jersey
    if your going to have it all apart like that, you should prolly get it sleeved, so you dont have to worry about it. its really up to up, I would if it was my engine. even more so if it is an older B18A1(90-93 integra) block, because chances they have more miles and are just older(and the older stuff is the more chances you have of breaking it) My old LS block is out getting sleeved right now. I got arias 9:1 pistons, eagle H beam rods, eagle crank all waiting for it. going in a 91 crx.

    you dont have to resleeve it, but for 12s- you'll prolly be running 13-15lbs of boost, which is getting to be a lot for a honda block; they werent meant for monsterous amounts of boost(any for that matter)
     
  10. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    do u think i could retain the stock crank? because i was hoping i could save on that and get some head porting done because i hear the ls heads flow like crap
     
  11. cycloneb18c3

    cycloneb18c3 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,056
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Location:
    New Jersey
    definitly u can use the stock crank. they are good till like 500hp. I just got a new one cause my old one the bearing spun and etched the hell out of the crank. I would of used the stock one.
     
  12. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    crank is fine. there's no need to upgrade it.

    as for sleeving, the choice is yours. if you have the cash, by all means do it without thinking twice about it. but if the extra G is going to set you back a year, you could probably get away with it--- at least for a little while.
     
  13. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    well, does most of the price come from machining, because i would hopefully getting the work done with the help of my friends dad whos semi-retired and restores cars and such all day. That would hopefully cut some costs.

    also, this is probably a stupid question but ill ask anyway. ive been researching what i can and the one thing i have been having trouble understanding is how to tune the car after it is built. I know i will need something like a hondata system to control fuel management and stuff, but is it really that complicated to get the timing, and fuel curves correct so that it wont send one of my newly purchased rods out the bottom of my oil pan?
     
  14. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    it costs about a G to get your block sleeved. its all machine work.
    check out goldeneaglemfg.com for an example. i wouldn't trust a friends dad to sleeve your block. there's a lot to it with high-tech machines required.

    tuning, is a science. i'd highly recommend taking it to someone whos a pro. i have no intentions to tune my own car.
     
  15. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    assembling the block wouldnt take that kind of work though would it?, ive never rebuilt a motor before, im kind of learning as i go. I swapped a new motor into my friends talon before, it took a bout a week doing it after school, and it ran like a charm without any probelms. so i figure with some help i could build a solid motor. minus the major machining.

    also if anyone knows of a good place i could take it to get tuned in the tri-state area (pa nj de) it would be helpful.
     
  16. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    for the actual turbo setup, i was thinking a t3 from a saab or something or getting a t3/t4. what type of manifold would be quality and cost effective? I see that the rev hard ones have the wastegate flange above the #1 cylynder exhaust port, and that doesnt draw any away from the other exhaust ports. does that make it inferior to any other type? also what wastegates are quality and manual boost controllers?
     
  17. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

    Messages:
    49,693
    Likes Received:
    53
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2002
    Location:
    Retirement Home
    assembling it is pretty easy as long as you have a helms manual and a good torque wrench.

    but the sleeving factor is something that simply can't be done at a home garage. there are $100,000 machines required.

    Tuner- You're probably going to want to use Jeff Evans. I'm paying for him to come up to CT to tune my car. he is in your area in PA. check out http://www.boosted-hybrid.com

    for the ls, i'd recommend a t3/t04b .48/.63 for a 200-250 area, and a t3/t04e .63/.63 for 300, and a t3/60-1 for 325-400

    for a manifold, the inlinepro is probably the best log-style manifold. the drag kit draws from 1, the rev hard from 2. the inline pro, from all 4. there's a dude jody (sir kid) knows running mid 10's in a street car with it.

    if you've got the cash, http://www.full-race.com is where you want to go :)
    I have their stage 4 setup.

    http://wakesports.com/full-race/index.php?showtopic=16

    and i'd highly recommend an apex'i avcr digital boost controller over a manual.

    manuals are good for low boost/small turbo cars, but they just can't offer the features that a full blown digital one can.
     
  18. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    man i have been looking forever to find someone who had any actual experience tuning honda's/other imports. its all fords and chevy's by me :angry:

    thats why i need to build me a civic that will shut them up!
     
  19. YouKnowWhoIBee

    YouKnowWhoIBee my avatar is better.

    Messages:
    2,257
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2003
    Location:
    Maryland
    Where do you live. I know a place in the maryland area that does tuning. It is called tempest racing.
     
  20. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

    Messages:
    1,610
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    im in the burbs outside of philly, maryland, nj de, are all within reasonable driving range

    where at in maryland is it located?
     
Verification:
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page