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please let them fail, part 2

Discussion in 'Members' Lounge' started by Briansol, Nov 7, 2008.

  1. Briansol

    Briansol Admins Admin VIP

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  2. INJEN78

    INJEN78 HS LEGEND

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    HOLE :)
    but yes,they do just need to call it quits,shit is getting old
     
  3. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    saw this earlier. failing means nothing. they will either file bankruptcy and stay open or get government funding and subsidies under promises of starting a new hybrid company called "gm-petrol" or some shit.
     
  4. cressidakiller

    cressidakiller New Member

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    i don't like socialism but i dunno. compromise, let 1 or 2 fail?
    other car companies are faltering too. we bailed chrysler and that worked for a while. auto industry is uber regulated.
    so many auto-related jobs. plus it covers so many different areas of science, research, and industry. other countries bolster their auto industries: japan, germany.
    plus we bail out and subsidize other industries.
    destroy the unions. they say the unionized industries are the ones that are hurting.
    Rants - Autoextremist.com ~ the bare-knuckled, unvarnished, high octane truth... has some good points
    now the big 3 want 50 bil instead of 25. and a big part of govt money gm wanted was for chrysler union benefits.
    chrysler used to make space and war stuff. could be relevant claim to keep some manufacturing in US.
    if we can carry them thru credit crunch it might be a-ok.
    all this after we just bailed banks and insurance companies.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2008
  5. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    big auto and big oil can suck a dick. they have been in co-hoots since forever. if one fails, they both fail. this wont end easy.
     
  6. CRX-YEM

    CRX-YEM Super Moderator Moderator VIP

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    Do you realize the implications of GM failing?? Putting 145,000 people out of work in a heartbeat. You think the economy sucks and the stock market is down 40% , we would definitely relive the great depression. One benefit is the labor union will go the way of the dodo bird.
     
  7. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    exactly. it's like letting big banks fail. it doesn't effect just the bank. it's like throwing a pebble in a lake. the ripples are larger than the splash.
     
  8. cressidakiller

    cressidakiller New Member

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    'too big to fail'
    now if someone bought the failing companies and what they do w/ them is another story.
    if the price is right
    barclay's bought lehman bros
    bank of america bought morgan stanley i think
    wells fargo bought wachovia
    someone bought bear stearns
    someone prob would have bought aig
    fannie and freddie could have gone non-govt and been bought for a deal
    gm and ford have got to look more appealing than chrysler
    the car companies are restructuring and selling off brands
    some say 1 more quarter for credit crunch, if so, that could allevaite some of the auto industry problems
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2008
  9. Briansol

    Briansol Admins Admin VIP

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    1 quarter? lol wishful thinking at best.

    we will be in this for at least a year, probably 2.
     
  10. cressidakiller

    cressidakiller New Member

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    1 quarter for credit crunch, not whole mortgage fiasco, esp. w/ a.r.m.s resetting mid 08 and later. but the 1 quarter is optimistic. plus w/ bama, this whole financial problem will probably be longer.
     
  11. hunter4life

    hunter4life Rotary Man

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    ^^Bandwagon?
     
  12. xj0hnx

    xj0hnx I wanna be sedated VIP

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    Which bandwagon? The bandwagon that realizes the reality that Obamas economic plan is going to be a miserable failure? Taxing the economy into prosperity is like standing in a bucket and trying to lift yourself up by the handle, ain't going to happen. It is going to make things a LOT worse.
     
  13. jamesA

    jamesA Well known pissed off telephone guy VIP

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    Unions = fucking over the auto industry.

    25 bucks an hour to watch a machine stamp out parts and build/weld the cars together on a computer automated line.

    Must be nice.
     
  14. phyregod

    phyregod !!YTINASNI

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    I've heard of assembly workers for gm making $37/hour + all the benefits. Yeah, the unions are directly responsible for the downfall of GM.
     
  15. BrutalB83

    BrutalB83 Brutal Moderator Moderator VIP

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    And yet they still see fit to go on strike on a regular basis and demand MORE pay and benefits...yeah, no feelings of undeserved entitlement there...nope, not at all...
     
  16. EGProject

    EGProject YEEEEAAHHHHH

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    It's mainly the Unions fault - they tried to kill the goose that layed the golden egg - and succeeded. Already high labor rates weren't enough, but they HAD to make more money, so GM/Chrysler/Ford took it in the ass and either moved production out of the country (Mexico = shitty quality), or cut costs elsewhere, or simply absorbed the loss.
     
  17. phyregod

    phyregod !!YTINASNI

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    So check this out...

    GM builds housing near their major assembly plants. Enough housing to hold 90% of their workers. Offers up a one time company paid move, rents the housing for enough to actually make a little money on the deal, but low enough that their workers can easily afford it.. Kind of like base housing except you pay rent.. Then fires everyone in the fucking plant who won't disband from the union and take a huge pay cut. Top assembly line workers make $15 an hour to push their buttons vs 37. Benefits package gets trimmed from the current union god mode ball massages every day to a standard benefits package, supplemental health, 401k, etc. Then hit employment sites, job fairs, etc. They can hire a new work force and move them out under a non-union contract. Join a union and you can pack your shit and leave. There are hordes of workers in the united states who would take such a deal and GM would save a couple billion bucks a year on payroll and bullshit.

    They also need some kind of defense from the retarded retirement packages they have been forced into by the unions. There are thousands of workers retired from GM who are fucking banking it. No longer an asset to the company but GM is contractually bound to keep paying them what they made when they worked there. I read an article about it.. Although this is great and humanitary and whatever, retired workers should have been saving, pumping money into their 401k's, investing, preparing to be self supportive in retirement vs leaning entirely on GM to take care of them for the rest of their lives.
     
  18. TurboMirage

    TurboMirage YEEAAAHHH VIP

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  19. cressidakiller

    cressidakiller New Member

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    bandwagon? quit trying so hard for post #101. surely in posting 100 times you've seen some of my earlier rants against socialism and obama. i've been against liberal econ policies for years, obama is the poster boy for those policies. he recently appointed the MI gov, jennifer granholm to his econ advisory team, scary, since MI is doing really poorly, unless she is the example for how not to do it. looks like an auto bailout is more likely now. hey john podesta on board w/ O, more clintonian change.
    many think fdr lengthened the depression.
    compared to us, liberal econ policies give europe less job growth, higher unemp rate, lower gdp, lower standard of living, less new technology creation all while we have a much more active military, give more to others, and beat them at the olympics. europe sucks. most of our ancestors are from there, mine included.
    usually i'm against bailouts: airlines, banks.
    maybe we should see what the auto companies will do left to their own devices. also there was talk of loans, not handouts. for the chrysler loan govt had first dibs and it was leveraged against chrysler assets. prob not fair to the banks/companies w/ existing loans but the govt does what they want.
    i feel the US govt has let down US car companies. jpn used to 'adjust' their currency to bring their car prices down about 3g$, iacocca writes on that. (currency manipulation, act of war)

    maybe it'd be better to let US auto get hurt, maybe the unions would dissolve or the plants would go to 'right to work/non-union' states. these companies are long overdue for an adjustment. i believe the market will right itself. and thinking back to a previous post of mine, chrysler did used to make space/military stuff but now other companies do so theres no 'natl defense' issue there.

    speaking of US screwing its own companies for some senator to get some election $, in Rising Sun, crichton wrote on jpn lobbying US to screw us on tech patents, tho mainly electronics. like to sell in jpn the US companies would lose patent after 5 yrs. some say: US innovates, jpn makes better. but US has already paid for the R&D, so that puts them at a disadvantage.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2008
  20. nootrac22

    nootrac22 Well-Known Member VIP

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    Can't do it. The union goes with the company not the employees. The union would have to be voted out. Firing someone for wanting to unionise is a clear violation of federal law.

    Not saying that the union is not hurting them, but they brought it on themselves.
     
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