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PnP Started...Pics. (56k warning)

Discussion in 'Engine Building' started by MikeBergy, Jul 7, 2004.

  1. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    Well, I started on the intake ports, here is what I have so far. For now, I can't build my insane b16a, so I'm doing the next best thing... messing around with the cheap motor I already have, and getting the teg roadworthy again. For now, my setup is pretty basic. I am doing my own port and polish job here in my kitchen, basically opening up the b18a's poorly cut ports, and doing a little bowl work. I am pretty much keeping stock everything else until I can afford my project b16a. I am picking up a b16a complete bottom end for 125, and I am going to harvest the pr3 pistons out of the block for the b18a, for a little bump in compression. All new oem acura gaskets, timing belt AND tensioner (not gonna make the same mistake twice :) ) , and water pump have been ordered, and should be here hopefully by next week. I am hoping to get the pr4 that I have chipped with some technical advice from pgmfi.org, since I cannot afford hondata, and I think it would be a waste of money anyway, since this is only going to be a temporary build. Some new rings will also be in order, but I ran out of money for the time being (had to pay some other bills first), but will order them probably by monday. Here is some pics of the #1 cylinder intake port, and pics of the #4 port, untouched for comparison. Keep in mind this is my first attempt at this, and if all does not go well, I will just use my other spare b18a head.
    Port 1
    [​IMG]

    Port 4
    [​IMG]

    Eric(Massey), please advise on what if any type of lubricant helped keep the bits nice and clean. THe dremel is very controllable, much moreso than I had first thought it would be, but the bits are a bit short (no pun intended). I am going to go to mcmaster or brightworks and order some longer bits if I do this in the future. So far, it is really fun and not too hard. I traced the outline of the gasket onto the head like you recommended, so it is looking good so far, at least I think so.
     
  2. phunky.buddha

    phunky.buddha Admin with a big stick Admin VIP

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    Not bad. :thumbsup:
     
  3. JDMilan

    JDMilan Senior Member

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    cool..........good work
     
  4. brian11to1

    brian11to1 Senior Member

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    Looks a bit like mine... if i could get pictures I would.
     
  5. MaaseyRacer

    MaaseyRacer Senior Member

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    Hey Mike, Alright I did not use any kind of lube on the porting. Aluminum is way too soft to use any kind of lube or oil. Aluminum cuts way to easily, so you will not need anything like that. What I used instead was a few older aluminum cutting bits that my dad had, and I attached them to a porter cable drill, and just used the drill. That did all my major cutting, if the bits you are using are clogging up then I take it that they are stone bits, and those are used for cast iron heads, really sand paper type bits work well. I bought a kit from summitracing.com: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.a...AI-260001&N=120 4294925139 4294919597 301466
    I then used that to clean everything up, and I used that kit to do the entire exaust side. So you can use that kit to do the whole thing and it comes with extentions and all kinds of cross buff, and flap wheels, for a super clean finish on the exaust side. I need to get some more flap wheels so I can finish up my last ports, but overall I am very happy with that kit. When I get home from work tonight I will take some pictures of my set up and what I have done with it.
    :)
     
  6. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    Yeah, I'm using the stone type bits. They look like the ones in the upper middle picture of that summit kits. They work good so far, it is just slower. I am only spinning the dremel at like 6000rpm, so that I don't accidentally take too much off. I might be up your way soon to pick up a b16a block(harvesting some pistons :) ), you still wanna sell me your sub and amp. I'll only have like 150, but if you'll take it, I could swing by your place either up to or back from Travis AFB. Lemme know, maybe we could get an engine building bbq going here in slo town, when all my parts are here and ready to go together.
     
  7. MaaseyRacer

    MaaseyRacer Senior Member

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    Yeah man I will also be in SLO on the 30th or 31 of this month, I do not have my calendar open. I will have to roll down to Monterey to pick up my AMP and SUB, but I am doing that this weekend. Also you can then check out my porting set up, it is super basic. I have the head up here in San Francisco at my parents place for the summer so I can continue to build it and work on it.
     
  8. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    Update... Here is some more pics of the work I got done today (still working away at it)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    the gap that is left on the port floors is not as big as it looks like in the pic, less than a fingernail thickness, feels very smoot to the touch. Just a little of room left for finishing and smoothing out the perimeter when I'm all finished. The project is a kick so far, very fun, and keeps my mind occupied. Just started the bowls, and having trouble getting between the valve guides and the inner wall, any suggestion is appreciated. :)
     
  9. phunky.buddha

    phunky.buddha Admin with a big stick Admin VIP

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  10. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    You don't polish the intake ports, really. If you do, fuel comes out of suspension and starts pooling on the walls. When the ports(in and ex) are finished, I believe you do a little polishing on the exhaust side, and then I will be polishing the combustion chambers, as well as the piston domes. I guess it is supposed to make for a cleaner combustion, and less residue buildup in the chamber (which =good). You don't really want to take out more material than is necessary to make the gasket flush with the port inlets, but some people enlarge them more for specific applications. I am just looking for overall better flow throughout the rev range, and so I am porting fairly conservatively, but I still took out ALOT of material from the floor of the port and a good amount in smoothing out some casting seams in the sides of the ports. It may not look like a lot, but it took about 4.5 hours to get this far, and I'm still not even barrely started with the bowls on the intake, and haven't even started with the exhaust ports yet, so it will be a while to get to any polishing stage. To answer your q, you can use a variety of tools to polish up the ports, but most people finish off with some fine flapwheels and rotary buff discs.
     
  11. StyleTEG

    StyleTEG Senior Member

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    The casting marks behind the valve guides are actually good for flow. Larry has stated many times that you don't want to touch that area, so I would leave it as is.

    In general you want to remove material from the floor, and achive a D shapped port.

    Some carbon is good for combustion/compression too, so you don't want the pistons/cc polished to a mirror finish.
     
  12. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    Are you talking about the area directly behind the valve guides if you are looking throught the port inlet, or just ALL the material past the valve guide, all the way up to the seats? I can't get to the area in the bowl that is directly behind the guides, because my bit is too wide, but the casting marks I am referring to are the seams in the sides of the ports that are due to two pieces of the mold being seamed together. my ports look very d-shaped. I'm not really looking for the kind of motor response that endyn designs in their motors; they seem to look for top end power, while I am more or less just looking to raise the average flow across the entire rev range. There are many methods to porting, just like there are many ways to get power out of a motor, you just have to use the right method to get what results you desire. I am really just looking for the experience. I will be taking it to my machine shop for hot tanking when I am done, and if they laugh at my work, then oh well, it is really just for practice anyways. The car is my hobby, and good results will only result from my experience. thanks for the input though about the backsides of the bowls, I probably will not touchthem unless someone else suggests it and can show that it helped.
     
  13. StyleTEG

    StyleTEG Senior Member

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    There is a casting mark almost hidden behind the valve guide, that apparently aids the air in navigating around the guide itself and making the turn.

    Larry always says leave it. I can't pretend to have enough experiance to say I know first hand, but his advice usually is the kinda I trust =)

    He uses the D shaped ports and removing material for the floor for his d-series heads as well. Which no doubt require even less high end than the nonvtec heads :)

    Although from what I have learned, valve job, and chamber work do much more than the ports themselves.

    Two other things to consider. Opening up the intake ports a few mm more than the intake manifold. This will create a small lip/barier to prevent flow reversion durring the compression stroke (when the intake valve is still open).

    Likewise on the exhaust side you can open up your exhaust manifold a few mm more than the head and prevent exhaust from reverting as well.
     
  14. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    A few mm is ALOT of material, but I know what stepping the ports is and was already planning on it. good stuff.

    Regarding the casting marks you were talking about, I haven't touched those, And I don't really considerit a casting imperfection, at least compared to the ridges going along the sidewalls of the ports. Thanks for explaining that to me. I am not an expert porter/engine builder either, but then again that is what learning is for, and what this experience is for. Larry is definitely someone I would also take advice from regarding head porting, and I agree with you 100% about that. I better get back to work on the head, since Eric wants to compare my work with his when I get up to the bay area next week, so I'll update with more pics as I get more done :)
     
  15. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    some more work done. Basically finished the intake side ports with the exception of taking a flapwheel to it to sand down the roughness of the grinding, then hit it with 80 grit to evenly rough up the surfaces. Exhaust ports to come next. Probably will be worked on later tonight.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    I ground on the valve seats (not the actual seating area, but the portion before the seating area that is pressed into the port) so there is no lip, just a smooth transition into the chamber.
     
  16. StyleTEG

    StyleTEG Senior Member

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    Looks good, I like the knife edged dividor. Plan on doing any chamber work?

    Here is an interesting note, the B18A head has smaller intake ports than the B18B. Found this out myself when pulling my old motor out (which I swapped a 404 b18a head on) for a B20 and noticed the A's ports were smaller than all three of my B18B heads :eek:
     
  17. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    yeah? I would figure that to be the case, and that is probably one of the few things that was improved on for the bump in the LS's power using the b18b. I am modifying my pr3 intake manifold to replace the b18's "giraffe" manifold, and I am noticing that the runners on the pr3 manifold are MUCH bigger than the ls manifold runners. I might have to carve on the gaskets slightly to match it with the runners, and then carve a little more out of the port openings. My digicam ran out of batteries, but I'll get some more pics asap of my pr3 IM mod. As for chamberwork, I am just planning on polishing them and adding a slight radius to the exhaust valve faces, any suggestions regarding that are welcome, it will be the last stage in the head job.
     
  18. phunky.buddha

    phunky.buddha Admin with a big stick Admin VIP

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    On the casting mark behind the valve guides... a tear drop shape will always allow smoother flow around it than a circle will.

    Food for thought. :)
     
  19. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    <<<<<=Aero Student, Mike :)

    Are you recommending I grind the guides into a tear drop shape?
     
  20. Sabz5150

    Sabz5150 FALCON PUNCH!!!

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    Lookin good! I might use this as a reference when I P&P my A20 head.

    :thumbsup:
     
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