pretty soon, we wont be able to protect the borders.

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Why else would someone throw a rock directly at you? Intent to scare and not harm? If shooting at them is the only way to stop them, I say go for it. If you can aim that accurately where you can hit them in a limb, kudos to you!

I 100% agree with you with the intent to harm.

If your going to be armed you bet your ass you have to be able to be accurate under pressure. Its a rock not a grenade.
 
Have you paid attention to the news? Welfare, workers comp, unemployment, public housing, etc. State governments just ignore the law that prohibits illegals from receiving benefits; in addition to that it's not hard to get away with a fake SS. My cousin actually had someone at the same school using his SS.

Welfare, workers comp, and unemployment all have to have a valid SS with valid state ID. so those are all out the window.

Not sure about government housing.
 
Proof or STFU.

It would be silly to assume this was not true. I also believe firmly that there are sleeper cells in our country at this very moment.

How do you figure? How are Illegals leaching off the system? to receive any government handouts you must be legal in the USA.

I would have to say that driving without a license and taking a job without paying taxes counts as leaching.


So your saying If another white man threw a rock at you you would kill them? Really? fuck thats just plain stupid and childish. Now if someone threw a rather large rock at me with the intent to harm me and I had a gun.....then I would shoot them in the arm or something. Killing people like savages for no reason is rather stupid. Why would you do that? to get the worlds attention and have everybody hate America more? Smart really smart gentlemen.

No one and I mean absolutely no one teaches anything other than center of mass. The idea is to stop the threat as quickly as possible. It is not about killing or even wounding it is about stopping the threat as fast as humanly possible. There is so much miss information about defense of self it would take two generations to rid our society of all the misnomers.

You asked why someone would shoot someone for simply "throwing rocks" but I ask why in the hell is a foreign national assaulting our law enforcement? This makes no sense to me.

Welfare, workers comp, and unemployment all have to have a valid SS with valid state ID. so those are all out the window.

Not sure about government housing.

A stolen SSN is a valid SSN. SSN's are not that expensive and if you get hooked up with the right people when crossing the boarder for a bit extra you can get papers.


And what are they talking about the "rights of immigrants". If you are crossing the Rio what rights do you have? You are commenting a crime according to our laws. I don't get to do whatever I want in another country simply because I am escaping a shitty situation. No one else gives a fuck. The requirments for imigrating to Mexico are much more stringent. As are the penalties for overstaying or entering illegally.
 
now would you be posting the same if it was the other way around? :rolleyes:

absolutely.
i wouldnt go throw rocks at a local police officer, let alone a border guard. its plain fucking stupid, and i would expect nothing less than to get shot at.
in the report, they werent throwing little pebbles, they were throwing good sized stones. it wouldnt take a big one to put a person out of commission.

How do you figure? How are Illegals leaching off the system? to receive any government handouts you must be legal in the USA.

i see more than enough illegals in my area getting government assistance of some kind. i see plenty of them with forged papers that work just as well as my legit ones.



So your saying If another white man threw a rock at you you would kill them? Really? fuck thats just plain stupid and childish. Now if someone threw a rather large rock at me with the intent to harm me and I had a gun.....then I would shoot them in the arm or something. Killing people like savages for no reason is rather stupid. Why would you do that? to get the worlds attention and have everybody hate America more? Smart really smart gentlemen.

if a rock hits you right you are going to end up dead or seriously injured

fear of death or bodily injury = justified use of lethal force

good shoot

if a man is throwing a rock at me with the intent to harm me, then yes, if i had the possession of the correct weaponry at the time, i would aim and fire, with no care nor concern for where it hits that person. the more damage the better. its called self preservation.
if it did so happen to kill him, maybe he should have been smart enough to not attempt to harm an armed person.

darwins law at its finest.

Again most of you need to pull your head out of your racist ass and stop trying to nit pick.

just because you choose to make yourself blind to certain situations does not make them non-existent. this is an issue, this is a very serious issue about our country and the security of it remaining to be the thing it was founded to be.

pretty soon this place will be hitlerswap :hitler:

thats just plain retarded.

I 100% agree with you with the intent to harm.

If your going to be armed you bet your ass you have to be able to be accurate under pressure. Its a rock not a grenade.

rock or grenade, does not matter, if it is used with wrong intent, then the person better be prepared to suffer the consequences. also, are you certain that you are taking into account the location of where this happened? this wasnt some inner city local affair, this happened across national borders, it does make it a bit more serious.
 
It would be silly to assume this was not true. I also believe firmly that there are sleeper cells in our country at this very moment.



I would have to say that driving without a license and taking a job without paying taxes counts as leaching.




No one and I mean absolutely no one teaches anything other than center of mass. The idea is to stop the threat as quickly as possible. It is not about killing or even wounding it is about stopping the threat as fast as humanly possible. There is so much miss information about defense of self it would take two generations to rid our society of all the misnomers.

You asked why someone would shoot someone for simply "throwing rocks" but I ask why in the hell is a foreign national assaulting our law enforcement? This makes no sense to me.



A stolen SSN is a valid SSN. SSN's are not that expensive and if you get hooked up with the right people when crossing the boarder for a bit extra you can get papers.


And what are they talking about the "rights of immigrants". If you are crossing the Rio what rights do you have? You are commenting a crime according to our laws. I don't get to do whatever I want in another country simply because I am escaping a shitty situation. No one else gives a fuck. The requirments for imigrating to Mexico are much more stringent. As are the penalties for overstaying or entering illegally.

Sleeper cells? wow really? I guess.

If the employer is paying with a check then there is taxes being collected, now if the employer is paying cash the he is also evading taxes.

Have you ever been in a fight? you just dont kill the other person with what ever you grab, you beat there ass and thats it. you dont kill them.

A stolen SS isnt a valid one buddy, I dont care who you are but everybody especially the government asks for multiple VALID forms of ID. Do you know the definition of Valid??

your missing the point. This isnt about a american killing a mexican. Its the fact that a human killed another human for no reason. Just because your illegal dosent mean your no longer human.
 
absolutely.
i wouldnt go throw rocks at a local police officer, let alone a border guard. its plain fucking stupid, and i would expect nothing less than to get shot at.
in the report, they werent throwing little pebbles, they were throwing good sized stones. it wouldnt take a big one to put a person out of commission.



i see more than enough illegals in my area getting government assistance of some kind. i see plenty of them with forged papers that work just as well as my legit ones.







if a man is throwing a rock at me with the intent to harm me, then yes, if i had the possession of the correct weaponry at the time, i would aim and fire, with no care nor concern for where it hits that person. the more damage the better. its called self preservation.
if it did so happen to kill him, maybe he should have been smart enough to not attempt to harm an armed person.

darwins law at its finest.



just because you choose to make yourself blind to certain situations does not make them non-existent. this is an issue, this is a very serious issue about our country and the security of it remaining to be the thing it was founded to be.



thats just plain retarded.



rock or grenade, does not matter, if it is used with wrong intent, then the person better be prepared to suffer the consequences. also, are you certain that you are taking into account the location of where this happened? this wasnt some inner city local affair, this happened across national borders, it does make it a bit more serious.

The kid was 15! it wasnt a grown man. how many stupid things did you do when you were 15? In riots people throw rocks, sticks, glass bottles, and other deadly objects. you dont see them busting out a .50 cal and mowing them all down.

If you can tell they are forged papers I dont see why the employer dose not. Its stupid that they still hire them.

Its not called self preservation, its called being irresponsible. Next time a 15 year old kid throws a rock at you, you shoot him dead and see if that dosent get you a life of prison.

I know it makes things more serious, it happened last week too, why would you put yourself in the same situation over and over?

its not ok, it will never be ok, it dosent matter who it is. Its not ok to kill someone because they threw a rock at you.
 
the human killed another human because he was put in a situation where force was required.

you're also running off of the assumption that he was in fact shooting to kill. he could have been aiming low to just stop, and not kill, and the kid move at the last second to cause the bullet to go astray.

when i was 15, i was damn smart enough to know not to go assaulting officers.

the kid put himself in a situation in which the consequences were very very great. the kid made the decision that ultimately ended his life.
age means nothing here. he was stupid. he did a stupid thing, and he suffered the consequence for it.

would you go throw stones (not just little rocks, good sized stones that could do damage) at an armed international border guard? on a border that ties are being stretched further and further everyday?

i dont think you would.
i believe that you are much smarter than that. because, you know, that if you threw rocks going to the other side, you would be shot at too. maybe you would get lucky and be missed, but it wouldnt be for a lack of trying.


edit: it sounds like you are in the mindset of them throwing little rocks that wouldnt do much.
they were throwing big ones. ones big enough to kill.


Self preservation is the highest law.
period.
it is perfectly ok to kill if your life is in danger. that is why we have self defense laws.
 
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and i couldnt tell that they were fake docs.
i only know because i was told.

i wouldnt be able to tell that they were faked unless i studied them for a little while.

and most places that ask for them, they dont study them. they look them over real fast and get through with what they have to get through. bc most of the time, they have a whole huge line that they have to get through before the end of the day. they dont have the time nor the resources to properly distinguish the forged from the legal.
 
Sleeper cells? wow really? I guess.

Yes, really

If the employer is paying with a check then there is taxes being collected, now if the employer is paying cash the he is also evading taxes.

So two wrongs make it right? Or its okay because someone else is breaking the law as well?

Have you ever been in a fight? you just dont kill the other person with what ever you grab, you beat there ass and thats it. you dont kill them.

Have you ever tried to subdue and arrest potentially violent individuals who are entering a country illegally with political tension so high you can see it when you look across the Rio? With a group of people on the other side of the river doing God knows what? You are over simplifying the situation. This wasn't a frat party brawl. These are not normal every day circumstances.

A stolen SS isnt a valid one buddy, I dont care who you are but everybody especially the government asks for multiple VALID forms of ID. Do you know the definition of Valid??

You do understand how identity theft works right?

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/04/world/americas/04iht-id.2688618.html

You do not receive a letter in the mail when someone steals your SSN notifying you it is no longer valid.

your missing the point. This isnt about a american killing a mexican. Its the fact that a human killed another human for no reason. Just because your illegal dosent mean your no longer human.

Again you are over simplifying to an extreme extent.
 
why does everybody take things as arguments.

the people in this country have lost all knowledge of friendly debates.

Just don't want people to get upset. Thats all. No hard feelings, you know what I mean?

I do plan on going to a meet some day, don't want people holding a grudge.
 
Im not gonna sit here and argue over the internet. you win.

but arguing over the intardnet is fun :)

Back to your original comment on my post, i was referring primarily to health care. My wife is a patient care tech at a local hospital and they had an illegal in the other week. he broke his leg hopping the border, walked on it for 2 days, until he could walk on it no more. Border patrol found him, picked him up, took him to the hospital. The ended up having to take him to surgery to repair his broken leg. He was in the hospital for 5 days post surgery, and the doctors refused to release him into custody of border patrol agents until he had a walker. now if that isnt leaching, please, tell me what is.

On the other hand, my mother in law had heart surgery earlier this month.. She ended up in the ICU for 9 days before she passed away due to complications during surgury. The expected medical bills are in the neighborhood of $500,000 pre insurance. Now, granted his surgury was probably a lot cheaper, and his stay in the hospital was for 4 days less.. but even so, he got his for free and my father in law is due a bill that is for more then twice the value of his house. She was born here, grew up here, worked here and payed taxes here for 35 years. The mexican spent 7 days here illegally, never payed taxes and somehow walked away with getting his leg fixed for free.. Oh, they also gave him a free bus ride back home too.

now tell me, how is this fair or even remotely justifiable?
 
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your missing the point. This isnt about a american killing a mexican. Its the fact that a human killed another human for no reason. Just because your illegal dosent mean your no longer human.

You missed the point.

A rock can kill a man.

Throw one at me, and i'll shoot you just the same to protect myself from any more boldly harm.

Righteous kill.


I don't care if it was a soldier and a kid, a grandma and a robber, or two gangsters going at it. the situation and the end effect is the same, and justified.
 
Just don't want people to get upset. Thats all. No hard feelings, you know what I mean?

I do plan on going to a meet some day, don't want people holding a grudge.

I don't think anyone would have any hard feelings. Just a discussion about a very tense situation. Read back through all of the political threads in the past. This is one of the most civil forums I have ever come across when it comes to debates remaining debates and not breaking down into shit throwing contests.
 
what happened to the good old days when two people got into a fight and no guns were pulled of shot ? people these days are not man enough to take or receive a good ass whooping.(not tlkng bout anyone in perticular here). i see on the news all the time bout drive bys two or three in the past month one in birmingham and one in huntsville. im not sayin i wouldnt shoot anyone if my life felt threatened. but only if that was the case. man i miss the old days where u gave an recieved a ass whooping and a few days later both involved was talking again.... .

i mean if someone tried to break into my house then hope they got a vest on...lol
 
Drive bys are gang related. They stopped park fights when they started dealing. Check out the documentry Bloods and Crips Made in America.

Cell Video of the incident:

Cell phone video of border shooting surfaces - CNN.com

havnt had a chance to check it out. I'm at a confrence here in Salt Lake so I will be watching it this evening and posting my thoughts on it.
 
minorities in MA receive handouts all the time. its cheaper than calling immigration. and trust me. if you lived in central massachusetts you would understand that being white is a cultural minority...

again, why is it that someone here on a green card can get govt housing, food stamps, and the govt supplies them with a means to a job but my girlfriend who is a single mother, makes less than 15K a year, does not qualify for any govt help except for free daycare? who is in the negative every week with no means to pull herself out short of moving in with me? fuck this state.

why is it that people on welfare AND minorities are riding around in nicer cars than mine and live in nicer places than i do and i make 75K a year. doesnt make any sense to me. ship them all the fuck out if they are here illegally. lets call this term "proper outsourcing". free up jobs for natural citizens who actually were born and raised in this country, or LEGAL immigrants.
 
Drive bys are gang related. They stopped park fights when they started dealing. Check out the documentry Bloods and Crips Made in America.

Cell Video of the incident:

Cell phone video of border shooting surfaces - CNN.com

havnt had a chance to check it out. I'm at a confrence here in Salt Lake so I will be watching it this evening and posting my thoughts on it.

cant reallly tell whats going on in the video other than one dude pointing something at another.. maybe when u watch it u can make better sense of it ... ill have to check out that documentry bout the bloods n crips
 
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