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Rebuilding an LS/VTEC because of a busted rod...

Discussion in 'Engine Building' started by daily interlude, Aug 14, 2005.

  1. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    A friend of a friend has an LS/VTEC that has blown a rod (forged rod at that). He removed the head and had it refinished/redone. He delivered the car with the old busted block and tranny still installed, head from the machine shop dissassembled, new JDM head and block and then all necessary parts to do the swap (head gasket kit, water pump, timing belt, etc.)

    I've just finished the job and the car is running good. He's picking it up in a few days for his appointment to get it retuned.

    My question is what should a fair labor charge be? Here's a list of what I've done.
    1. pulled old block and tranny
    2. pulled jdm head of block
    3. installed reconditioned head on JDM block (Cams, vtec solenoid and what ever else could be removed)
    4. reinstalled all parts removed from the head (even the intake studs where removed) using all new gaskets/seals
    5. swapped clutch and flywheel
    6. reinstalled complete motor
    7. fixed leaking injector and leaking fuel line on rear of car

    There's more I had to deal with which I'm forgetting but they are minor issues typical with a swap. A big headache was that the head was removed and there was a few nuts and other things missing and of course unfamiliarity of the custom wiring (would have helped if I was there when it was removed).

    So basically, how much should a friend of a friend charge on this job that was delivered in pieces?

    Now understand I probably won't get what the job was worth and I don't really expect to. Just wondering what would be considered fair...
     
  2. 97CTR

    97CTR Senior Member

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    depends on how good of a friend, and if you are willing to give some money back if the motor takes a dump.
     
  3. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    Well, I don't know the guy personally. He didn't help with any labor either.

    No money will be "given back" if the motor dies. There's nothing I can do (or should be held responsible for) as I didn't provide the parts other than labor related. If it was labor/workmanship related, I'll work with him the best I can to fix it.

    Essentially, no warranty is available as I'm not a shop... :roll:
     
  4. erebunicrx

    erebunicrx my name is Dale

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    how long did it take you and how much do you like working on other peoples cars?
     
  5. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

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    if you aren't a shop... probably a couple hundred?? i dunno..

    you probably should have agreed on a price before starting work.
     
  6. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    Well, if it's worth my while, then I like to work on cars. :thumbsup:

    This one took longer than it should have. An ARP stud broke and I had to wait on a replacement and have the stud removed from the block. Then add in the fact that I do it in my spare time (work and family too).

    It took 3 weeks (8 days was wasted waiting on the replacement. I was out of town from Friday to Sun one weekend and had plans the other so I didn't work on it except for weekdays). Thinking back, I spent 2 days before the stud incident, 2 days before going out of town, and 3 days after so I worked on it for 7 nights (about 4 hours each night or so).
     
  7. formby

    formby learning in progress

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    1. pulled old block and tranny.......$50

    2. pulled jdm head of block...........$30

    3. installed reconditioned head on JDM block (Cams, vtec solenoid and what ever else could be removed)............$50

    4. reinstalled all parts removed from the head (even the intake studs where removed)
    using all new gaskets/seals..........$40

    5. swapped clutch and flywheel ...........$35

    6. reinstalled complete motor.......$75

    7. fixed leaking injector and leaking fuel line on rear of car.........$35
     
  8. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    200? Come on. Be serious now. This job would cost 1500+ at most shops.

    I know we should have discussed prior. Our friend gave him an unreal expectation of 300 for the whole job. :eek:
     
  9. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    I was thinking more along the lines of maybe half or a bit less what a shop would charge. Like 600 or so for all...
     
  10. formby

    formby learning in progress

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    600 is okay i guess
     
  11. phyregod

    phyregod !!YTINASNI

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    ALWAYS discuss beforehand... Now you are in a shitty uncomfortable position. "Friend" adds to the problem.

    Parts+500 bucks. Its a hell of a good deal. Friend discount included.
     
  12. daily interlude

    daily interlude Prelude Guru

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    I'm not worried if he doesn't give me any more. I was just wondering. I should have asked around before hand but live and learn.

    I don't let this kind of stuff get to me. :thumbsup:

    Thanks for you input though! ;)
     
  13. integraslut78

    integraslut78 Stylus DJ Extraordinaire

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    That sounds pretty fair Phyregod.
     
  14. adnoh

    adnoh Senior Member

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    Well to compare, up here a typical stright up swap costs about $1K cdn. including all fluids.

    To put together an LS/VTEC would cost about $2K

    I'd say take no less than $650 for everything. Just write up a proper invoice, and put in as much detail as you can.
    Example:

    Your Name

    Your buddies name, and mailing address.

    Description of Labour Performed.

    1. pulled old block and tranny - XXX Hours
    2. pulled jdm head of block - XXX Hours
    3. installed reconditioned head on JDM block (Cams, vtec solenoid and what ever else could be removed) - XXX Hours
    4. reinstalled all parts removed from the head (even the intake studs where removed) using all new gaskets/seals - XXX Hours
    5. swapped clutch and flywheel - XXX Hours
    6. reinstalled complete motor - XXX Hours
    7. fixed leaking injector and leaking fuel line on rear of car - XXX Hours

    Total Labour: XXX Hours
    Hourly Rate: Divide your hours by the price you want to charge
    Total: $XXX.XX

    Buddies Signature: _______________________________
    VIN: ____________________________________
    Year/Make/Model: ___________________________
    Mileage: ____________________________

    Then A Disclaimer if you want.........Maybe something about you not being responsible for damaged parts due to misuse or wear/tear, but will honor workmanship claims....be creative, but mean what you say and say what you mean.

    Make a photocopy of it, or just print out two of them and have him sign both copies. You get the point....just have shit in writing so it doesn't bite you in the ass later on.

    Then before you give him the invoice, go through it all with him and explain. If you have any broken parts from the build laying around, keep them, and show them to him...explain why/how it broke. Give him the keys and let him take it for a spin. Go along in the passenger seat if you want. Make sure he's satisfied with your work, BEFORE you have him sign off on it.

    Just my $02
     
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