Discussion in 'Engine Building' started by Ignorant import guy, Dec 5, 2006.
who makes the best sleeves for a d16 and where is the best place to get them?
well i plan on eventually pushing 10 psi and 15 sometimes...just researching now though...my final goal is to close to 230whp give or take a few
You don't need to resleeve for 230whp.
yeah man stock engines have no problem pushing that out. if your looking for more than 600 i would say sleeve it.
id think about resleeving before 600hp but for only 230 it would be a waste of money. sleeve it and shoot for 400hp outta that d series.
well here's my entire plan for the car maybe this will help...eventually t25 or t3 turbo, crower stage 2 cam, valve springs and retainers, venom or skunk2 intake manifold, hp throttle bodie (not sure which one yet), aem fuel rail, aem fuel pressure rgulator, 310 cc injectors, weisco turbo pistons, eagle rods, and a port and polish job...now i'm not sure how much horsepower that will actually make but that's my setup in the future and i thought it might ned sleeves...i just need my car to last as long it it possibly will
are you building a turbo or all motor car cause damn you have things that are not needed for a turbo street car. you dont need a bigger tb, intake mani, cams or valvetrain, or port and polish. those are mostly n/a parts and race turbo parts. dont get me wrong all of those will help but for your hp goals those parts are a little bit of over kill. espically if you are going for 230 whp.
well that's the setup i want to eventually reach...i would like to be able to push like 15 psi out of my car...i just don't my engine to get damaged and i heard the more you do the less chance there is of the turbo breaking something...i'd rather be safe than sorry...and with that setup how much whp would that be...i mean it can't be too much more can it?
ya lets see intake mani 230, tb 200, headwork 1000, cams and valve train at least 800, cam gears 300 etc etc etc. with only 15 psi a sleeved block with some good pistons and rods will suffice just fine. like i said this is not a race motor. you are not squeezing everything you can. by making the air passage larger you will loose velocity. you are going to be "forcing" air down the throat of the motor so opening it up really isnt nedded espically headwork! what they meant by doing more they probably meant in the way of building the bottom end not the head.
well what suggestions do you guys have...you guys are the experts and i am looking for some actual knowledge without being yelled at for being retarded
if 230 whp is you goal, you can easily use a stock block and an off the shelf turbo kit, or make your own, just spend a few bucks and get it professionally tuned.
for more power, a set of tuner toys rods, with your choice of forged pistons (hell, even vitaras would work), along with a fresh set of seals and gaskets will be plenty of building for a street setup, and should be good for 400 whp. leave the head stock, and with a nice turbo kit and again, good tuning, you can have a reliable, daily driven 300 whp car.
dont neglect your tranny, an lsd, while expensive, is one of the best mods you can do. and with turbo torque and torque steer, having the lsd is even more important. a decent set of brake pads on fresh rotors, some suspension work, etc should be done if your going to drive the car hard.
are these a good set of sleeves...they seem cheap and since they're on ebay i'm kinda skeptical eBay Motors: JGE D-SERIES PERFORMANCE SLEEVES (item 230046581889 end time Jan-01-07 12:17:31 PST)
I want you to read the following link before you ask anymore questions about sleeves:
Block Posts - Endyn Block Post Kits
I don't know as much about D-Series after-market parts as I do about B-Series, so I'm not too sure about the availability of a block girdle for D-Series engines. What I do know is that the D16A6 factory girdle is the strongest available for D-Series engines from the manufacturer and I've recommended using them in every turbo-D application I've been asked for assistance on. It's cheap, plentiful and handles power reasonably well. Before you ask, NO, I don't have any figures on what a D16A6 block girdle can handle as far as HP, TQ or PSI goes, I don't know where to find those figures either (Google maybe?). What I can tell you is that it is of solid one-piece construction as MOST (I believe this doesn't apply to the Z6 girdle) from the factory are made from multiple pieces. I believe it's also made of a stronger metal than MOST of the factory ones available, as well. Buy one.
Between that girdle and the block posts, you'll have just about all of the rigidity in the bottom end that you will need, which leaves the rotating assembly. After inspection, the crank should be balanced (NOT lightened, lightening is typically the best for NA applications and forced induction sees more benefits from a balanced, but still weighted crank). Do NOT use an after-market crank pulley. Use an OE piece in good condition until Fluidampr releases a D-Series line up sometime early this coming year You'll need a lightweight flywheel to pair with all of this, as their construction\machining process typically balances them during creation, as well as the fact that it improves acceleration somewhat. With that, you should get an FX300 (or comparable set) from ClutchMasters, if not from another company, just make sure your clutch and pressure plate are capable of handling MORE than you anticipate producing power-wise, then you have room to gain power without changing it out.
I'd personally select H-Beam rods from either Crower or Eagle.
I'd also personally keep my static compression in the 9.5-10:1 range. Most people suggest 9.0:1 pretty universally, regardless of the setup due to the decreased likelihood of catastrophic failure during tuning or use. I however, believe in building well and tuning even better and I think that 10-11:1 should be achievable as static compression ratios. Compression MAKES POWER.
The reason why people stoop lower for their compression is because once you are shoving that compressed air through the intake, the effective compression ratio of the engine changes. The static compression ratio is the engines mechanical (parts based) actual compression. So when you're at 9:1, and you add 10psi, it makes for an effective ratio of like 15:1 (there's a calculator for this, I'm just using examples that don't add up, believe me).
So, in all actuality, your running the compression ratio of a built NA race engine! Higher compression is harder to tune properly without having significant issues with detonation on the dyno alone, let alone the street, so these circumstances become undesirable for most low budget builders, that's why most tuners lower their static (parts based) compression ratio to 9:1 (one of the best ratios to use, lower is sometimes less effective, higher is harder to tune), effectively REDUCING their OVERALL compression once the turbo is added.
However, I've seen many successful turbo-charged B16A and B18C5 applications running near or at their stock compression and turning out impressive numbers with excellent reliability tuned out, on the correct gas. Two of the largest power affecting elements of an IC Engine are compression, and displacement, do NOT forget this while building.
All of that was said prior to the piston selection advice to make sure you understand some things.
I'd recommend you run a 9:0-10.0:1 piston, of forged variety. I recommend using Total Seal piston rings, and making sure they are indexed and gapped prior to installation. You may even consider a SLIGHT overbore (I don't know what the "81.5mm" magic number is for D-Series, someone help me here) so be sure you select the correct size diameter pistons, and that the piston to wall clearance is well worked out prior to running it. Don't let manufacturers fool you into buying their bling pistons either for some extra money on top of the cost of their normal pistons or anything like that. There's actually a process you can use to establish a good finish on your pistons which can "free-up" some power for you, it's found on ENDYN's website (one example had netted them I believe 28 HP, just by removing the SHINE from the piston heads!)
As far as your block is concerned, with all of that stuff, you'll be good for around 15-20psi without sweating it when you hit the throttle. You do NOT need sleeves for your application, this bottom end alone should be good for a little over 300 to the wheels.
Regarding the head, get a 3-5 angle valve job, do NOT touch your ports (except for maybe ensuring the exhaust ports are slightly smaller than the header flanges openings, and doing the opposite for the intake side to minimize reversion, and also pissibly clean up any casting abnormalities etc.. Also, this is a good time to work that stuff out and avoid issues like intake and exhaust manifold gaskets with "lips" that hang in the way of air flow, make sure your gaskets are properly trimmed or all of this work could be worthless) as you do not need to spend that kind of money on this application to make the power you are looking for. The valve seat grinding will help improve combustion efficiency, effectively improving your situation, without spending a shitload of money. This will make the engine healthier\more reliable\more powerful\easier to tune in the end, but it doesn't cost the same as expensive port work.
Your cam should ideally be creating MORE power for you BEFORE the turbo hits it's max boost pressure, which shortens the time it takes to get their and gives you some low end. You're looking at a lot of "Stage 1" type stuff for the head to be perfectly honest. You don't need a major cam for your app, just one that can handle the revs and power demands of YOU. Get the LEAST you can get away with for the cam\valvetrain, buying more than that is simply wasting money without port work.
The valvetrain needs stiffer springs, titanium retainers, stock or 1mm oversized valves (basic stage 1s) and that's about it. Running largely oversized valves, springs that are too stiff, or not enough, and weak retainers all be things that you want to avoid, this is just 300WHP, not a race engine. Besides, this should give you a little more room and a few more revs than you currently need, so future upgrades would actually max this stuff out to it's full potential and leave not much more power to be had in head parts. After that, the power to be had will in port work.
Make sure your fuel pressure is adjustable and that it's coming in adequate supply. Use RC Engineering injectors of a smaller than 450cc size, a B+M\AEM Adj. FPR and a fuel pump. I don't see the need for a larger fuel rail in this application, but someone PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong so he doesn't starve for fuel, lol
Naturally, use an adj. Cam Gear.
Try using the 96 Y8 intake manifold and TB, that's all you'll need for intake stuff really. No real machine work required there.
I'd suggest finding a Motorola 2.5 BAR MAP Sensor, my friend sells small machined flanges to install them on your throttle body.
I honestly wouldn't fuck with your ignition that much, you probably won't need much over stock. I only can recommend MSD products in good conscience. Perhaps a set of 8.5mm wires from them to start, and if the spark is getting blown out, either keep tuning it on the dyno until it works, or if it doesn't and you need more ignition stuff, at least buy it from MSD.
I'm going to highly suggest a gear-type LSD. Phantom Grip's bolt on crap has been known to break, Quaife's basically some of the best out there. From what I've heard, OBX is one of the only replica companies that actually makes real replicas, not just copies of items with weaker materials, try them for an LSD, it'll be like $300 to Quaife's 900 ish.
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