Taxpayers pay for 72 million bonus

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Originally posted by New2TheCarScene@May 12 2005, 11:24 AM
Who says they didn't remain impartial?
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We do, because it's our duty as Americans to question the government at every turn.
 
fixed income doesn't mean anything for bonuses though. a bonus is a 1-time thing and can be any percent of a salary.
 
all ignorant people please read:

source is CBS news, based on a report by the congressional research service

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/09/26/...ain575356.shtml


(CBS/AP) A report by the Congressional Research Service undermines Vice President Dick Cheney's denial of a continuing relationship with Halliburton Co., the energy company he once led, Sen. Frank Lautenberg said Thursday.

The report says a public official's unexercised stock options and deferred salary fall within the definition of "retained ties" to his former company.

Cheney said Sunday on NBC that since becoming vice president, "I've severed all my ties with the company, gotten rid of all my financial interest. I have no financial interest in Halliburton of any kind and haven't had, now, for over three years."

Democrats pointed out that Cheney receives deferred compensation from Halliburton under an arrangement he made in 1998, and also retains stock options. He has pledged to give after-tax proceeds of the stock options to charity.

Cheney's aides defended the assertion on NBC, saying the financial arrangements do not constitute a tie to the company's business performance. They pointed out that Cheney took out a $15,000 insurance policy so he would collect the deferred payments over five years whether or not Halliburton remains in business.

Lautenberg, D-N.J., asked the Congressional Research Service to weigh in.
Without naming Cheney or Halliburton, the service reported that unexercised stock options and deferred salary "are among those benefits described by the Office of Government Ethics as 'retained ties' or 'linkages' to one's former employer."
Lautenberg said the report makes clear that Cheney does still have financial ties to Halliburton. "I ask the vice president to stop dodging the issue with legalese," Lautenberg said.

Cathie Martin, Cheney's spokeswoman, said the question is whether Cheney has any possible conflict of interest with Halliburton, "and the answer to that is, no."

Cheney was chief executive officer of Halliburton from 1995 through August 2000. The company's KBR subsidiary is the main government contractor working to restore Iraq's oil industry in an open-ended contract that was awarded without competitive bidding.

According to Cheney's 2001 financial disclosure report, the vice president's Halliburton benefits include three batches of stock options comprising 433,333 shares. He also has a 401(k) retirement account valued at between $1,001 and $15,000 dollars.

His deferred compensation account was valued at between $500,000 and $1 million, and generated income of $50,000 to $100,000.

In 2002, Cheney's total assets were valued at between $19.1 million and $86.4 million.

Earlier this month, a federal judge dismissed a lawsuit that accused Halliburton and Cheney of misleading investors by changing the way the company counted revenue from construction projects.

The lawsuit was filed last year by Judicial Watch, a conservative public interest group, on behalf of three small investors, who said the company tried to polish financial results by booking revenue on cost overruns before it was certain of getting paid.

Halliburton has contracts worth more than $1.7 billion for its work in Iraq, and it could make hundreds of millions more from a no-bid contract it was awarded by the Army Corps of Engineers, The Washington Post has reported.

According to The Post, while Cheney was defense secretary the Pentagon chose Halliburton subsidiary Brown & Root to study the cost effectiveness of outsourcing some military operations to private contractors. Based on the results of the study, the Pentagon hired Brown & Root to implement an outsourcing plan. Cheney became Halliburton CEO in 1995.
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Originally posted by New2TheCarScene@May 12 2005, 01:36 PM
You're silly if you don't believe that this war is any different from any other. We didn't care that the Nazis were killing 6 million jews until we got attacked, until we incurred economic losses and until they threatened our economic ties to allies.

I will say this however, I certainly don't believe that even though we're there for money we're not also there on ethic grounds.
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That's just not the case. We didn't even KNOW about the concentrations camps and such until well after the US entered WWII.


That said, i will agree on the monetary ties for both cases--- but in the case of WWII, it was for the well being of EVERYONE- the entire economy. not the president, vice president, and their friends.
 
As for going to war simply for money, do you think I'm going to deny this? Are you that ignorant to believe that every war wasn't based on economic gain? Why else would we fight over land? We're materialistic beings and always have been. Long before this country was founded people waged war for land which equated to money.
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but a gov't by the people for the people should not base war on money...

this money is not going TO THE PEOPLE, its going to big corporations...
not your average joe citizen, the same joe citizen thats risking his life in this god forsaken war...
 
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@May 12 2005, 12:38 PM
fixed income doesn't mean anything for bonuses though. a bonus is a 1-time thing and can be any percent of a salary.
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Unless there's an accounting loophole that I'm unaware of, a bonus is based upon work performance. Cheney is not working for the company, simply on the payrole...how then would he be entitled to any sort of bonus?
 
No Brian, read again. I even bolded it for you both. Its fixed. His income is fixed. As I pointed out after recked stopped reading when he saw all that he wanted, he is still receiving money from the company but its been fixed since 1999...meaning its not going to chance. He has an insurance policy that guarantees him that money, meaning it won't hurt him one bit finnacially if the company goes to ruins. He's getting the same coin now with the 72 million dollar bonus as he did before it.
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i saw the part about his insurance, but my claim still stands that cheney has an interest in halliburton according to the rules described by the Office of Government Ethics... FACT, prove me wrong

and STOCK OPTIONS are not fixed income...
do you know what stock options are???
stock options comprising 433,333 shares

he gets to buy the stock at a set price, the more the stocks value increases the more money he makes off of every share he options and sells...

so where's your no ties to halliburton theory now???
 
you can get a bonus for anything. theres no law that says you can't get a bonus. a bonus is something a boss or chair on the board gives to someone in the company for WHATEVER reason.... be it christmas, a good yearly return, or scamming the us gov't out of 72 million.
 
Halliburton is not a group of nice guys looking out for the worlds best interests. Perhaps you missed it when their subsidiary Kellog, Brown & Root overcharged America an estimated $61 Million for gasoline delivery in Iraq.
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last time i checked people who steal from their employer do not get bonuses, THEY GET FUCKING FIRED

multiple choice question
a. christmas bonus
b. good yearly return
c. scamming the us gov't out of 72 million

i'll take C...

ding ding ding,we have a winner!!
what do you win you may ask???
a free ass fucking for the US taxpayer...
 
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@May 12 2005, 12:41 PM

That's just not the case. We didn't even KNOW about the concentrations camps and such until well after the US entered WWII.


That said, i will agree on the monetary ties for both cases--- but in the case of WWII, it was for the well being of EVERYONE- the entire economy. not the president, vice president, and their friends.
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Basically its impossible for anyone to refute the monetary issue behind every war/conflict yet people still harp on the idea and act as if its something new. If you could make a buck, would you turn it down? I doubt it, so why then do you hold double standards for your government? "...because its our government and we just do" I don't think is justifyable.


...I'll tell you that Bush and his "friends" aren't the only people that are going to economically benefit from this war. If we get the oil that everyone seems to hate but everyone uses and it no longer costs us $2.25 a gallon then the general public will have benefited. If big business gets a contract to develope weapons or build thermuses or do this or do that, that just created more job opportunities than were available the day before. War causes productivity, productivity causes economic gain.
 
Basically its impossible for anyone to refute the monetary issue behind every war/conflict yet people still harp on the idea and act as if its something new. If you could make a buck, would you turn it down? I doubt it, so why then do you hold double standards for your government? "...because its our government and we just do" I don't think is justifyable.


...I'll tell you that Bush and his "friends" aren't the only people that are going to economically benefit from this war. If we get the oil that everyone seems to hate but everyone uses and it no longer costs us $2.25 a gallon then the general public will have benefited. If big business gets a contract to develope weapons or build thermuses or do this or do that, that just created more job opportunities than were available the day before. War causes productivity, productivity causes economic gain.
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ok, every war/conflict was based on money
BUT DOES THAT MAKE IT RIGHT?!?!?!
fuck no...

and i do not have double standards for our gov't...
this monetary gain does not affect you or me or any other joe citizen, it affects the elite...

ok, gas prices... how much have they gone up since the war started???
point proven WRONG YET AGAIN...

and jobs created???
how many jobs have been lost sicne the war started???
point proven WRONG ONE MORE TIME...
 
Originally posted by reckedracing@May 12 2005, 12:44 PM


i saw the part about his insurance, but my claim still stands that cheney has an interest in halliburton according to the rules described by the Office of Government Ethics... FACT, prove me wrong

and STOCK OPTIONS are not fixed income...
do you know what stock options are???
stock options comprising 433,333 shares

he gets to buy the stock at a set price, the more the stocks value increases the more money he makes off of every share he options and sells...

so where's your no ties to halliburton theory now???
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Basically the email you quoted proved my point and not yours, so I don't understand why you even posted it or cited it but whatever...

Has he sold the stocks? Does he still have his stock options to purchase more stocks or was that a one time deal before he took office? Was it Cheney's decision to give the company a bonus? Did Cheney say that we had to use Hailburton?

My point was and will continue to be that bonuses are given to practically every company that works for the government. Whats the difference if they give the company that the Vice President used to work for or another company?
 
Originally posted by reckedracing@May 12 2005, 12:51 PM
ok, every war/conflict was based on money
BUT DOES THAT MAKE IT RIGHT?!?!?!
fuck no...

and i do not have double standards for our gov't...
this monetary gain does not affect you or me or any other joe citizen, it affects the elite...

ok, gas prices... how much have they gone up since the war started???
point proven WRONG YET AGAIN...

and jobs created???
how many jobs have been lost sicne the war started???
point proven WRONG ONE MORE TIME...
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Who is still currently regulating gas prices? OPEC. Can we control if they price gouge the United States right now or would we first have to cease control of the oil? Thus right now we haven't benefited but if OPEC has to answer to the United States because we have our own wells in the Middleeast they sure as hell won't be price gouging any longer.


Job have been created since the start of the war. Other jobs have been lost, but the war has caused jobs to be created that wouldn't have otherwise been available. We wouldn't be building the weapons that we are now, researching, developing, manufacturing war supplies. These jobs would have never been created if it were not for the war.

Its a fact of life that war increases productivity. So no, not proven wrong.
 
The simple fact is that there is a conflict of interest. The congressional research service found that the connections that Cheney maintains constitute a tie to the company. It is as simple as that.
 
Originally posted by reckedracing@May 12 2005, 06:41 PM
this money is not going TO THE PEOPLE, its going to big corporations...
not your average joe citizen, the same joe citizen thats risking his life in this god forsaken war...
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I amn jjst going to chime in here for a sec if you don't mind. MILLIONS of people have interest in Halliburton. Since WWII all retirees of them and KBR have been drawing retirment pensions, these people for the most part are normal middle class folks that DO have a vested interest in Halliburtons survival. I know this because if Halli goes down, my mom loses a big chunk of change that was left by my grandfather, a former KBR employee after WWII. Just letting you know, that there are a LOT more average people reling on Halli and KBR than people like Dick. What he is getting is nothing compared to the amounts they pay out to non spotlighted persons.
 
About the gas price. We've supposedly gotten more from OPEC. However, the problem is refining it. There is only 5 refinaries in the US and they are all under some kind of corp. umbrella. You can only put out as much as you make.

And about war. Americans are just fucking stupid. They think everyone needs to be "free." They impose theyre beliefs on everyone and put a gun to their face if they dont. Hmm.. reminds me of the Great British Empire. Example. My family. We're a part of a small ethic group in S.E. About 1 million totaled in the world. During the Viet war, the Americans bite off more than can chew. What to do? Enlist the help of the locals. Big problem. The locals are farmers and dont know shit about fighting. Americans "train" these farmers and promise them of a big bright future. Democracy, land, yada yada. Americans lose the war and bail out. Wait what about the farmers? Theyre gonna get decapitated by the Viet Kongs for helping the G.I.s. I know make them trek 300 miles and cross the MeiKong River. There they can stay in "refugee" camps and be happy until we find them a home. The refugee camps are hell. you are imprisioned and the only food is sent from the U.S. aid. The locals hate the refugees because they're dirty and have no country. The lucky few like my parents managed to get residence here. But my parents have a grip load of family back in the "refugee" camps. However, many have bailed out and moved back even with the threat of being captured because those camps arent worth it. Theres more. Once here, many are too old to work. Too old to learn English. Maybe if they grew up in a semi modernized world they can learn. However, my parents and grand parents came from a place that has no tv, electricity, not even a fuckign written language. So my dad is stuck with no English and working as a janitor because he got lucky and got hooked up by local Christians. Hows that for being "free."

Dont get me wrong. Im very grateful for being here. Its just that not everyone wants to be like Americans. My grandparents want to move back. Here they understand nothing. Cant even grasp the concept that man can make cars. Many regret helping the G.I.s. Why dont they move back? If you want to die. Sure, go right ahead.
 
Originally posted by 92b16vx@May 12 2005, 04:40 PM
I amn jjst going to chime in here for a sec if you don't mind. MILLIONS of people have interest in Halliburton. Since WWII all retirees of them and KBR have been drawing retirment pensions, these people for the most part are normal middle class folks that DO have a vested interest in Halliburtons survival. I know this because if Halli goes down, my mom loses a big chunk of change that was left by my grandfather, a former KBR employee after WWII. Just letting you know, that there are a LOT more average people reling on Halli and KBR than people like Dick. What he is getting is nothing compared to the amounts they pay out to non spotlighted persons.
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:werd:

John and I most likely disagree politically on most of the stuff surrounding the circumstances of the Iraq war, but I do agree with him on this. Hell, shoot down Halliburton and you take my 401k with it. Mike needs his retirement money to keep growing.
 
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