What would be cheapest

Cheapest to make 300-350WHP Turboed (My car is D16Z6 right now)

  • D16Z6/D16Y8

    Votes: 3 18.8%
  • B18Ax/B1x LS

    Votes: 4 25.0%
  • B16xx

    Votes: 4 25.0%
  • B18Cx

    Votes: 5 31.3%

  • Total voters
    16

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PSI is relevant, it affects dynamic compression.

Power figures is actually a bad way to look at it; as it does not address how much torque is actually being put down. IE, a 300hp engine with 300lb-tq will probably see way more stress(cylinder pressures) than a 300hp 170lb-tq engine.
 
PSI is relevant, it affects dynamic compression.

Power figures is actually a bad way to look at it; as it does not address how much torque is actually being put down. IE, a 300hp engine with 300lb-tq will probably see way more stress(cylinder pressures) than a 300hp 170lb-tq engine.

Dynamic compression doesn't have anything to do with the durability of the piston, which turborex was addressing.

It just doesn't make sense to me to throw around PSI in such a crucial area of the build. There are too many variables in between the turbocharger and the combustion chamber to say "20 psi is the max that these pistons will withstand".
And generally a higher dynamic compression will yield more hp and tq, which will place more stress on the engine. My question is this, why would you start a build with setting a power goal if it were absolutely meaningless?
 
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dynamic compression effects the durability. Sure, there's more variables involved, but cylinder pressure is one of them. Just because there's many variables involved, that does not mean you can disregard them.

True, many people build their engines with a power goal...but there's many more who're more concerned about efficiency. Like, if your power goal was 700whp, but you're only hitting 600whp, would you just crank up the boost? Many people would say yes...but a tuner may just tweak the fuel settings. ie: Bisi actually gained 100whp in a Supra just from a tune.

Same with some All-Motor guys. Many will try to get the most out of their setups without replacing parts, etc. This is where small tweaks, etc. come into play. Again, there's no set power goal....just a question of "Can I get more power from my setup from just tweaking or changing small things".
 
Jesus here we go again, Im throwing in PSI because im talkin about how much dynamic compression MY STOCK SLEEVES are holding up.

Im sorry but i thought with enough PSI you could break something, guess i was wrong and PSI doesnt matter, shit ill just push 40PSI since its not a variable or anything.
 
dynamic compression effects the durability. Sure, there's more variables involved, but cylinder pressure is one of them. Just because there's many variables involved, that does not mean you can disregard them.

True, many people build their engines with a power goal...but there's many more who're more concerned about efficiency. Like, if your power goal was 700whp, but you're only hitting 600whp, would you just crank up the boost? Many people would say yes...but a tuner may just tweak the fuel settings. ie: Bisi actually gained 100whp in a Supra just from a tune.

Same with some All-Motor guys. Many will try to get the most out of their setups without replacing parts, etc. This is where small tweaks, etc. come into play. Again, there's no set power goal....just a question of "Can I get more power from my setup from just tweaking or changing small things".

I understand that, but I've always been told (and read) that what really puts strain on an engine is the power it is producing. Exactly why it is safer to run an engine slightly richer than it is lean, sure you could make more power, but you risk detonation. Correct? And dynamic compression seems to be a factor in how much an engine will produce. Two identical engines except one has a higher dynamic compression than the other, the higher compression engine is going to produce more power. Correct?

I'm all about getting more out of a setup. There's a reason I put methanol injection on my setup. There's a reason I have a guy who's been working with CROME for 5+ years tuning my car. A power goal in my eyes is just something to build the engine to handle. An example.. its not really realistic (didn't say not possible) to run 500-600whp on a bone stock B18B. It's possible I'm sure, but I'd imagine it would not be realistic nor reliable. That's all I'm saying.
 
Im sorry but i thought with enough PSI you could break something, guess i was wrong and PSI doesnt matter, shit ill just push 40PSI since its not a variable or anything.

Sure you could. Throw enough at an engine and it'll make enough power to break something. Or maybe it'll run lean and detonate.

You're misunderstanding my point completely.
 
Sure you could. Throw enough at an engine and it'll make enough power to break something. Or maybe it'll run lean and detonate.

You're misunderstanding my point completely.


Im gettin tired of your coming out of no where to bash my posts if i throw in my two cents and even mention the word PSI.

I never said you didnt have a good point, but obviouslly i have a point too. Its good to think about dynamic and static compression when thinkin about a build. You choose too high of compression piston and mix in too much PSI, you could be looking at a deadly combination. Am i right? Ive seen a formula around here somwhere that will show you how to determine how high of compression you will be running when your at 5, 10, 15PSI. I think that would be useful to know when building a car, especially for those learning.
 
Jesus here we go again, Im throwing in PSI because im talkin about how much dynamic compression MY STOCK SLEEVES are holding up.

Im sorry but i thought with enough PSI you could break something, guess i was wrong and PSI doesnt matter, shit ill just push 40PSI since its not a variable or anything.

of course PSI is a variable, the point is that you don't go building an engine for boost pressure, you build it based on a specific HP goal.

The cylinder pressure during combustion is going to obiviously be far higher then the boost pressuring you're running anyway, especially if it you start detonating.
 
Im gettin tired of your coming out of no where to bash my posts if i throw in my two cents and even mention the word PSI.

I never said you didnt have a good point, but obviouslly i have a point too. Its good to think about dynamic and static compression when thinkin about a build. You choose too high of compression piston and mix in too much PSI, you could be looking at a deadly combination. Am i right? Ive seen a formula around here somwhere that will show you how to determine how high of compression you will be running when your at 5, 10, 15PSI. I think that would be useful to know when building a car, especially for those learning.

Aw, I'm sorry you're getting tired of it. That really sucks.

I know it is good to think about. I wrote about it in my thread, I know that static and dynamic compression matter.

Here's the way I see it (we'll look at it in a turbo'd app since most of us here are interested in that area, and say for both engines the setup is exactly the same, only difference is the static compression):
Higher static compression will make the same amount of power on less PSI.

It will take more from the turbo to produce that same amount of power on a lower static compression engine, because the compression is lower to begin with.

This is a common thing to do, at least in my area. We have a few cars running around with LSVTEC builds and close to 10.0:1 static compression and a decently sized turbo. It's all in the tune, just as was stated before.
 
Aw, I'm sorry you're getting tired of it. That really sucks.

I know it is good to think about. I wrote about it in my thread, I know that static and dynamic compression matter.

Here's the way I see it (we'll look at it in a turbo'd app since most of us here are interested in that area, and say for both engines the setup is exactly the same, only difference is the static compression):
Higher static compression will make the same amount of power on less PSI.

It will take more from the turbo to produce that same amount of power on a lower static compression engine, because the compression is lower to begin with.

This is a common thing to do, at least in my area. We have a few cars running around with LSVTEC builds and close to 10.0:1 static compression and a decently sized turbo. It's all in the tune, just as was stated before.

Well thats what i plan to change in my setup, my static compression. Right now mine is 8.1:1 and i want to raise it to about 9:1 or 10:1, because i know a higher static compression will create more power with less effort from a turbo.
 
You don't necessarily want to build for just a power goal, but rather torque goal also. You don't build around how much PSI you want to run, but have to consider it. This is the point I was trying to get at by comparing two engines with different torque levels but the same horse power. For example, you're goal is 500whp; if you have a engine that makes that power at 6800rpm chances are it's seeing much higher cylinder pressures than an engine that makes that power at around 8200rpm. We can already assume the 6800rpm has more torque(386lb-ft vs.
320lb-ft at their given rpm).

That motor with higher dynamic compression may not always make more power; but given similar engines chances are it will also make more power. What we do know, is that the engine with higher dynamic compression would make more peak torque. Horsepower can somewhat be moved around by moving our torque band around(peak torque figures would be similar but HP would change).

BTW, as far as air/fuel ratio goes, the most power is usually around rich anyways(for performance our cars are tuned between ~11-13.8 AFR).
 
I can't believe that people vote a B18C and B16A build (for that high of hp) as being the cheapest.....if so....please fill me in and I'll build my B16

I voted B18A/B w/turbo

I am not that knowledgable about turbo but I was always told that (in laments terms) forced induction raises your compression as boost spools. Someone educate me if I'm wrong
 
Yes, the dynamic compression goes up(coincides with how much pressure you're boosting).
 
Well thats what i plan to change in my setup, my static compression. Right now mine is 8.1:1 and i want to raise it to about 9:1 or 10:1, because i know a higher static compression will create more power with less effort from a turbo.
Makes sense.
You don't necessarily want to build for just a power goal, but rather torque goal also. You don't build around how much PSI you want to run, but have to consider it. This is the point I was trying to get at by comparing two engines with different torque levels but the same horse power. For example, you're goal is 500whp; if you have a engine that makes that power at 6800rpm chances are it's seeing much higher cylinder pressures than an engine that makes that power at around 8200rpm. We can already assume the 6800rpm has more torque(386lb-ft vs.
320lb-ft at their given rpm).

That motor with higher dynamic compression may not always make more power; but given similar engines chances are it will also make more power. What we do know, is that the engine with higher dynamic compression would make more peak torque. Horsepower can somewhat be moved around by moving our torque band around(peak torque figures would be similar but HP would change).

BTW, as far as air/fuel ratio goes, the most power is usually around rich anyways(for performance our cars are tuned between ~11-13.8 AFR).

Well yes, obviously the torque number is not as significant in Honda's, since most of the power is produced at greater than 5k, at least in my build..

I've always considred 11's a bit rich.. my cars AFR's were steady 12.1-12.5 in boost
 
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