GM cuts 25,000 jobs!!!

Battle Pope

Well-Known Member
They're going in the toilet faster than a coathanger abortion.

If they don't figure out a way to cut benefit costs and increase revenue per vehicle, we might be down to the "Big Two".
 

cheese9988

Senior Member
VIP
No.......that could effect my job, I do calibration for Delphi, most of thier business still comes from GM. :(
 

posol

RETIRED
Staff member
they need to get their act together and make a car that doesn't suck.

let's compare mid-priced sedans... something our mom's would drive.
~20-25-ish nicely equipped

toyota camry
honda accord
pontiac grand am/G6
nissan altima
chevy malibu
chevy mote carlo


i think thats a fair list of the more common cars in that price range

the camry-- best selling car for like 15 years or so... and theres a reason for it. reliability, nice interior, comfortable, enough pep for mom.

the accord - new body lines, lots of options, nice seats/interior, sporty, yet classy.. and now availble with a hybrid for even better MPG and more power from the assist.

the altima -- nice interior, nice new body, hid's, tons of options, tons f colors, nice seats, etc etc

the mailbu- looks like ass, slow as fuck, monekys could make a better car.

the mote carlo- out dated design, mom doesn't want to drive a "nascar" body kit POS, the interior is crap, the reliabilty is crap, and its over priced for what you get. not to mention, shitty gas mileage.

the grand am... see above. other than hints at a new design, its STILL the same body it was in 1994.


theres a connection here.

if GM made a decent car that didin't suck, they might be on to something.

they WERE on to something with the 400 hp GTo... but the base model starts at 32k, and speced with a manual tranny and non gay stuff, you're up to 36-38k out the door. why? you can buy a 1 year old bmw for that price, or an STi/Evo with 6k in mods.

no one wants to spend more money for less car.

thats why GM is going under.

dodge realized this, and put out a bunch of new shit over the past few years, and they are back in the game hard.

gm answers the srt-4 with the colbalt???
gm answers the hemi-powered cars with the SSR???

i mean, seriously... their design crew are fuktards.
 

cheese9988

Senior Member
VIP
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@Jun 7 2005, 12:12 PM
they need to get their act together and make a car that doesn't suck.

let's compare mid-priced sedans... something our mom's would drive.
~20-25-ish nicely equipped

toyota camry
honda accord
pontiac grand am/G6
nissan altima
chevy malibu
chevy mote carlo


i think thats a fair list of the more common cars in that price range

the camry--  best selling car for like 15 years or so...  and theres a reason for it.  reliability, nice interior, comfortable, enough pep for mom.

the accord - new body lines, lots of options, nice seats/interior, sporty, yet classy..  and now availble with a hybrid for even better MPG and more power from the assist. 

the altima -- nice interior, nice new body, hid's, tons of options, tons f colors, nice seats, etc etc

the mailbu-  looks like ass, slow as fuck, monekys could make a better car.

the mote carlo- out dated design, mom doesn't want to drive a "nascar" body kit POS, the interior is crap, the reliabilty is crap, and its over priced for what you get.  not to mention, shitty gas mileage.

the grand am...  see above.  other than hints at a new design, its STILL the same body it was in 1994.


theres a connection here.

if GM made a decent car that didin't suck, they might be on to something.

they WERE on to something with the 400 hp GTo...  but the base model starts at 32k, and speced with a manual tranny and non gay stuff, you're up to 36-38k out the door.  why?  you can buy a 1 year old bmw for that price, or an STi/Evo with 6k in mods.

no one wants to spend more money for less car.

thats why GM is going under.

dodge realized this, and put out a bunch of new shit over the past few years, and they are back in the game hard.

gm answers the srt-4 with the colbalt???
gm answers the hemi-powered cars with the SSR???

i mean, seriously...  their design crew are fuktards.
[post=509042]Quoted post[/post]​


Not to knock on anyone that might work for one but I think most of thier problems come from the unions. Overpaid guys who don't do much work with the exception of the assembly line guys, and guys who bust thier ass in the hot plant around machines. I see it all the time, stereotypes on them don't lie, takes two people, two weeks to put up a small wall and paint it, and then a month to get started on it, comon. They might have done ALOT in the past but they don't do much nowadays with the labor laws, just promote lazyness. I personally have yet to see one that has to bust his ass just to put a small portion of food on his table. If a union guy is fired gm has to pay his overpaid wages for A WHOLE YEAR after he is let go, full pay for doing jack shit, not to many jobs that will do that.
 

Battle Pope

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@Jun 7 2005, 10:12 AM
they need to get their act together and make a car that doesn't suck.

let's compare mid-priced sedans... something our mom's would drive.
~20-25-ish nicely equipped

toyota camry
honda accord
pontiac grand am/G6
nissan altima
chevy malibu
chevy mote carlo


i think thats a fair list of the more common cars in that price range

the camry-- best selling car for like 15 years or so... and theres a reason for it. reliability, nice interior, comfortable, enough pep for mom.

the accord - new body lines, lots of options, nice seats/interior, sporty, yet classy.. and now availble with a hybrid for even better MPG and more power from the assist.

the altima -- nice interior, nice new body, hid's, tons of options, tons f colors, nice seats, etc etc

the mailbu- looks like ass, slow as fuck, monekys could make a better car.

the mote carlo- out dated design, mom doesn't want to drive a "nascar" body kit POS, the interior is crap, the reliabilty is crap, and its over priced for what you get. not to mention, shitty gas mileage.

the grand am... see above. other than hints at a new design, its STILL the same body it was in 1994.


theres a connection here.

if GM made a decent car that didin't suck, they might be on to something.

they WERE on to something with the 400 hp GTo... but the base model starts at 32k, and speced with a manual tranny and non gay stuff, you're up to 36-38k out the door. why? you can buy a 1 year old bmw for that price, or an STi/Evo with 6k in mods.

no one wants to spend more money for less car.

thats why GM is going under.

dodge realized this, and put out a bunch of new shit over the past few years, and they are back in the game hard.

gm answers the srt-4 with the colbalt???
gm answers the hemi-powered cars with the SSR???

i mean, seriously... their design crew are fuktards.
[post=509042]Quoted post[/post]​


I was about to say, it's a combination of things but mainly because american manufacturers can't make a good car to save their life.

Chrysler and Ford are picking back up in the car fields, but that's because Ford went in the right direction with the Mustang, and Chrysler has a big hit with the 300C/Magnum/Charger. Unfortunately for them, Nissan and Toyota have been raking in the truck sales ever since the release of the Titan/Tundra line. Ford is still the strongest with trucks, but the Nissan Titan has been doing obscenely well ever since release.
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
also, remember that Chrysler was basicly bought out by Dimler which I think has helped to bring nicer looking cars on the market. The crossfire is basicly a DB design. The 300c has a defent distict design (love it or hate it). All of GM cars look alike, and none of them really stand out. Even the GTO doesn't even stand out. GM is now thinking of releasing a retro car to compete with the PT cruiser. Well they are 5 years too late on that. The PT cruiser is fading. Bad marketing stradigy there. Under the hoods, except for a few exceptions, GM's engines are old, out dated, and very ho-hum. The 3800 engine doesn't really deliver much power, and to compete with the NA accord, they have to put a super charger on it. This ups the price to build the car alot. The ecotech which is a 15 year old engine, was never that good of an engine, doesn't get the best gas millage, and brakes down alot. Yes, there are alot of japaness engines that are rather ho-hum, but they last a long time, and get decent gas millage. The D-series in honda's (now almost a 20 year old engine) lasts forever and get steller gas millage. Yea its slow, but it also gets 35+MPG.

GM has put all its money and R&D on its SUV's. Yea, they were a HUGE seller back in the mid-90s to 2000, but gas prices have contenued to go up, and sales are slowing. With the economy slightly down, spending 50+ week on gas sucks. Japanese manufactors have some really good trusty cars, and are trying to compete in the SUV market. GM for while was only trying to compete in the SUV market.
 

Jeef

NO MA'AM
Moderator
VIP
I have had no problems with any 3 of the gm trucks I have bought in the last 3 years. My mom hasn't had any problems with her trailblazer either. I do agree that there car line up sucks, but there trucks are good. Compare my 5.3l (l33 motor 15hp more than the regular 5.3)extended cab short bed Silverado to a Hemi powered Ram. I get almost double the gas milage 16c 19-20hwy compared to 9c 12hwy, we are about equally as fast I might be a little faster, and I think the Chevy has a nicer interior. I can not complain on my Silverado a 5500# full sized truck with 4wd and 310hp gets 16-20mpg. That is really good considering everything.
 

jamesA

Thank you for your business.
VIP
That'd odd really. Because GM is hiring here down at the truck plant at the I69 and I469 interchange.
 

phunky.buddha

Admin with a big stick
Admin
VIP
Originally posted by 2000Si+Jun 7 2005, 06:42 PM-->
That'd odd really. Because GM is hiring here down at the truck plant at the I69 and I469 interchange.
[post=509306]Quoted post[/post]​

Just because they're hiring for the truck line doesn't mean the company still isn't in trouble as a whole.

Cashizslick
@Jun 7 2005, 08:08 PM
This is proof that Union's have outlived their usefulness.
[post=509363]Quoted post[/post]​


:werd:

UAW sucks.
 

cheese9988

Senior Member
VIP
Originally posted by Calesta+Jun 7 2005, 09:38 PM-->
Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2005, 06:42 PM
That'd odd really. Because GM is hiring here down at the truck plant at the I69 and I469 interchange.
[post=509306]Quoted post[/post]​


Just because they're hiring for the truck line doesn't mean the company still isn't in trouble as a whole.

Cashizslick
@Jun 7 2005, 08:08 PM
This is proof that Union's have outlived their usefulness.
[post=509363]Quoted post[/post]​


:werd:

UAW sucks.
[post=509385]Quoted post[/post]​


:werd: :withstupid: I second that notion!
 

micah

Senior Member
the new z06 will have 550 hp, the highest of any production vette ever.
and they are reviving the ss line, impala ss is supposed to have 450 hp.

its all in the new motor trend. maybe that will help them out.


i think they were dumbasses for dropping the trans am in favor of the gto
 

Battle Pope

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by micah@Jun 8 2005, 10:36 AM
the new z06 will have 550 hp, the highest of any production vette ever.
and they are reviving the ss line, impala ss is supposed to have 450 hp.

its all in the new motor trend. maybe that will help them out.


i think they were dumbasses for dropping the trans am in favor of the gto
[post=509686]Quoted post[/post]​


:yes:

They really took a gamble on the GTO, and it fell on its face.
 

posol

RETIRED
Staff member
and even if the vette has stupid power, its still not a big seller. the average joe doesn't spend 50k on a car.

there is NOTHING in that car that makes it worth the price.

if it was 30-33k, there would be 5x as many of them around town, and chevy might actually be able to turn a profit off them.
 

Battle Pope

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@Jun 8 2005, 10:54 AM
if it was 30-33k, there would be 5x as many of them around town, and chevy might actually be able to turn a profit off them.
[post=509693]Quoted post[/post]​


Doubtful. That's probably only a more than GM's costs on them.

GM's benefits and pension plan is shooting them in the foot.
 

posol

RETIRED
Staff member
yup. they need to cut that shit out. i don't even have a pension plan... i retire, im done. maybe i'll get 2 gs severence or something...
 

Battle Pope

Well-Known Member
Yeah. That's the problem with the "good old fashioned american companies". The market changes. You can't keep doing the same old thing while companies are coming in around you doing the same thing, but better quality and for less money.

I heard that with ford and GM, almost 30% of the price tag on the vehicle you buy goes straight to the company's pension and benefit plans.

Know what it is on a Toyota vehicle? Under a thousand dollars.

Cut your operating costs and you can make better cars for less money.
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
Originally posted by pissedoffsol@Jun 8 2005, 01:54 PM
and even if the vette has stupid power, its still not a big seller. the average joe doesn't spend 50k on a car.

there is NOTHING in that car that makes it worth the price.

if it was 30-33k, there would be 5x as many of them around town, and chevy might actually be able to turn a profit off them.
[post=509693]Quoted post[/post]​


I would disagree there. The z06 vette has almost the same performance and some exotic cars for a third the price. Its a great car, but your right, its not a big seller and isn't really designed to make a shit load of money off it. Its like the viper, Doesn't really represent the companys other products, but its an icon of the entire company.
 

TWISTEDIMAGE

Senior Member
uh gm quite making so many of the same cars, I.e. pontiac, gmc, chevy, cadallac, and what ever else there is and make 1 or 2 and change the design every couple of years.

instead of like every ten years.

get your hand out of the cake and put your finger in. dont be so gready and you might make some money.

honda:acura
toyota:lexus
nissan:infinity

make sense to me

econo car:more luxry
 
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