KYB AGX With....GC's or Pro-Kit ?

Ground Control Coilovers or Eibach Pro-Kit?

  • Eibach Pro-

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    5

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Citizen_Insane

Senior Member
I've seen the AGX/Pro-Kit highly suggested as far as cheap, well performing suspension goes. I'd really like to spend less than $500, and I know that Omnipowers are only $150 more, its just that, well, thats $150 more out of my pocket. I already have the Ground Controls, but I'm not interested in lowering my car much, I just want to get the best performing suspension for the cheapest. So as the pole says, what would you suggest (unless you can convince me that its worth the extra $150 for the omnipowers....)

Please only respond if you have experience, I really don't want a bunch of "i heard this and that."
 

sohcslammer

Senior Member
Pro Kits are NOT performance. They are a progressive rate spring designed for comfort. Get a linear spring if you want performance. Pro kits suck the balls. (so do the sportlines if you ask me....)

Go with the H&R sport kit if you don't want much of a drop and you still want to handle... but for true wicked cornering a low center of gravity is best. I recomend lowering about 2 and a 1/4 inches give or take a 1/4 inch....
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
Moderator
VIP
The Pro-Kits are actually pretty good.

Extreme lowering does not equal "wicked" cornering. Proper weighting of the car at each corner and spring rate optimatizion with matched damping/rebound does.
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
Moderator
VIP
:thumbsup:

By the way, if you want the best performing suspension for the least amount of money and you already have the GC springs, just buy the KYB AGX and throw the GC on top. You'll only have to pay for one thing. The GCs have a higher spring rate than the Pro-Kits anyway, so you'll get faster response. If you want the more comfortable ride, sell the GC springs and get the Pro-Kits instead. You'll still have really good performance, but it won't be as tight as the GC- but then your shocks will last longer too because of the lower spring rate.

If you're leaning toward keeping the GC and buying the AGX shocks for the reason that you want the higher spring rates- and you can sell the GC springs as new- I would sell them and get the Omnipowers. The amount of extra stuff you get for the additional $150 is really worth it. Larger pistons, independently adjustably preload and shock body length, pillowball mounts etc- it's all worth the extra $150.

This is coming from someone who's owned and run the Pro-Kit/AGX combo, a set of true coilovers, and has also owned a set of GC springs too. There's the real world experience you wanted. :)
 

Citizen_Insane

Senior Member
Does anyone make regular springs (not coilovers) that have really high spring rates? Because I have trouble getting #'s from any of these companies that make this stuff. I think the GC's are like 350lb/in in front and 180lb/in in back. They're whatever comes in the most basic kit for the CRX.

Edit*
I did a little research and I found 2 other springs with pretty high spring rates.

The Tanabe GF210's are 330/151lb/in
The RS*R Race springs are 341/235/lb/in

Would either of these be a good match for the AGX's?
 

adnoh

Senior Member
Dude, I'd just stick with your original idea and get a new (not blown) set of Illuminas. Slap the GC's on there, grab a nice swaybar (if you dont already have one) and call it a day.
 

92dxhatch

Senior Member
Originally posted by Calesta@Jul 11 2005, 11:41 PM
:thumbsup:

By the way, if you want the best performing suspension for the least amount of money and you already have the GC springs, just buy the KYB AGX and throw the GC on top. You'll only have to pay for one thing. The GCs have a higher spring rate than the Pro-Kits anyway, so you'll get faster response. If you want the more comfortable ride, sell the GC springs and get the Pro-Kits instead. You'll still have really good performance, but it won't be as tight as the GC- but then your shocks will last longer too because of the lower spring rate.

If you're leaning toward keeping the GC and buying the AGX shocks for the reason that you want the higher spring rates- and you can sell the GC springs as new- I would sell them and get the Omnipowers. The amount of extra stuff you get for the additional $150 is really worth it. Larger pistons, independently adjustably preload and shock body length, pillowball mounts etc- it's all worth the extra $150.

This is coming from someone who's owned and run the Pro-Kit/AGX combo, a set of true coilovers, and has also owned a set of GC springs too. There's the real world experience you wanted. :)
[post=524568]Quoted post[/post]​

:withstupid:


You already have th gc's, just get the agx's and your set, plus you save money, i curently have sportlins w/ agx's, and its a good performance setup, it does lower your car, but not a whole lot, but has a decent spring rate. the GC's should do you just fine. good luck bro.
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
Moderator
VIP
Originally posted by Citizen_Insane+Jul 12 2005, 11:15 AM-->
Does anyone make regular springs (not coilovers) that have really high spring rates? Because I have trouble getting #'s from any of these companies that make this stuff. I think the GC's are like 350lb/in in front and 180lb/in in back. They're whatever comes in the most basic kit for the CRX.

Edit*
I did a little research and I found 2 other springs with pretty high spring rates.

The Tanabe GF210's are 330/151lb/in
The RS*R Race springs are 341/235/lb/in

Would either of these be a good match for the AGX's?
[post=524751]Quoted post[/post]​

Just call them. The only company that wouldn't disclose spring rates to me over the phone was Eibach. I called Progress about their springs a while back, and if I remember correctly- their swap springs are 320/200. That's a pretty good spring rate setup, and will work well with the AGXs.

92dxhatch
@Jul 12 2005, 12:17 PM
You already have th gc's, just get the agx's and your set, plus you save money, i curently have sportlins w/ agx's, and its a good performance setup, it does lower your car, but not a whole lot, but has a decent spring rate. the GC's should do you just fine. good luck bro.
[post=524782]Quoted post[/post]​


:thumbsup:
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
Moderator
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It's actually a good bit lower drop... less drop = better. :)
 

Citizen_Insane

Senior Member
Yeah, I've been reading up on suspension tech and it seems like dropping much at all on a crx could make handling a lot worse. I think I'm going to just keep the GC's because then I can keep it at .5" of drop.
 
i have the agx's with GC on my car.... i love em. I also do not have my car mad Slammed either, actually the fronts are up as high as they go for clearence issues.

I have the agx's set on 3 alll the way around with great response and a decent ride. When there are put on 1 its def a cushier ride if thats what your after with some performance.

I give this combo two thumbs up
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

edit: there are actually some pics of me installing them on my car in the link in my sig....
 

Citizen_Insane

Senior Member
Originally posted by Blanco@Jul 14 2005, 10:09 AM
Don't worry so much about how much the car will be lowered, worry about the handling and the height will take care of itself.
[post=526041]Quoted post[/post]​

My point was, that I'm trying to keep it at as close to stock height as possible.
 
[/quote]
My point was, that I'm trying to keep it at as close to stock height as possible.
[post=526271]Quoted post[/post]​
[/quote]

if you look at the end of the thread in my sig you can see with this combo im actually sitting a tad bit above stock height as of right now
 

wanderinman

Senior Member
Originally posted by Calesta@Jul 13 2005, 09:56 PM
It's actually a good bit lower drop... less drop = better. :)
[post=525787]Quoted post[/post]​



For the most part the advertised difference is roughly .3-.5 inches, not very noticeable, and the fact your running stiffer springs means slightly less down travel (which is mostly when your car hits, coming over speed bumps). I'll keep my vote for the sportlines, but in the end its your car and you should get exactly what YOU want.
 

sohcslammer

Senior Member
Originally posted by Calesta@Jul 13 2005, 09:56 PM
less drop = better. :)
[post=525787]Quoted post[/post]​



I wholeheartedly disagree.... When racing you want a low center of gravity - less roll, less pitch, and you are smoother in your transitions. I'm not saying that you need to be slammed on the ground, but the stock ride height will NEVER corner as well as a car that has been lowered an inch or two. Why do you think racecars are so low... cause they look cool? :lol:


Where are all the road racers to back me up? :(
 

MikeBergy

Blah blah blah....
Originally posted by sohcslammer+Jul 14 2005, 09:39 PM-->
@Jul 13 2005, 09:56 PM
less drop = better.  :)
[post=525787]Quoted post[/post]​



I wholeheartedly disagree.... When racing you want a low center of gravity - less roll, less pitch, and you are smoother in your transitions. I'm not saying that you need to be slammed on the ground, but the stock ride height will NEVER corner as well as a car that has been lowered an inch or two. Why do you think racecars are so low... cause they look cool? :lol:


Where are all the road racers to back me up? :(
[post=526453]Quoted post[/post]​


You are only partly right. The reasons why a racecar is so low to the ground is
a. low cg, for handling reasons, as you stated,
b. minimize the amount of air pocket under the car. A substantial amount of drag can be eliminated by reducing the amount of air being sheared under the car.

As for the question of how low, it depends. Is the car going to be your daily driver? If so, you don't want to bottom out your car on speed bumps and potholes by riding low with a soft spring and low ride height, nor do you want to run a superstiff spring, or your kidneys are going to fall off. But it seriously depends on how you want to tailor your ride. If you want a stiff suspension, and don't mind spending more time keeping your fillings in, or if your car is going to be mostly driven on a smooth track, then go ahead and lower it a lot and ride on stiff springs, it WILL help. Mind you, not every track is going to be ideal for a stiff suspension. But that is why race teams run with suspension that is completely adjustable in spring stiffness and shock damping to suit the needs on different tracks. If you are looking for a little softer ride, and are not planning to track it as often, you'll probably want a little less drop to allow the suspension to be a little more soft, and not bottom out. One application is not going to be the best for all occasions. Hope that helps.
 

Citizen_Insane

Senior Member
Originally posted by sohcslammer+Jul 14 2005, 10:39 PM-->
@Jul 13 2005, 09:56 PM
less drop = better. :)
[post=525787]Quoted post[/post]​



I wholeheartedly disagree.... When racing you want a low center of gravity - less roll, less pitch, and you are smoother in your transitions. I'm not saying that you need to be slammed on the ground, but the stock ride height will NEVER corner as well as a car that has been lowered an inch or two. Why do you think racecars are so low... cause they look cool? :lol:


Where are all the road racers to back me up? :(
[post=526453]Quoted post[/post]​

The reason race cars can be so low is because their whole suspension is designed to work that low. On a stock car, when you lower the car, you change the whole suspension geometry...for the worse most of the time. The center of gravity of a car drops more slowly (read less per amount lowered) than the roll center. Therefore, you increase the distance between the roll center and the center of gravity and vuala, you have more weight transfer and worse handling.

The reason a race car can go as low as they are is that they have the pivot points for the suspension worked out so that the roll center and center of gravity are right where they want them. Just because all you hear is "center of gravity this, center of gravity that," doesn't mean its the only thing that impacts your handling.
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
Moderator
VIP
Originally posted by MikeBergy+Jul 14 2005, 11:33 PM-->
You are only partly right. The reasons why a racecar is so low to the ground is
a. low cg, for handling reasons, as you stated,
b. minimize the amount of air pocket under the car. A substantial amount of drag can be eliminated by reducing the amount of air being sheared under the car.
[post=526486]Quoted post[/post]​

:thumbsup:

Citizen_Insane
@Jul 15 2005, 12:31 AM
The reason race cars can be so low is because their whole suspension is designed to work that low. On a stock car, when you lower the car, you change the whole suspension geometry...for the worse most of the time.
[post=526513]Quoted post[/post]​


THANK you. It's much more complex than just talking about CG and stiffness. Lower CG is better, but drastically changing the suspension geometry on a street car is not. Hell, you'll hurt your drivetrain too if you pivot your axles through any motion on a slammed Civic.
 

MikeBergy

Blah blah blah....
THANK you. It's much more complex than just talking about CG and stiffness. Lower CG is better, but drastically changing the suspension geometry on a street car is not. Hell, you'll hurt your drivetrain too if you pivot your axles through any motion on a slammed Civic.
[post=526520]Quoted post[/post]​
[/quote]

:yes:

CV joints can only take so much angle before they start gring away.
 
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