Yes, I Am Insane.

hentai

Junior Member
See, this is what you get when a robotics engineer and a computer programmer sit down at Denny's for four hours.

I've got a simple '93 Honda del Sol S, stock everything, sweet as hell. I also live in Arizona. I want to do something fun with my car, but performance racing just seems too... 'stock', I suppose.

So, a truly novel idea struck: Arizona will reimburse up to $4000 ( I think ) to any vehicle owner who converts their vehicle to alternative fuel, or high fuel efficiency.

So... what would it take, besides mounting disc motors in the rear wheels, filling half the trunk with batteries, and beefing up the alternator to levels that would bring a tear to Victor von Frankenstein's eye, to convert my del Sol to a hybrid/electric? The goal is to have the little 105hp engine act as the power source, which applies power directly to the front wheels (in case of emergency failure of the electrics) and charges the battery array, which feeds power to the fully electric back wheels. I can handle all the synchronization and power distribution issues, as well as the electronic control system and most of the wiring. The real trick is going to be the bare mechanicals - engaging and disengaging the electrics at the right time to use the optimal drivetrain for any speed/rpm.

The current vision is to have the electrics take over at low engine RPM, or any time extra torque is required, but have the gas engine take over completely whenever the electrics threaten to eat more acceleration than they provide. Thus, the vehicle performs as a standard FWD del Sol (with something heavy in the trunk) by default, but off-the-line acceleration is boosted by electric motors, and forward momentum is reclaimed by the electrics during braking. With a car as light as the del Sol, 60+ MPG should be possible, and the performance hit shouldn't be too bad at all (assuming I get it all working right). Any performance loss should be amply made up for by the full 4WD capability.

Comments? Suggestions? Wails of horror and revulsion?
 

djextremity

Senior Member
Waaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh!!!!!! --gasp --scream --puke aaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh eeeeeeewwww wwwwwwwaaaaaa


You asked for it. :D

That said, the del Sol isn't very light in comparison with base model Civic hatches.
 

lsvtec

GNU/Linux Evangelist
I don't have any suggestions, but I am very interested in seeing how you pull it off. Keep us updated.
 

Havok

Senior Member
A 93 Del Sol S is NOT sweet. Well, I take that back..Its about as sweet as a Civic DX Auto. As for reimbursement, 4000 is nothing campared to the 1000's you will spend making it hybrid or electric. Last time I checked, Honda still sells the Civic Hybrid and Insight.
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
This is going to cost you tons of money, It would probally be cheap just sell your car and buy an insight.

Look into instead of Hybrid, look at natural gas, it is going to be alot cheaper and have read articles that you get the same tax brakes
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
Originally posted by Afipunk21@Jan 7 2003, 04:24 PM
A 93 Del Sol S is NOT sweet.

The one real nice thing about the del sol s, si and VTEC is the only thing that makes them look diffrent from each other is wheels they put on them. Most civics had nasty black trim coving them. The only thing that makes the sols (other than engine) is the s had drums, VTEC had abs and a strut tower bar. The S had roll-up windows but that is the only stink
 

hentai

Junior Member
Feh. If I wanted an Insight, I would have got an Insight. ;)

And it's weird that you mention the windows - I've been in four del Sols, and owned two, and ALL of them had power windows. Since the back window pretty much has to be power, I figured they made all of them power by default.
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
I wonder what that did for performance? The one good thing about E-motors are that they have pretty consant power and alot of trq

True the guy will never see 11's but with the extra trq, i wonder if he could get off the line real fast?
 
the following info was taken from here:
http://216.239.53.100/search?q=cache:UhZPG...&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

"The subtraction for converting aconventional vehicle to operate as analternative fuel vehicle is equal to thecost of the conversion but cannot exceed$5,000 ($3,000 for corporations) for eachvehicle. For the purpose of thissubtraction, the cost of conversion doesnot include taxes, interest, and otherfinance charges.You must allocate and apply one-third ofthe subtraction to each of threeconsecutive taxable years beginning withthe taxable year in which you convertedthe vehicle."

it is simply a tax deduction that u have to spread over three fucking years. they're not gonna hand you a check for $5000. sorry.
 

asmallsol

Super Moderator
Originally posted by rixXxceboy@Jan 7 2003, 06:36 PM
...they're not gonna hand you a check for $5000. sorry.

a few years ago they kinda had a program in i think Arizoina. They tryed to get more people to do natural gas conversions so they had a deal where they would right you a 5000 check if you did it and for trucks it was even more. The major thing was, it was not though out and people signed up, bought the parts, showed the govt them, goverment wrote a check, no ref, nothing that made sure they did not take out the stuff a week later. People did, they would buy the parts, get the check then sell the parts for a little less, then they had a decent check handed to them. Quickly they stopped this program and that is why they are doing it under a tax deduction over 3 years, so they dont just get the money then sell the car.

(heard about this program on ABC news about 2 years ago so if some of the facts dont line up, it is because i kinda forgot alot of them)
 

90 accord

Chicks dig the box
VIP
Originally posted by hentai@Jan 7 2003, 04:15 PM
See, this is what you get when a robotics engineer and a computer programmer sit down at Denny's for four hours.

I've got a simple '93 Honda del Sol S, stock everything, sweet as hell. I also live in Arizona. I want to do something fun with my car, but performance racing just seems too... 'stock', I suppose.

So, a truly novel idea struck: Arizona will reimburse up to $4000 ( I think ) to any vehicle owner who converts their vehicle to alternative fuel, or high fuel efficiency.

So... what would it take, besides mounting disc motors in the rear wheels, filling half the trunk with batteries, and beefing up the alternator to levels that would bring a tear to Victor von Frankenstein's eye, to convert my del Sol to a hybrid/electric? The goal is to have the little 105hp engine act as the power source, which applies power directly to the front wheels (in case of emergency failure of the electrics) and charges the battery array, which feeds power to the fully electric back wheels. I can handle all the synchronization and power distribution issues, as well as the electronic control system and most of the wiring. The real trick is going to be the bare mechanicals - engaging and disengaging the electrics at the right time to use the optimal drivetrain for any speed/rpm.

The current vision is to have the electrics take over at low engine RPM, or any time extra torque is required, but have the gas engine take over completely whenever the electrics threaten to eat more acceleration than they provide. Thus, the vehicle performs as a standard FWD del Sol (with something heavy in the trunk) by default, but off-the-line acceleration is boosted by electric motors, and forward momentum is reclaimed by the electrics during braking. With a car as light as the del Sol, 60+ MPG should be possible, and the performance hit shouldn't be too bad at all (assuming I get it all working right). Any performance loss should be amply made up for by the full 4WD capability.

Comments? Suggestions? Wails of horror and revulsion?

looks like the arizona sun is getting to you already!

whereabouts are you in AZ? i'm in phx.
 

hentai

Junior Member
I'm in Tempe, about 4 blocks from ASU.

And I'm not sure, but I think Insights have some weird salvage rules, because their batteries and such represent an 'environmental hazard'.
 
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