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91 EF with B18B1 not starting

Discussion in 'Civic and CRX - EF' started by RiseUp, Mar 10, 2011.

  1. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    Alright first off, a little history; I bought the car in non-running condition for $900. When I met the guy who did the swap, I knew I was in for some fun ahead of me. Let's just say he wasn't the smartest guy I've ever met. Originally, the dizzy wasn't getting spark to the plugs, or so he said.

    I took another look under the hood with a friend of mine, and there were wires everywhere, but the o2 and water temp sensors were left unconnected.
    We could only get it to turn over if we shorted one of the starter's wires to ground,and sometimes even that wouldn't work.
    Turns out he had it wired wrong.
    We rewired the starter to its respective positive and command wires (grounds through the block), and we had it turning over every time perfect.

    Next, we looked at the distributor that he said wasn't getting spark to the plugs. We tried starting it while we held one of the spark plug boots close to the engine, and there were sparks from all four, so the distributor was fine.

    I thought maybe it was being starved of fuel, but the injectors weren't clogged, and there was fuel in the rail when we took it off.

    I did a compression test, and got 190 in cylinder 1, 185 in cylinder 2, 175 in cylinder 3 and 172 in cylinder 4.

    Now I'm thinking that since it turns over, gets spark and fuel, and holds compression, that it's wired wrong somewhere.
    Obviously I had that thought from the beginning, but it helps to narrow it down.

    Any thoughts as to why it won't start? Could it be one of the sensors that aren't hooked up? Could it be simply a horrible wiring job?
    If it's somewhere in the wiring, should I rip it out and start with a new harness so that I know for sure everything's wired correctly, or should I try to troubleshoot the one that's already in there?

    Any help is greatly appreciated:worthyp:
     
  2. Matts96HB

    Matts96HB . Moderator VIP

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    have you checked the timing?
     
  3. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    Yep, timing's fine.
     
  4. dc4dude

    dc4dude Member

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    try a noid light to see if the injectors are getting signal. are you getting power to the injectors?
     
  5. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    First I would start off by replacing the harness with a 91 Si harness... And make sure plug wires are in the right order..
     
  6. Matts96HB

    Matts96HB . Moderator VIP

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    a car needs a few things to start, or at least try:
    fuel
    timing
    spark
    and of course it needs to hold compression

    with those three things in order, your car should at least sputter. are the cylinders extremely flooded? you may need to clear them out by removing the spark plugs, and unplug all of the injectors and turn the car over. this was a problem in my hatchback, i literally screwed with stuff for days before i thought of it
     
  7. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    Will do, I'll let you know tomorrow
     
  8. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    Is there a specific reason to go with the Si versus what I've got? And plug wires are in correct order.
     
  9. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    Fuel: there was fuel in the rail when I took it off, and I can hear the fuel pump run.
    Timing: has been verified.
    Spark:has been checked through both the boots and the plugs themselves.
    Compression: I posted the results of my compression test in my original post.

    I'll try unplugging all injectors and plugs, and see if that helps.

    Thank you guys so much for the help and suggestions.:clapping:
     
  10. hondafreak513

    hondafreak513 New Member

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    The 91 Si harness will have all the right plugs on it for the swap, or I guess you can use a HF harness but just don't get a DX harness..
     
  11. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    So pulling the plugs and disabling fuel injectors did nothing, and I looked in the cylinders after removing the spark plugs, and they weren't flooded. Injectors are getting power, but spark plugs aren't sparking now. I tried to get sparks to jump from the boot to ground and they won't. Dizzy? I have a spare I'll throw on and see if it helps.
     
  12. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    The O2 sensor right where the exhaust connects is disconnected, as well as the water temp sensor. Would that have any effect?
     
  13. Jswike

    Jswike New Member

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    I'll do what I can to help you out but I am not always around a computer - as I have my own wiring nightmare to deal with XD. I will need more info from you. What model was the car? You cannot plug an si/hf harness into dx. I doesn't support all the injectors, nor does it support the wires for the crank/cam position sensors for DPFI to MPFI swap. What I recommend is getting the appropriate harness for the CHASSIS. Then modifying to stock. Next. You do not get any fuel on the plugs when cranking? This leads me to believe he funked up your mpfi wiring. If converted. Also is it converted to OBD1? That will require a few more wires to be checked, mainly if distributor is converted. Sensors like IAT, O2, MAP, IACV won't keep your car from starting. And certainly will not withhold spark or fuel. If you have a DX chassis - get new DX engine wiring harness and convert to MPFI. I suggest wiring it yourself straight to ECU. To make things simple... A1, A3, A5, A7 are ground, they go through the injectors, to the resistor box and end at A15 main relay/resistor 12v+. Your spark is bad distributor components, or wiring. Period. Get new engine harness. New distributor, wire accordingly. At maximum you spend $250 and you know its done right. Make sure solder everything! EVERYTHING!
     
  14. Jswike

    Jswike New Member

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    I reread the posts, edit out the spark related comments. But you do verify fuel in the cylinders. Pull a plug crank, double check spark. You will smell fuel from the open cylinder, or pull cylinders 2 and 3 and youll see gas on the plug. If you have fuel, and spark, and compression. Then your only option left is timing.
     
  15. dc4dude

    dc4dude Member

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    just because the injectors are getting power, doesnt mean they are getting the ground signal to pulse... thats why i recommended noid lights, to check to see whether you are getting timing/pulse signal... yopu can have fuel and pressure, but if nothing is telling the injectors to open and close, the car will never run...
     
  16. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    I have the opportunity to pull a 91 LX sedan harness, but it's automatic. Also, it's an LX(mine's a DX). I assume that it being a different trim, auto and not manual, and a sedan versus a hatch mean that it's either incompatible, or a boatload of work to mod it to work for me. Any thoughts? Also, it would only cost me $18 so if there's ANY way to make it work, throw me some suggestions as to figure out how. A new one (online) would run me >$90
     
  17. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    From what I've read, I would just have to do the dpfi>mpfi conversion, right?
     
  18. Jswike

    Jswike New Member

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    An lx what? Accord? I've never heard of an lx crx or civic pre 92. So I'd stay away from the harness.
    If you are staying obd0 then yes just need to do mpfi swap. But you need a dx or "standard" crx Dpfi harness to convert. Any dpfi 88 to 91 civic hb, civic or crx will do.
     
  19. RiseUp

    RiseUp New Member

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    1991 honda civic lx sedan.
     
  20. Jswike

    Jswike New Member

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    well i had to go google that... and seems like a fit
     
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