My motor might be installed soon. About time!

[Elo'rin]

Hey what kind of problems will turbo cause? Also I have to bore the engine probably 20,000. What type of pistons and rods should I use? Another thing since I'm boring I'll loose compression. My original plan was to leave it, because I was going to turbo. Also, what h22 parts will I need for the hybrid?


Thanks,
Elo'rin

 

[Import Builders]

There we go. We are already to a problem and we have not even started! Just goes to show how many problems prelude motors really have.

Problem #1: You can't bore and hone a prelude block, its FRM. You have to sleeve.
Problem #2: You can't put an aftermarket piston in a FRM block. You have to sleeve.
Problem #3: The motor has 2 very heavy balance shafts in it...think about why that is. Its because the motor is horribly unbalanced and vibrates horribly. So they needed literally POUNDS of metal in it, in the form of shafts to limit the vibration.
Problem #4: When the turbo comes on the motor, its going to exponentionally stress all the parts, causing WAY more vibration.
Problem #5: Hydralic tensioner is a HORRIBLE design. Under heavy load it will go: tight, loose, tight, loose, tight. very fast...causing even more vibration.
Problem #6: the oil pump can;t take bad harmonics and will break under too much vibration, causing you to lose your entire motor.
Problem #7: You can't use a H22A ECU to tune your car any good.
Problem #8: The transmission is by far the worst Honda makes and it can't shift at high RPM's at all, causing more misshifts than any other tranny I can think of, that leads to massive amounts of bend valves, which can cause you to loose your entire motor.
Problem #9: The labor rate for working on preludes, is probably 175%-200% that of a B series.
Problem #10: the parts for a prelude cost alot more, and there are alot more parts.
Problem #11: The stock prelude pistons, any kind, have the weakest ring lands of any Honda piston that I have ever seen, and cracking them is almost a certainty under boost from a turbo.

And then when your mentally over the 11 problems I present here, compared to say a single cam, or B series motor, you have a multitude of other problems that are annoying as well.

The only reason I like the Prelude motor, for myself, is because I know how to handle all of the above problems and can maintain it perfectly. If you can handle those problems, then turbo it, it will be really fast.

Just get the heaviest crank pulley you can find and put that on. helps the harmionics problem.

Jeff

 

[posol]

Originally posted by Import Builders@Apr 16 2004, 06:15 PM
Problem #7: You can't use a H22A ECU to tune your car any good.

I agree with all but #7.

p13's can be chipped, and hondata will even work on it.

what extent/point of view are you coming from with this?

 

[Elo'rin]

Well thanks for all the info. FRM???????????? I have no clue what FRM is. I have a manuel on the car that says you can bore 20,000. How much will it cost to sleeve? I would much rather do that, but I herd its alot of money and alot of places won't do it around here. (Twin cities, Minneapollis,MN.) It was honed and some of the scratches didn't come out. So if I bore won't that nullify the honing and get rid of the scratches? I was thinking of rebuilding the tranny. Would that be easier than trying to put on a B-type tranny? If not what B-type would be best? I don't really care about labor. I'm 17 and live at home. My only problem would be running out of money, I'm prepared to spend hundreds,even thousands, of hours working on it to have the fastest car around, but thanks for the warning.


Sincerely,
Elo'rin

 

[Import Builders]

Buy another block and use that STD bore.

Tranny, you have to use your H22A one, or pay to have some new gears put in it.

Hello Pissed. Buddy!

#7. You can't use Hondata with a Prelude VTEC ecu, who told you that? Its the same as an Accord ECU, and you can't use that either. You can chip it yes, but you can't use Hondata. Which is why I arrive at that. Chipped ECU's are all junk. If you can't get the proper air/fuel all over everywhere its less than ideal. Well, you should be able to have the capacity to do it...thats why I like the Hondata so much.

Thanks, have a nice nite guys.

Jeff

 

[Elo'rin]

Thanks. So the block is fucked? Wouldn't it be easier and cheaper to put an h22 vtec Turbo-charged in it then? or if I have to start from scratch what should I do? Also do you know where I could get an h23 block for cheap?


Thanks,
Elo'rin

 

[[Freemantle]]

Originally posted by Elo'rin@Apr 18 2004, 05:45 PM
Well thanks for all the info. FRM???????????? I have no clue what FRM is. I have a manuel on the car that says you can bore 20,000. How much will it cost to sleeve? I would much rather do that, but I herd its alot of money and alot of places won't do it around here. (Twin cities, Minneapollis,MN.) It was honed and some of the scratches didn't come out. So if I bore won't that nullify the honing and get rid of the scratches? I was thinking of rebuilding the tranny. Would that be easier than trying to put on a B-type tranny? If not what B-type would be best? I don't really care about labor. I'm 17 and live at home. My only problem would be running out of money, I'm prepared to spend hundreds,even thousands, of hours working on it to have the fastest car around, but thanks for the warning.


Sincerely,
Elo'rin

FRM is the debil.

In all actuallity, FRM is specialy treated metal on the stock sleeves of H-series motors. Honda put it on for god-knows-what-reason. The main problem is that under high-heat, the sleeves will expand and embrace your pistons. This is bad. I dropped money for new sleeves on my new H23.

Cracked ring lands? Oh, that's what killed my old h23.

Vibration will be an issue if you aren't mount concious. Use mounts and inserts. This will bring up cabin vibration, but engine vibration will stay at a minimal. Our engine weight really isn't that bad, 80 lbs more than a b18 dosen't make it too unweildy.

And yea, we get shafted on the ECU deal. I just bought a p28 Hondata system for my turbo setup. P28 = can't touch my intake manifold secondaries. I'm still trying to figure out how I can fix this. I think a rev-switch is needed.

Aftermarket support is crappy. If you have an h23, there is only 1 header made for your car. Labor cost isn't bad, but there are VERY few mechanics that know what the hell they are doing.

I never had a problem with my old h23 transmission. Then again I never revved as high as an H22 does.

Get a forged crank, your stock crank is heavy and gay. Crankwalk/spun bearings are responsable for 124587 dead H23s.

You can't just put the H22 head on. There are a few things (i.e. oil squirters, CRANK) that need to be accounted for.

 

[Elo'rin]

Originally posted by [Freemantle
Well thanks for all the info. FRM???????????? I have no clue what FRM is. I have a manuel on the car that says you can bore 20,000. How much will it cost to sleeve? I would much rather do that, but I herd its alot of money and alot of places won't do it around here. (Twin cities, Minneapollis,MN.) It was honed and some of the scratches didn't come out. So if I bore won't that nullify the honing and get rid of the scratches? I was thinking of rebuilding the tranny. Would that be easier than trying to put on a B-type tranny? If not what B-type would be best? I don't really care about labor. I'm 17 and live at home. My only problem would be running out of money, I'm prepared to spend hundreds,even thousands, of hours working on it to have the fastest car around, but thanks for the warning.


Sincerely,
Elo'rin

FRM is the debil.

In all actuallity, FRM is specialy treated metal on the stock sleeves of H-series motors. Honda put it on for god-knows-what-reason. The main problem is that under high-heat, the sleeves will expand and embrace your pistons. This is bad. I dropped money for new sleeves on my new H23.

Cracked ring lands? Oh, that's what killed my old h23.

Vibration will be an issue if you aren't mount concious. Use mounts and inserts. This will bring up cabin vibration, but engine vibration will stay at a minimal. Our engine weight really isn't that bad, 80 lbs more than a b18 dosen't make it too unweildy.

And yea, we get shafted on the ECU deal. I just bought a p28 Hondata system for my turbo setup. P28 = can't touch my intake manifold secondaries. I'm still trying to figure out how I can fix this. I think a rev-switch is needed.

Aftermarket support is crappy. If you have an h23, there is only 1 header made for your car. Labor cost isn't bad, but there are VERY few mechanics that know what the hell they are doing.

I never had a problem with my old h23 transmission. Then again I never revved as high as an H22 does.

Get a forged crank, your stock crank is heavy and gay. Crankwalk/spun bearings are responsable for 124587 dead H23s.

You can't just put the H22 head on. There are a few things (i.e. oil squirters, CRANK) that need to be accounted for. [/QUOTE]
Can I bore my block and be O.K. than? Also have you done the H23 vtec hybrid? Are turbos really that bad for that car?

Thanks,
Elo'rin

 

[JDMilan]

 

[nismogod]

[Freemantle] , there is a cure for that secondary issue. if you get ya a european intake mani, i can give you the site if you im me, it has only primaries. tada! no mo issues, no more loss of power. and to answer elo'rin, dude, i think the answer is no, you can't hone or bore the sleeves because of the coating. and a turbo makes things harder on the engine, read the referance article about compression. when you use a turb, everything else in the engine is under rediculous stress, comparatively. and you can't bore anything out 20,000. it's 20/100ths of an inch.