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but wheres the money coming from?

Discussion in 'Members' Lounge' started by invisibledemon, Sep 27, 2009.

  1. invisibledemon

    invisibledemon Bored Moderator VIP

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    our teachers are already way underpaid.
    theres a complete shortage of teachers because our school systems cant pay that many and have been laying them off.
    most schools (at least in my area) are at more than double capacity and extremely overcrowded, so the teachers spend more time babysitting and breaking up fights than teaching.

    but obama wants schools to stay open longer: longer days, longer weeks, and longer years.

    More school: Obama would curtail summer vacation - Yahoo! News

    but whos paying for this? he wants to level the field against other countries, but instead of putting more money for better teachers, better supplies, better schools, he wants the underpaid, understaffed schools to stay open longer?

    he must be fucking high.

    you want better grades in schools? you want kids to learn more?

    get more teachers, build more schools, get rid of that bullshit "no child left behind" crap that bush came out with.
    why the fuck cant these people actually fix problems? why do they have to do retarded shit?

    you expect teachers to work more for the same pay?
    you're an idiot.
     
  2. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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    How much does the average teacher make anyways?
     
  3. Drake

    Drake Well-Known Member VIP

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    Its another episode of Social Justice sponsored by the Democratic Party. Do you really think cost is there primary concern? Nope, its all about 'leveling the field' and sticking it to the man.
     
  4. kelsodeez

    kelsodeez New Member

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    in other news, california air resources board (carb) just got a 6.8 million dollar grant to increase the state referee programs across california. and guess who got the short end of it all? 8500 teachers laid off because of it. the government makes horrible decisions.
     
  5. SlushboxTeggy

    SlushboxTeggy It's only stupid if it doesn't work VIP

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    My mother makes about enough to put me and my siblings through state schools. It was never more than 2 of us at a time though.

    She also plans to retire in 2014 when "no child left behind" takes full effect and they are expected to be 100% proficient. 100%, even the special needs children. It's a time bomb and she's ducking out right before it explodes.

    And Obama's talking out his ass. Teachers are union. You want more, you pay more.
     
  6. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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    Soooo... like 50k or so? That's not bad considering teachers don't work a full year.
     
  7. invisibledemon

    invisibledemon Bored Moderator VIP

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    I really don't think it's that much. But you would have to pay me way more to deal with the shit that they have to deal with.
    Think about it, you can't punish kids, you can't fail them because of the no child left behind bs, they know this. The hours of school aren't the problem, it's the fact that teachers can't actually teach them. But obama won't look at that. He doesn't see that those other countries actually punish students, that the bad apples are weeded out through the years.

    It's the same as socialism, the smart kids see that the dumb kid who doesn't do his school work, doesn't listen, just hangs out all day talking shit, is also passing because they can't legally fail them, so the smart kid stops trying, why should he when he can coast through like the dumb shit?
     
  8. jamesA

    jamesA Well known pissed off telephone guy VIP

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    It just depends on the local economy and school system. A starting teacher in my old school makes about 26k. After a 20 year tenure they'll make upwards of 50-60k a year. EACS here was the richest school system in the county for years, Ft Wayne Community had a completely different pay scale due to the amount of schools vs city size. FWCS just restructured and closed 1 high and 2 elementary schools to save on operating costs.

    I like the idea of year round schools, but once again the federal government is trying to put a blanket bill on the entire country. I don't see how it's going to work without adding more government jobs and higher taxes to pay for both the jobs, operating costs for the schools and teacher/administrators salaries.
     
  9. E_SolSi

    E_SolSi Member of the 20 nut club Moderator VIP

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    it doesnt matter where the money is coming from or if the money will ever be there at all
    it doesnt matter if the project is properly funded or not
    it doent matter if the project is destined to go over budget by 800% before it even starts
    it doesnt even matter if the project ever even makes it to vote
    it doesnt matter if anyone ever actually sees any benefit from it at all

    its the thought that counts
    yes thats right... its the idea of it
    all that matters is that Group A can say that they wanted to do ________ to help you, but Group B struck it down because they hate you and want to eat your children

    all they want is to be able to point their finger and yell that the other side sucks
    and if it wasnt for the other side fucking it up by: voting it down, or blocking it from even getting to vote, or loading it with pork, or under funding it, or not managing it correctly, or not being serious enough in their handling of it, or blah blah fucking blah........... they could have made your life: better, easier, more meaningful, more pleasant, less tiresome, more fulfilling, smell better, look better, run smoother, last longer, :puke:


    its all bullshit designed to make you like them and get you to keep voting them in to power
    which is what it really all boils down to...
    them staying in power
     
  10. Ronny Cage

    Ronny Cage DaughterTestedMomApproved

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    in NJ teachers start at 35k a year... they dont make that much more year after year. Its ashame honestly. but in my area police officers also start between 35-40k and work their way up alot quicker from what I understand.

    this is the same obama that just pretty much made a world trade organization violation by taxing 30% on chinese tires. yea that started sept 26th unfortunately 25,000 tire and service people will probably be losing their jobs. FAIL
     
  11. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    let me start by saying this, i appreciate the work that teachers do and i DO think they are are underpaid.

    but........

    if you want money, take your 6 years of education and instead of being a high school teacher, go be an engineer, programmer, get your mba, do something else.

    teachers know full god damn well that the pay sucks. and if they go into that field not knowing, fuck them for their ignorance.

    if you do it because of the personal gratification of helping, awesome for you. if you do it because you want to get paid for a full year and only work 9 months, sweet. if you like the benefits and retirement system, i can understand.

    but don't fucking bitch about pay. ever. you know the time that it requires. you know what you have to deal with.

    if you want a good education, send your kid to private school. if you don't want to pay for private school and hate public schools, don't have kids.

    it's the point behind it though. now that obama is here, i have to pay for YOUR medical, YOUR kid's schooling, whats next?
     
  12. chestercheeto48

    chestercheeto48 Senior Member VIP

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    I started out in WI making 29,xxx and after 9 years through hard work on schooling and with my yearly contract wages + extra curriculars I am around 43,xxx and can top out around 56,xxx.

    -Really you can't be that ignorant...

    All I have to say about this is the following. Taxes paid for medical and school are not a new happening because of Obama. Schools are mostly funded with property taxes and if I am not mistaken medicaid and Medicare comes out of your check along with social sec and a couple of other things. Most private school teachers make around the same amount as their public school counterparts so that point is mute.

    Lastly about the pay - your right we shouldn't bitch about it in terms of take home pay. We bitch because compared to other professions out there we are not compensated for what we actually do. What do you do? How much do you make? Are you satisfied or do you want more money?

    There is not one person out here that got to where they are without some sort of educator - we all have that one teacher that has impacted us. I am not saying that all teachers are outstanding but those that are should be compensated and those that aren't should be able to be removed with little hassle.

    Hit the nail on the head - I wish we could go old fashioned on some of the kids that need it the most. The kids these days have no fear because mommy and daddy have their back or a lawyer on speed dial.
     
  13. Taco15

    Taco15 I wear stretchy pants VIP

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    i hate society i live in. Everytime i watch older 50's movies i wish i could go back to that time period. A time when people had some sense and morals.

    teachers here mostly do it becuase of the sheer willingness to make a difference. Usually the younger ones dont last. :) Even though they get cut or pay gets decreased they chug along. I would be damned if i had to deal someone else's misbehaved child.

    Of course you have the students wanting to learn but here in Tally, there isnt many of them.
     
  14. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    this has nothing to do with ignorance. the pay that teachers receive is a travesty. really, it is.

    but if you go to 6 years of schooling to become a high school teacher and you only make $45,000/year, thats your bad. you can make $100k+ in sales, hell, Jeffie makes 30% more than that and he works in a restaurant.

    school suck. they really do. i wouldn't send my kids to 99% of the public schools out there.

    if someone had pay being a priority in choosing a career field, they would NOT be teachers.

    I blame the government for shitty healthcare and i blame them for shitty schools. but i would rather have them be shitty than to pay twice for something, or even pay for something i dont' use at all (public schools).
     
  15. chestercheeto48

    chestercheeto48 Senior Member VIP

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    Couple of other things to think about:

    Ok hypothetical situation - what happens if teachers all follow your advice and seek private sector jobs. I am not just talking about a vast majority but the teaching profession ceases to exist? What would our country look like?

    I also get quite tired of the "I don't use public schools" arguement. It isn't rational. I don't use social security - nor will I ever get the chance and I still pay into it. I don't use the fireman in the fire house right across the street from my house and I still pay them. I don't get books from my local library but I still pay for it. BUT I MIGHT so I continue to pay. Although not the same you do use your public schools. Every single Doctor, Lawyer, Mechanic, Nurse, Dentist, Accountant and yes most likely even your carpenter, plumber or garbage man has at one time been through school. So let's say you hit your golden years assume your health starts to fail and you need to go see a specialist or you want to get your will in order. Chances are you will be using the service of somebody that went to a public school while you "were not using it". I know it might not be the best illustration but trust me even though you are not seeing it now you are using and will benifit from public schooling.
     
  16. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    1) i'm not worried about teachers taking private sector jobs. I would LOVE to see the best teachers making money they deserve. As with any career field, supply=demand. there will always be someone willing to work that field, or any field for that matter. if you want the best, you have to pay the best. it's just how it works. the yankees are usually the best team because they pay the most to their players and get the best players. if that breeds ignorance and lack of education among students, well, thats unfortunate.

    2) i'll pay extra to have the specialist help i need. i'm working my fucking ass off to get enough money saved and earned that i can go anywhere i want. health care is already so fucked that people are going out of the country for operations. the u.s. doesn't have the best doctors anymore, we don't have the best technical people, and we don't have the best attorneys. WHEN i reach my golden years, if shit sucks here, i'm fucking out. i'm not going to sit here and be subjected to incompetence because of my lack of effort throughout my career.

    if we continue on this path, i will pay extra to go somewhere to get the proper help i need. if i can't afford it, well then, i failed myself.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2009
  17. Korax

    Korax New Member

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    This is exactly the problem. If public schools continue failing there wont be any benefit. Things that are run privately (see for profit) are always more efficant and more productive.. at lower cost. Everything here is set up for lawyers and the unions. There is no accountability in the unions. Sure there are alot of teachers who want to make a difference. But how many horrible teachers did you have? I had quite a few that were just doing what they had to and nothing else. With out competition in pay you get terrible results. Parents don't care what their kids do anymore, producing people with no morals. People don't care about their communities.The ones who do don't do anything about it, like in gang infested areas. The lawyers get in there and exploit the healthcare companies and the goverment sets them up with vauge launguage. When they talk about "reform" they never talk about how they are going to stop all of this sueing of everyone. Jesus, how many times a day do I see Edgar Schneider commercials. Insurance companies and lawyers sueing the hell out of the doctors and hospitals all day. What the hell do people think is going to happen when its run by uncle sam. Just like schools its going to be a damned disaster.
     
  18. chestercheeto48

    chestercheeto48 Senior Member VIP

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    You can't run a school like a business

    Good article on that

     
  19. DarkHand

    DarkHand Senior Member VIP

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    Teachers at my (public) high school started at 60k and averaged 80k. Some were in the 6 figures.

    A few were good, but most were some of the worst teachers I've had in my life. More pay doesn't always equal better talent.
     
  20. 95b16coupe

    95b16coupe New Member

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    or it means that the job is fucking shit and you need to pay high to get employees there. either way, the teachers win.

    hell, garbage men make $45k, mostly because nobody wants to do it.
     
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