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Got Ticket today need help

Discussion in 'Members' Lounge' started by sleepercivic, Jun 3, 2004.

  1. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    Got a speeding ticket today, 72 in a 55, yeah I know speeding is bad.

    Does anyone know how often radar guns for NC state troopers must be calibrated?

    I know I can request the calibration records of the cops radar gun, and if it does fit the requirements I can get out of my ticket.

    any help would be appreciated

    TIA
     
  2. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    you can also argue other points regarding radar guns and the officer

    see if he was trained on the exact model gun he was using
    see if he was trained in the exact conditions as the day you were ticketed ie: sun vs rain, night vs day, etc
    see the last time he was trained for the gun...
    try and find ratings for the reliability and or possible failures of the gun in question...

    search online and you can find many other points to try and argue before the judge...
     
  3. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    ^Thanks again^
    It was sunny and clear, he was driving so it was a fixed unit inside the car.

    Also don't the police officers have to be certified every year or so ?
     
  4. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

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    just pay the freakin thing. chrsit. its what? 300 bucks max?
     
  5. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    probably at most but, NC they can take your liscense for 30 days
     
  6. pissedoffsol

    pissedoffsol RETIRED

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  7. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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  8. Loco Honkey

    Loco Honkey Banned

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    The police know that some douschebag is going to try this lame ass angle, so they make sure everything is current. Just pay the fucking fine. You were speeding. you broke the law. Pay the price. Move on.
     
  9. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    thanks for your opinion Loco Honkey
    anyone else
     
  10. K2e2vin

    K2e2vin Senior Member

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    no your license wont get suspended unless youre a repeat offender. i live in NC, so i know alot of people that have tickets(i never been caught before :) ) was it in a work zone? if it was; its going to be even harder to get out of it. they have low tolerance for that. the only thing i know that will get you out is if you were going as fast as everyone else.
     
  11. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    no it wasn't a work zone, it was a 2 lane country road and I haven't had any speeding tickets in 2 maybe 3 years.

    Do you know anything about "prayer for judgement"?

    I think it is something like the don't do anything as long is you don't get in trouble again, I not really sure though
     
  12. OldEMaltLiQuoR

    OldEMaltLiQuoR Senior Member

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    I used to work with an off duty cop @ this catering hall not too long ago. I can definitley verify what reckedracing said. They're supposed to have everything calibrated from the radar guns to the speedometers in their shitty looking crown victorias, Atleast once a month. And (in NYC) those are means for getting out of the ticket
    That said....you usually wont find a Police department that doesn't keep up to date.
    But this is what my boy has done and its worked twice already. He got his mechanic to write a note that his spedometer was broken, and gave him a fake reciept. When he showed in court, he just claimed that he didn't know how fast he was going.
    If your'e in good w/ your mechanic or even if you just slip him a $50, maybe you can get him to write it for you.

    Good Luck Man...cops suck ass.
     
  13. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    sounds good, I'm in BFE, nothing but a bunch of old counrty boys around here, they would probably just fine for faulty equipment on top of the speeding, but thanks though
     
  14. K2e2vin

    K2e2vin Senior Member

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    uh state troopers arent police.....
     
  15. chestercheeto48

    chestercheeto48 Senior Member VIP

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    pay the freaking ticket, next time use your brains at the moment of being pulled over. I have used "my girlfriend just found out she's pregnant" and faked having really bad hershey squirts as excuses why i was speeding. So far it has worked both times. 73/55 and 81/65.
     
  16. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    they've been getting a little out of control with the broken speedo thing, at least in NY

    now they require the actual speedo head to be sent out to a certified tech center to have it reviewed and repaired if need be...

    you could try something like i just had the tranny or cluth replaced and they didn't hook up the speedo cable, or just say that it hasn't worked since then so you appear to know nothing about cars?

    and to all the fools that said to just pay the ticket... you have to consider the insurance premiums... if the state has points or keeps track of traffic violations then a speeding ticket like that would prob add about 40% to your insurance EACH year for the next 3 to 4 years...

    not sure the rates in your particular area, but here in NY 40% would = another 800 bucks a year...
    so its not just the 300 bucks for the fine but also the thousands in extra insurance premiums...
    considering this FACT i don't see how ANYONE could say to just pay the fine

    fight the pigs...
    and sure it may be a long shot, but if it works then great, or else you could get it reduced to a lower charge, possible something not involving points on your license.

    EDIT: not what you are looking for but good info
     
  17. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    ^thanks^

    but anyone know the calibration requirenents for NC, or a link that maybe helpful, thanks again to everyone
     
  18. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    FROM: http://www.plylerlaw.com/in.html

    2 Points:
    Illegal passing
    Speeding in excess of 55 mph but less than 76 mph
    Driving on wrong side of road
    At-Fault accident resulting in property damage in excess of $1,500, but less than $2,500.

    When a driver receives a traffic citation or ticket in North Carolina, the financial impact upon that driver and other drivers in their family or household can be dramatic. A single ticket can substantially increase insurance costs. One insurance point results in a 25% increase in your NC insurance premium and two points results in a whopping 45% increase. Often a person may be tempted to plead guilty or responsible, not realizing that if the matter was properly handled by someone with knowledge and experience, they might have faced a lesser or possibly no increase in their insurance. Also, do not forget the importance of protecting a clean driving record, as it may help in the event that another ticket is received in the future


    EDIT:
    EXCEPTIONS: No points will be charged for: Speeding 10 mph or less over the posted speed limit provided that (1) the violation did not occur in a school zone; and (2) there is a clean driving record for the previous three years. [BUT, if a person gets a second moving violation within the three year period, then the points for BOTH tickets are assessed!!]. Additionally, each household can use one prayer for judgment continued (pjc) every three years as long as no one else in the household has used a PJC during that time. If multiple violations occur, only the violation with the higher point value is assessed. Lastly, points exceptions exist for certain at-fault accidents involving contact with animals or fowl, flying gravel or falling objects.

    Another site with many links that may help you...
    http://www.geocities.com/speeding@sbcglobal.net/Links.html
     
  19. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    yet another informative site for you:
    http://williambader.com/tickets.html

    the following is regarding a ticket in NC


    Last time I had the misfortune to be in NC, the gestapo was using mostly Kustom Signals MR-7's or KH-11 units. I happen to have an MR-7 and so am familiar with it's operation and problems. (bought it just so i could know my enemy.) I'll state flatly - every radar ticket can be beaten - if you put forth the effort. You have to decide if the effort is worth it. If you have some points and your insurance is in the 5 figure range, then maybe it is.

    First some theory. The radar works by measuring the doppler shift, eg, the change in frequency of an RF beam caused by motion. This motion must be normal to the radar. They cannot measure speed perpendicular to the beam. The gun contains an rf generator that transmits a microwave beam out the horn. A portion of this signal is diverted to the receiver. Reflections from all objects (cars, trees, atmospheric inversions, etc) are collected by the horn and applied to the receiver. The receiver mixes the 2 signals and outputs the difference. With no motion, the difference is 0, of course. With increasing speed, an increasing audio beat frequency is produced. The readout unit counts the frequency of this audio signal, scales it and displays it as a speed.

    The first important thing to note is that the signal is an audio tone. There are many ways for an audio tone to become superimposed on the signal other than from speed. ANY tone withing the expected bandwidth will be displayed as the equivilent speed.

    The second thing to note is that the receiver, since it responds to amplitude signals, will "capture" and display the strongest signal. This may very well be your car or it could be the semi truck a half mile back or even the heater blower in the cop car.

    Following are some techniques I've used.

    1. First, process them to death. Subpoena (sp) the radar unit, the ticket book, his calibration log, his radio log, the service record on the radar unit, the FCC license of the radar gun, his patrol car, and the tickets he's issued over the last 6 months or so. Here's why. The radar gun must be licensed by the FCC. IT's call letters must be attached to the transmitter. A log of operations must be kept. No highway patrol I've ever encountered has ever conformed to these rules. You can attack his ability to properly operate the unit by showing his non-conformance to the rules. Radar units are known to be unstable. All units are shipped with tuning forks that are designed to display a known frequency. Most states require that a calibration be performed immediately before and after the stop. The only way to prove that is to show a log. No cop I've ever seen maintains a log. This is easy shooting. You also want to look at the service history of the unit. If it's been in the shop often, the it may have been mal- functioning when he stopped you. If it has NOT been in the shop, then question the maintenance practices and calibration. (nifty logic, eh?).

    You will want to review his ticket book to look at his pattern. If all his tickets are written for about the same speed, you can raise the possiblility of a systematic error in his gun or his use of the gun. If he writes them close together, you can maintain that he did not have time to calibrate adn log the unit between stops.

    you will want to have the car available to demonstrate other sources of error to be listed.

    As a practical matter, many tickets end here. The state does not want to take a revenue producing car and radar out of service and the cop probably does not want to use an off-day in court.

    2. if item 1 fails to stop the ticket, be ready to show how the cop can introduce errors. Remember ANY amplitude modulation of the radar signal will be displayed. You want to have the gun and the cop car at the court house. One of the most common sources of errors is allowing the gun to read the heater fan in the car! The fan makes a nice chopper which will modulate the microwave beam. To show this, simply have the gun in the car, behind the dashboard and kinda aim it down toward the defrost vents. You may have to wave it around a bit to find the fan (which should be on max hi). Most fans will generate a speed of between 40 and 70 mph. In addition to generating a speed indication of it's own, the fan can interefere with or mix with the reflection of the car.

    Another source of intereference is the car's alternator. the ripple of the alternator can be detected by the gun. In one of my cars, I have to run the radar from a separate battery because of the intereference.

    3. Propose that the signal that the cop read was not from your car and instead came from a vehicle behind you. Typically a semi truck. I have a video tape I made of some real life situations where the radar gun picked up a truck a half mile away while ignoring a compact car fairly close in. (don't ask for the tape, lord knows where it is). I'd suggest arranging a demo or a tape of this phenomena. You should have a real good "memory" of trucks behind you. I'll guarantee that the cop will not remember this detail. He's so intent on nabbing that "damn speeder" that he gets tunnel vision while concentrating on the pursuit.

    4. If it was raining or inclement or foggy, then attack that as an important source of error. Most states prohibit use of radar in inclement weather because of intereference from lightning, rain drops, hail, etc.

    5. Ask if the cop operated his radio while clocking traffic. he probably cannot remember or will say he did not. Be prepared for this. Ask him about his reporting procedures when beginning pursuit and when stopping a vehicle. ALL departments require thier officers to make a radio report when doing either of the above. ANY radio will cause intereference with the radar. I can generate all manner of speed indications with my amateur radio handi-talkie. Most police radios run much more power than my amateur radios.

    6. Ask about any emergency equipment such as flashing lights or sirens in use during clocking. all contain motors or high power electronics which cause intereference.

    7. Have the cop demonstrate the electronic calibration feature of the readout. This is different from the tuning fork calibration. This function, normally invoked by a CAL switch on the unit, verifies the readout operation by making the unit display a speed of 64 mph. This "speed" can be locked in just like a real reading. It is suspiciously close to 65 mph, especially considering all digital circuits' +-1 count inherent uncertanty. I acutally had a cop try this ploy on me once. It pissed him off that I had a radar detector so he fabricated a 64 mph speed and pulled me over. Most all radar guns have a little indicator on the display which shows that the "reading" came from the CAL function. When I pointed this indicator out to the cop, he got real hostile real fast ... but he let me go, hi. This defense is very effective but must be approached with caution. You do not want to piss the cop-sympathetic judge off by calling the cop an out-and-out liar. you want to kinda skirt the issue and imply the course of action.

    The above should give you a good selection of options. the key here is wear the bastards down and create a reasonable level of doubt in the judge's mind as to your guilt. You should also 1) get a copy of "the Ticket book" available from most book stores and 2) contact Cincinatti Microwave, makers of the Escourt radar detector. They have a number of handy legal defence aids. "The Ticket Book" was written by a former cop and is designed to teach you how to beat tickets.

    For future use, I'd suggest a good radar detector (Escort) and some practice at evasive manuveurs. Radar guns are very cheap on the surplus market (<100 bux). It's amazing what you can do with a little practice. In the last 10 years, I've only been stopped 2 times and beat both. I consist- ently drive 80+ on the interstates. IT's all in paying attention to the warning indications and in technique. Radar CAN be beat. Now if some kind soul would send me a LAWS rocket for use against the helicopters.....
     
  20. sleepercivic

    sleepercivic Senior Member

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    thanks for the replies, I'm at work so I haven't had a chance to read them all yet, but I do appreciate them, keep them coming
     
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