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Joe Biden: "be patriotic, pay more taxes"

Discussion in 'Members' Lounge' started by Capt. Orygun, Sep 18, 2008.

  1. Capt. Orygun

    Capt. Orygun Win the Day

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    AP News : LimaOhio.com

    how is this change?

    The natural come back is "only the wealthy, not the normal people", anyone who has an inkling of economic insight knows this isn't true.

    All Freddie Mac and Fannie May stuff aside, the real problem with the economy for the American family is the need for more jobs and higher wages to offset energy costs. It's pretty simple at the end of the day.

    Businesses expand and grow based on capital. Less capital=less growth, this is BASIC economics. By raising taxes that capital goes to the federal government and when it comes time to think about expanding, and creating more jobs, the capital is gone. End result is Obama's tax policy WILL hurt those making less then 250K, how do I know this for sure? I've lived it.

    My father doesn't make 250K/yr, not even close. But he does own a local insurance agency. We still haven't replaced some of our turnover in the last year, we don't have the capital. We're trying to do more with less in this troubled economy. Obama's tax increases on business will give us even less to work with, which means less jobs for the local community, less profits for the agency, which results in less income for my father who makes less then 250K/yr.

    But Obama/Biden still insist he's safe from tax increases, and so's the person who would have been highered had we enough capital to hire her. But it just doesn't play out that way. We've heard don't worry under Clinton, and it played out exactly the same way.

    So what's Biden want? Give more money to the government? You mean the two branches of it who combined only have the support of 1 in 3 Americans? Largely because they're fleecing us? No thanks Biden, you've seen enough of our money within the decades you've been in congress, and America has seen too little return on our investment. You don't get more, infact you're gonna get less. And John McCain isn't going to let you use it for earmarks anymore.

    Get your hand out of the cookie jar Biden, the kitchen's closed.
     
  2. cressidakiller

    cressidakiller New Member

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    biden the marxist.
    is he implying that the poor that pay little/no taxes aren't patriotic? ;)
    maybe its a rangel attack. ;)
     
  3. nootrac22

    nootrac22 Well-Known Member VIP

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    it's the american way nowadays, we don't know how to save just spend and spend. Our govt is a prime example of it, they spend too much.
     
  4. Sabz5150

    Sabz5150 FALCON PUNCH!!!

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  5. Capt. Orygun

    Capt. Orygun Win the Day

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    nobody said anything about McCain's ads, what I'm talking about is my experience of the Democrat's tax policy under Clinton as experienced by my family's small business.
     
  6. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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    From what I've heard Obama is just going to let Bush's tax breaks for the people that make over a certain amount of money expire, is that correct? From the little I know, it just seems like the big corporations don't actually pump that extra money back into the economy to help out the little guys, they just pocket it. But if anyone wants to enlighten me further it would be appreciated :)
     
  7. Capt. Orygun

    Capt. Orygun Win the Day

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    when companies have allot of money they can expand in the name of growing and making even more money. In doing so they would create more production jobs which will require more management jobs more HR, etc etc. That's how tax breaks for companies help the average joe and Obama will hurt that process. I don't care what anybody says, he will hurt that process. My family owns a small business and a Bush Christmas was better then a Clinton Christmas growing up.

    I'm all for individuals who make over 250K being hit with some higher taxes, but when you're business tax plan hurts small business owners under your 250K cap then you've failed to create a plan which even does what you want it to do. And that's the truth of Obama's plan, it hurts small business owners for owning small businesses and contributes to the growing "wall mart economy" which prevents mom and pop organizations from competing.

    What you need is higher PERSONAL income taxes on the wealthy, lower business tax with tax penalties on companies who outsource labor and tarriffs on incoming good from other countries that compete with American goods, like stuff from China. And tax breaks for small businesses employing under 30 people.
     
  8. EGProject

    EGProject YEEEEAAHHHHH

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    Another reason to vote McCain this fall. No Obamunism for me.

    I absolutely hate how Biden and Obama can talk up the fact that they are for the "working man" and that they will give tax breaks to middle income families, then turn around and spout elitist crapola at another rally 50 miles away. I know double talk happens everywhere, but the amount of smugness Obama supporters exibit simply baffles me, and everyone who seems to think his policies (and Bidens) are great - end up not knowing anything about his policies at all. They just think hes a "great guy".

    NObama 08'. Keep the change.
     
  9. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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    Thanks Silverchild for answering my question. I strongly agree with you on what you had to say, higher taxes for the rich but not for the small businesses that would fall under that same category.


    So you're going to vote for the ol' war hero huh? Why won't he release his medical documents? Why is Palin against providing free rape kits? Why does Palin believe it is okay to snub subpoenas?

    I'm not accusing you of your beliefs or choices, I just want to know how you justify voting for Mccain. At this time I'm personally for Obama. I want to know why you're voting for Mccain, not why you're not going to vote for Obama. I'm just trying to become as learned as I possibly can, hearing as many different opinions as you can seems like a good starting point.
     
  10. Celerity

    Celerity Well-Known Member

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    Did your brain get repoed ?
     
  11. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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    No, did yours?
     
  12. Celerity

    Celerity Well-Known Member

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    Obama won't even prove he's a citizen. He's had his job as a lawmaker for 6 months and now wants to be president, and has not made one INKLING of a plan of what to do if he's voted. He's sworn allegiance to Islam and his on-tour behavior to the middle east (His treatment of the press) borderlines INSANE.

    "Don't tell me why you won't vote Obama" . Under the circumstances, can't. I also can't quite swallow that someone is "looking for all the facts" and defaults to Obama.

    He's dangerous. Superdelegates were invented to prevent this from happening like it did in 68. The entire democratic party is insane - wholly.
     
  13. |Chaz|

    |Chaz| Well-Known Member VIP

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  14. BigJ

    BigJ I'm just about that action Boss. VIP

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  15. Sabz5150

    Sabz5150 FALCON PUNCH!!!

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    You expected way too much. This is the guy who still thinks he's a Muslim.
     
  16. Speedracer228

    Speedracer228 ......

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    What do the top ten cities with the highest poverty rate all have in common?

    Detroit , MI (1st on the poverty rate list) hasn't elected a Republican mayor since 1961;

    Buffalo, NY (2nd) hasn't elected one since 1954;

    Cincinnati , OH (3rd)...since 1984;

    Cleveland , OH (4th)...since 1989;

    Miami , FL (5th) has never had a Republican mayor;

    St. Louis , MO (6th)....since 1949;

    El Paso , TX (7th) has never had a Republican mayor;

    Milwaukee , WI (8th)...since 1908;

    Philadelphia , PA (9th)...since 1952;

    Newark , NJ (10th)...since 1907.

    Einstein once said, "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

    It is the disadvantaged who habitually elect Democrats --- yet are still disadvantaged.
    :ph34r:
     
  17. Sabz5150

    Sabz5150 FALCON PUNCH!!!

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    What a wonderful example of correlation not equaling causation. That and a nice copy-paste job.

    Miami has never had a Repub mayor? Xavier Suarez - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Suarez also fired three city managers in 40 days and ordered the mass firing of 70 city officials. The latter measure he was forced to rescind after the state’s attorney concluded that he had overstepped his authority.

    Suarez was removed from office in March 1998 when a court ruled that there was absentee ballot fraud in an election against Joe Carollo


    Wow, typical Republican right there!

    Also, all mayors from Milwaukee, WI since that date have not been Democrats.
     
  18. Sabz5150

    Sabz5150 FALCON PUNCH!!!

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  19. ejclide

    ejclide Swapper for life!

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    Bar Stool Economics

    Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

    The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
    The fifth would pay $1.
    The sixth would pay $3.
    The seventh would pay $7.
    The eighth would pay $12.
    The ninth would pay $18.
    The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

    So, that's what they decided to do. The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. 'Since you are all such good customers, he said, 'I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the ten now cost
    just $80.

    The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?' They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

    And so:

    The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).
    The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
    The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
    The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
    The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
    The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

    Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

    'I only got a dollar out of the $20', declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,' but he got $10!'

    'Yeah, that's right', exclaimed the fifth man. 'I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got ten times more than I!'


    'That's true!!' shouted the seventh man. 'Why should he get $10 back when I got only two? The wealthy get all the breaks!'

    'Wait a minute,' yelled the first four men in unison. 'We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!'

    The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

    And that, boys and girls, journalists and college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

    David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D. Professor of Economics,
    University of Georgia

    For those who understand, no explanation is needed. For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.




    Yes, I know, it's a copy and paste, but I credited the real author of this. I love this guy, he's actually really funny in person.
     
  20. DarkHand

    DarkHand Senior Member VIP

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    Uber generalization mode = ON

    Obama wants our guns taken away, but he'll never get it done.

    Bush III wants to go to war with everyone, and he can get it done.

    I've got to go with Obama this time around. His good stuff can get done, his bad stuff will take alot of fighting. With McCain I see nothing but lower taxes while we die. I see more overall good coming out of it with Obama, sadly.


    We're back in giant douche and turd sandwich territory.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2008
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