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Motor Rebuild Novice...

Discussion in 'Engine Building' started by reckedracing, Oct 6, 2005.

  1. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    So i have this d16z6 that has a severe oil burning issue, i got burned on this deal pretty bad...

    so i was considering rebuilding the motor, i would like to do the rings and the valve seals...

    questions...
    if you remove the crank, can you reuse the bearings? or do you need to install new ones?
    kinda like a headgasket, you NEVER reuse them, does the same apply to crank bearings?

    ring replacement...
    is it possible to simply replace the stock rings with new stock rings? i realize if the cylinder walls are scored then you want to bore and get bigger pistons and matching rings, but if you want to avoid getting new pistons and there appears to be minimal piston sloppy-ness can you just use new rings?
     
  2. GSRCRXsi

    GSRCRXsi Super Moderator Moderator VIP

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    you dont HAVE to replace bearings if the crank and bearings still look good, but its good practice to replace them. i would at least check the clearances to make sure they are still within spec.

    the rings, if you need to overbore, you will need to get oversized pistons, and oversized rings.
     
  3. formby

    formby learning in progress

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    if you can get away with a hone then you can use the same size rings...if you bore then you need new pistons and rings
     
  4. 97CTR

    97CTR Senior Member

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    NEVER reuse bearings, well maybe if they only had a few thousand miles. But if you are having a oil burning issues chances are you need new bearings. Take the block to a mahcine shop and have them check the cylinders for any out of round conditions. If they are fine have them run a hone through it, if out of round go oversize.
     
  5. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    see, here's the thing, i can get a complete d16z6 long block for what? 100-400 bucks depending on the seller...

    so is it even worth it to rebuild the motor?
    i was gonna rip it down, throw in new rings and valve seals to stop it from smoking...
    valve seals = 20ish? maybe 30
    standard ring set = 50-60?
    headgasket set = 100-150

    if i have to take it to a machine shop then i'm looking at even more...

    new bearings, oversized pistons and rings, valve seals, head milling and a relap = $$$

    i don't want to sacrifice sleeve strencth with a bore, i don't want to raise compression with a mill job, and i don;t want to spend 500 bucks when i could replace the motor, or better yet just get a b18 ls or b16 swap...
     
  6. reikoshea

    reikoshea HS Troll...And Mod Moderator VIP

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    personally i say chunk the D, but i would definitely replace the bearing if you have smoking.
     
  7. Xaero3953

    Xaero3953 Senior Member

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    I make it a point to always use new bearings, seals, gaskets, for any reason. I'd just rather not risk it. It'd be easier and maybe cheaper to just buy a new longblock, but It'd give you something to do if you have the time. I'm on my second "rebuilding" project, just 'cause it's fun, and I have nothing better to do.

    [​IMG] Good luck.
     
  8. hotrex

    hotrex Senior Member

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    in my opinion, if the bearings look good reuse em. a turbo honda isnt going to last for more than what. 30k miles tops? thats just me though

    i have my built b16a going together right now, and when i took the motor apart it was burning oil. and the bearings are mint. i will be reusing them.

    it all depends on the amount of money you want to spend, and how safe you feel reusing shit. i personally have no problem with it.
     
  9. hcivic.com

    hcivic.com Senior Member

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    bearings are a one time use. What is your oil pressure reading? if its good then you can get away with reusing them, but myself i would replace them. also think of the valve cover gasket, Im. exhuast, cam seals. Your gonna be better of buying a complete gasket kit it is far cheaper. as for the pistons and rings it all depends on condition
     
  10. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    It's not a big deal to reuse bearings. If they are within spec, then they'll be fine. If they are still within spec, but near the end of their service life, I'd replace them while your engine is apart. Bearings aren't expensive. If you are burning oil, you are likely passing oil through the compression rings. Your rings are probably fried anyway. Here is what I would do if I just wanted to get the thing running good again. Assuming your engine is already apart:

    Take the block to a machine shop, have them hot tank it, magnaflux, hone, and deck it to get mating surface nice and flat. A good hone, clean and milling shouldn't cost more than 150 from a respectable shop.

    Check bearing clearances, replace if the bearings are not within spec. If it is close, use your good judgement.

    If your pistons are not cracked, and your block is in good shape, you shouldn't need to buy anything but the gasket kit, ring set, valve seals, and a tube of hondabond.

    I cannot forsee this costing you more than 400 for the complete rebuild. If you have the cash, a valve job would be a good thing to get too, maybe 200 for a standard VJ. At least lap the valves before reassembly, if you do not opt for a VJ. 400 for a fresh engine >>>> 200 for a junkyard block.

    That is pretty much a Cliff's notes of the Helms. Get a Helms if you are going to do the work yourself. Period. And a good torque wrench.
     
  11. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    so i got the motor ripped down...

    this is an experiment of sorts, many things combine for my final decisions, such as time, very limited, $$$ also limited, etc

    so the exhaust valves were pretty burnt, the upper rings were stuck into the pistons, lower rings were ok, and oil rings seem ok

    i'm going to do a light hone, new standard size rings, valve lap, clean all the carbon from the chambers, valves, and exhaust ports, and change valve seals...

    i think it will end up running ok...

    opinions...?

    anyone have a pic of their valve job or lapping?
     
  12. phyregod

    phyregod !!YTINASNI

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    You should replace your crank/rod bearings while you are that deep into the motor. Might as well, its cheap insurance.
     
  13. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    the bearings show a little wear but overall look ok...
    i'm not even sure if re-ringing the pistons will get me back into decent compression ranges so i don't wanna dump the $$$ on bearings when i might not even be able to run the motor

    i talked to a fuck bag at autozone when trying to get some parts...
    he told me 8psi on a dinky IHI off a 626 is gonna blow my motor
    i'm going full uberdata, larger injectors, walbro fuel pump, intercooled, and a wideband
    little to no chance i will grenade the motor...

    i have a better chance of buring the valves again and losing compression that way...
     
  14. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    werd, they are like $12 per half. now multiply that by 18 (4 rods * 2 halves, + 5 journals * 2 halves).
    how do you know they are okay? Did you plastigage? You can't just eyeball anything in a motor.

    If you hone (assuming cylinders are not out of round), get new rings, and either lap the valves or get a vj, your compression should be fine. You said your exhaust valves are pretty burnt, please explain. a lot of carbon can deposit on the valves, but not be indicative of burnt valves, they just need to be cleaned. If you want to resuse the bearings, just make sure you label which ones are which. If you forgot to do that and alreay took things apart, just replace them.
     
  15. reckedracing

    reckedracing TTIWWOP VIP

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    everything has been labeled and can go back together just as it came apart...

    the valve seats are a little pitted, exhaust valves are white-ish with lots of buildup on the valve head, lots of carbon deposits on the stem and in the ports...
     
  16. MikeBergy

    MikeBergy Blah blah blah....

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    I'd go with a valve job if the seats are pitted. Try taking the carbon deposits off with a little steel wool and clean it up a little. I used a little dremel polishing stone on my dremel to clean the carbon off, which worked well, and a few of them only set me back 10 or so dollars and a couple hours of my time. Of course I was pnp'ing my head myself, so whats a few hours to the 150 or so hours I spent on the rest of the head? The valves sound fairly normal. Just get the parts cleaned, plastgage the bearings and order parts you need from there.
     
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