'91 Civic Hatch Si W/ D16a6

[captainbad]

I'm rather new to the topic of swapping engines so please forgive my ignorance. I've read a lot of posts and have yet to find a consensus on what is the all around best swap for a 4g w/ D16A6. By 'all-around' I mean: price, ease of swap, power, torque and future mods. I decided I wanted to keep my '91 Hatch as a fun, relatively street legal , non-race car; but fast & powerful too. I've 156k on this lil sucker and she still runs great but she's been worked...hard. I really don't think she's got much left to give. I haven't heard much good about D series anything. Sooooo, gentlemen, any assistance that you could provide would be greatly appreciated. In the meantime, other than increasing airflow ( intake, header, exhaust) are there any other tweaks ( not NOS or Turbo) that I can impliment to squeeze more power & torque out of her? Chip? Cam? Cam gear? Under drive? I don't want to do too much to the top end and lose the bottom before I can do the swap. Thanks in advance!

 

[xj0hnx]

So el capiton,what are you looking to spend on this here swap?

 

[captainbad]

I venture a guess of 1-2g's but I'd like to get a good balance of the 'all-around' criteria in the original post. A 'most bang for the buck' scenario.

 

[xj0hnx]

B16A1 siR is good for that then.The mounts needed can be bought for aroud 300-499 depending on how hard you look,I've seen some recently for 250.The changeover complete should run about 1150+300 or so shipping+mounts would leave you 200-300 to play with if something comes up and for little extras like fluids exhaust refitting etc...Or you could get a b18a or a zc,but IMO you'd be happier with the B16 for your purposes.

 

[captainbad]

Thanks B. I called a local shop that get's low milage engines from japan. They say they'll do the JDM ZC for the D16 for a g out the door. Not really any great power change but I'm learning that my rings are more than likely collapsed and a new engine is a must....

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by captainbad@Jan 29 2003, 10:24 PM
They say they'll do the JDM ZC for the D16 for a g out the door.

Is that the install or just the motor?Make sure it is the DOHC,the SOHC are pieces of shit.

 

[captainbad]

Though I didn't ask that question directly, I got the distinct impression that it was the motor & install. Is the ZC dohc or sohc? isn't the dohc a z6?

 

[red95solsi]

z6 is sohc vtec zc can be sohc or dohc non-vtec

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by red95solsi@Jan 29 2003, 10:38 PM
z6 is sohc vtec zc can be sohc or dohc non-vtec

There are way too many different "ZC" motors to say they are this or that.Most of what gets called ZC is Labeled D series here in the states.

Though I didn't ask that question directly, I got the distinct impression that it was the motor & install

Ask this question directly.Get it in writing.

 

[captainbad]

Thanks red I checked a web site and you are correct sir! The cool thing is, if I do this particular swa (D16A6 out, ZC in), I get +/-30 hp jump with out my bolt on's. That is appealing to me.

 

[SleEPeR_CRX]

Dude, if u want power. u cannot beat the LS, its the most poweful engine in ur pricerange. Torque power is alot more fun than Vtec power IMO, u can always get good top end with vtec or turbo or nos, but u cant get a B16a with the same bottem end as any LS. i got my LS for 2000 complete. and with i/e i smoke most cars in my area no problem.

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by SleEPeR_CRX@Jan 30 2003, 01:19 AM
i got my LS for 2000 complete. and with i/e i smoke most cars in my area no problem.

A B16A1 complete can be had for $1150 and the cost of mounts and will be doing better than a LS.

 

[SleEPeR_CRX]

dude, u got it for 1150 US+mounts. thats like 3200 canadian. and i doubt thats full swap. i looked into it here, and had it all ready. mounts 400 engine 2300 linkage integra rear mount and all that would easily be over 1000 bucks more. so compare 3200 ( canadian) for B16a or 2000)canadian) FULL SWAP for b18a. and ive riden and drove in b18a ZC and B16a civic's/crx's before i made my choice on swap. the torque from the B18a is more pratical in everyday driving, will beat any B16a from 0-60 and will only lose after that do to lack of vtec. who cares about a race after 100 anyway. trust me man b18a is way to go.

 

[captainbad]

Ok, I've done some research and here's what I came up with: For me, for now, the ZC DOHC is the motor of choice. To do anything else will at minimum +/-$400 just for the mounts and untold incidentals. I'm intent on doing a ZC/Si tranny hybrid (which I've read is a kick ass combo for this set up; I believe uses the front 1-5 from a ZC and the final from an Si) I also know that by using the DOHC ZC I'll need a new hood (which is ok since a unavoidable bouncing tool box on the freeway wiped the current one); I have a choice of 3 ECU's: the stock Si, 88-89 teg, and the ZC. They all plug straight into the wiring harness and are all OBD0 or preOBD? right?; and some minor doctoring of the distributor plug from round (1- 7 pin) to square (2- 1 5 pin and 1 2 pin); I'll need to port my 4-1 Mugen style header flange about 3mm with a die grinder to fit the ZC manifold. Have I missed anything guys?
I'm doing this swap because I suspect, which I believe a compression leak-down test will confirm, my head gasket is partially blown allowing water in to one or more cylinders or, a cracked head and/or block ( I think the latter is unlikely- the overheat (due to a cracked piece of crap stock radiator) wasn't THAT bad; and, I may have collapesed rings (I'm burning more oil than Honda states is normal- something like 1Q/k mi. for higher milage engines such as mine)....so anyway, im curious, are the SOHC and DOHC head interchangable on the ZC block?

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by SleEPeR_CRX@Jan 30 2003, 09:14 AM
the torque from the B18a is more pratical in everyday driving, will beat any B16a from 0-60 and will only lose after that do to lack of vtec. who cares about a race after 100 anyway. trust me man b18a is way to go.

You obviously haven't raced any B16's,I'll take your b18a apart with a B16.And "who cares about a race over a hundred?In the 1/4 it is who can get going how fast the fastest buddy if your motor tops at 100 and I got 27 more miles an hour guess what?You lose.Do some research before you start advising people what will blow what away.

 

[SleEPeR_CRX]

Dude, personally when i drive i dont use 120+ normally. nor can my car do it on the 1/4mile, b16a's have a great feel but can never make up torque, where a B18a can always make up hp. ive driven both man,and the b18a is a way better feeling engine

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by SleEPeR_CRX@Jan 31 2003, 02:58 AM
Dude, personally when i drive i dont use 120+ normally. nor can my car do it on the 1/4mile, b16a's have a great feel but can never make up torque, where a B18a can always make up hp. ive driven both man,and the b18a is a way better feeling engine

I'mnot saying a motor with more torque doesn't feel good,just don't be making statments like a B18A is "always" going to beat a B16 0-60 because it doesn't,vtec isn't a makeshift turbo that dominates the world,but the 16 makes more hp and does it faster.

 

[SleEPeR_CRX]

agreed. i know a b18a wont always, but take a b18 and a b16 with i/h/e and the same driver. the b18a will pretty much always beat it 0-60, which is pretty much the only kinda racing that people do in town. 1/4 mile i know the b16a will beat it, but in normal daily driving u cant get going that fast anyway.