b18c crank into b16a

[jamesA]

will it swap right in? or would I have to do any extra work?

I searched but didn't find much. Just want to be sure, I was looking back through some old posts and I'm thinking of just doing that swap and getting some IB Spec rods and pistons. I'm sure that'd save me a shit load of cash over a stroker kit.

 

[GSRCRXsi]

i THINK the crank itself will bolt in but it will be a bad idea. you will need custom super short rods. you might also have some issues with the cylinder walls over a while. id imagine with shorter rods and a longer stroke that it will put more force on the cylinder walls when the piston is comming up, since the rod will be at more of an angle against it. feel free to chime in here, mike (cal), if im wrong. but thats the picture in my head. i say the best thing to do if you want more displacement is to bore it out. just my .02

 

[phunky.buddha]

Yup, it'll work- but yup, you'll need shorter rods and/or higher wrist pins.

B16 stroke = 77.0mm
B16 rods = 134.36mm

B18C stroke = 87.2mm
B18C rods = 137.9mm

You'll either have to run rods that are 5.1mm shorter, move the pin up in the piston 5.1mm, or have some combination of shorter rods or higher pin setups that would make up the 5.1mm overall difference that everything would have to be shorter by.



The stock B16A piston to deck height is about half a millimeter, so you could still make up some room there by going flush with the surface of the block- but you would still have 4.6mm to cut down somewhere. The high pin Endyn pistons that I ran in my GSR block for a while had a pin that was .137 inches higher than normal (3.4798mm), so if you had a set of those, you could just run 133.23mm long rods and get away clean. Everything would be custom.... or you could run pistons like Tech43 uses and still have your stock rod length. Their pistons have a compression height of 0.851 inches, so you could actually run an LS crank in your B16 block with those and still use your stock rods.

Tech43:

http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=951003

My Endyns:

Rod/stroke with that weirdass custom setup (GSR crank) I laid out: 1.5279:1
Rod/stroke with Tech43's setup (LS crank): 1.5393

Up to you. If you really want to stroke the B16, the Tech43 kit might be the way to go. Oh- all the B cranks are interchangeable as far as physically bolting into your block.

 

[phunky.buddha]

Hmm I was just doing some dirty math....

Tech 43 .851" compression height pistons
B16 crank (77mm stroke)
B18 block (86mm bore)
Custom rods at 147.1783mm

1.911:1 rod/stroke ratio

1789cc monster that revs like a mofo

With an 84mm bore, you could run 1707cc and boost like hell, then rev to 10k to get insane horsepower.



Ok bed time.

 

[jamesA]

awesome!! thank you Cal, I'm thinking of getting a b18c (but i would go b18a/b as well) crank and calling up Jeff at IB to get some custom rods and pistons made for the application instead of spending 2400 on a whole stroker kit.

 

[spectacle]

Originally posted by Calesta@Dec 21 2004, 08:31 AM
http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=951003

[post=435238]Quoted post[/post]​

damn that dood CallMeJesus got pwned. hard.

 

[99SiRidinLow]

Originally posted by Calesta@Dec 21 2004, 03:31 AM
Yup, it'll work- but yup, you'll need shorter rods and/or higher wrist pins.

B16 stroke = 77.0mm
B16 rods = 134.36mm

B18C stroke = 87.2mm
B18C rods = 137.9mm

You'll either have to run rods that are 5.1mm shorter, move the pin up in the piston 5.1mm, or have some combination of shorter rods or higher pin setups that would make up the 5.1mm overall difference that everything would have to be shorter by.



The stock B16A piston to deck height is about half a millimeter, so you could still make up some room there by going flush with the surface of the block- but you would still have 4.6mm to cut down somewhere. The high pin Endyn pistons that I ran in my GSR block for a while had a pin that was .137 inches higher than normal (3.4798mm), so if you had a set of those, you could just run 133.23mm long rods and get away clean. Everything would be custom.... or you could run pistons like Tech43 uses and still have your stock rod length. Their pistons have a compression height of 0.851 inches, so you could actually run an LS crank in your B16 block with those and still use your stock rods.

[post=435238]Quoted post[/post]​

Thats what I am doing.. And you have to use the LS crank and LS rods (and the rods need rebushed to .702 I think, shotpeening them and using ARP rod bolts wouldn't be a bad Idea either.).... Gives you a 1.9L b16 with a bore of 82mm.. All motor beast in a b16

 

[phunky.buddha]

Originally posted by revolution8k+Dec 21 2004, 08:26 AM-->

awesome!! thank you Cal, I'm thinking of getting a b18c (but i would go b18a/b as well) crank and calling up Jeff at IB to get some custom rods and pistons made for the application instead of spending 2400 on a whole stroker kit.

[post=435276]Quoted post[/post]​

99SiRidinLow@Dec 22 2004, 02:14 AM
Thats what I am doing.. And you have to use the LS crank and LS rods (and the rods need rebushed to .702 I think, shotpeening them and using ARP rod bolts wouldn't be a bad Idea either.).... Gives you a 1.9L b16 with a bore of 82mm.. All motor beast in a b16

[post=435743]Quoted post[/post]​

Honestly- I think it would still be better to run a straight B18B block. They're really not that expensive, and your pistons would be standard issue items with solid ring lands. The internal geometry would be the same since you're still using the LS crank and rods. The only real advantage to running the B16 block with the B18 crank and rods is to make people think that you only have a 1.6 under the hood.

 

[hybrid89]

Originally posted by Calesta+Dec 22 2004, 01:05 PM-->

Originally posted by revolution8k@Dec 21 2004, 08:26 AM
awesome!! thank you Cal, I'm thinking of getting a b18c (but i would go b18a/b as well) crank and calling up Jeff at IB to get some custom rods and pistons made for the application instead of spending 2400 on a whole stroker kit.

[post=435276]Quoted post[/post]​

99SiRidinLow

@Dec 22 2004, 02:14 AM
Thats what I am doing.. And you have to use the LS crank and LS rods (and the rods need rebushed to .702 I think, shotpeening them and using ARP rod  bolts wouldn't be a bad Idea either.).... Gives you a 1.9L b16 with a bore of 82mm.. All motor beast in a b16 

[post=435743]Quoted post[/post]​

Honestly- I think it would still be better to run a straight B18B block. They're really not that expensive, and your pistons would be standard issue items with solid ring lands. The internal geometry would be the same since you're still using the LS crank and rods. The only real advantage to running the B16 block with the B18 crank and rods is to make people think that you only have a 1.6 under the hood.

[post=435886]Quoted post[/post]​

couldn't have said it better myself... Great idea's, but sometimes a waste of time and money, unless you are stuck to a certain dsiplacement via sanctions, other than that, just go the B18B

 

[phunky.buddha]

 

[jamesA]

Originally posted by Calesta@Dec 22 2004, 01:05 PM
Honestly- I think it would still be better to run a straight B18B block. They're really not that expensive, and your pistons would be standard issue items with solid ring lands. The internal geometry would be the same since you're still using the LS crank and rods. The only real advantage to running the B16 block with the B18 crank and rods is to make people think that you only have a 1.6 under the hood.

[post=435886]Quoted post[/post]​

I would, you nailed one reason why I want to keep the b16, and I also want to see what I can do with the stock motor, minus the internals.

I'm not ready for an engine swap.

 

[phunky.buddha]

Hm. If you already have the B16, building a B18 and dropping it in isn't any more hassle than rebuilding the B16 block.

 

[jamesA]

so jacking up the car and taking a day or two to throw in the crank and rods isn't anymore of a hassle than taking one day to take the motor out (which I don't have the proper equipment for), taking one day to drop it back in, taking another day to figure out the wiring and another day to get it running?

 

[phunky.buddha]

Originally posted by revolution8k@Dec 22 2004, 11:01 PM
so jacking up the car and taking a day or two to throw in the crank and rods isn't anymore of a hassle than taking one day to take the motor out (which I don't have the proper equipment for), taking one day to drop it back in, taking another day to figure out the wiring and another day to get it running?

[post=436236]Quoted post[/post]​

It's actually more of a hassle. Do you really want to try and check all your bearing clearances while laying underneath your car? It's not exactly fun to keep bolting and torquing your crankshaft in place from underneath just to check your clearances, not to mention doing it 5-6 times to make sure everything's perfect- then do the same with your rod bearings blah blah blah. How are you going to machine the bore of your engine to match the new pistons with the block still in the car?

So you can properly build a complete B18 shortblock outside the car, then spend a day to get it in- or you can halfass it and have all your clearances out of whack to swap just your pistons and rods- then do it all over again when something fucks up and your engine goes to shit.

As for wiring- if you're using the same head, you're not going to change anything.

Which one is easier now?

 

[99SiRidinLow]

I Still Think doin the tech43 is easier... All and all doing a similar ls/vtec build and the tech43 kit is gonna run you about the same.. So its just the persons prefrence... I mean its not like b16 blocks are hell expensive either... Plus Im gettin the crank/rods/pistons from a b18a for like 150 bucked shipped so its a good deal. I can turn around and sell the pistons and make some money back for gettin bearings or what not.