Big Difference Between These Two Lsd's?

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831civic

Member
I'm looking into buying an LSD for my Prelude transmission. I heard Quaife is the sh*t. I haven't heard much about phantom grip. You pay about $850 for the quaife and about $300 for the phantom grip. Which LSD would be the best for drag? I know that about 90% of the time you get what you pay for but I don't think there should be much of a difference here. Any experience out there???
 

phunky.buddha

Mad scientist
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Uhhhhhhhh............ BIG difference.

The Quaife is a true LSD, and is a complete differential replacement. It uses a real gear system to make sure that the wheel with the most grip gets the most torque. It works all the time- both in straight lines and in turns, and it has a lifetime warranty.

The Phantom Grip is NOT a true LSD. It's basically two spring plates that push against the spider gears in your stock differential. When the spider gears start to turn at different speeds, the spring plates in the Random Grip push them against their gear carriers, causing them to bind against it and effectiing some resistance to turning. When you turn your wheel, the Phantom No-Grip just springs the two plates apart, and it doesn't do anything for you. Over time, the Random Shit will cause your spider gears to wear down, possibly causing differential failure. It's not a good thing when a traction system requires your differential parts to be jammed together to function. The PG doesn't work in turns- it only works in a straight line. It would be good for a drag race, but I would be very careful using it, and be aware of the potential hazards associated with it. If you read up on SCC's project cars, I know that one of them has a Phantom Grip in it, and SCC hasn't had any problems with transmission failure. Again, your experience might be different- they didn't install it in a Civic. I don't know what they put it in, but I know it wasn't a Honda.
 

saturn_boy96

88 C1V1C 53D4N DR1V3R
it wasa ztec focus, which even after being supercharged with the "big pulley"(7psi) it only made 173 WHP. how pathetic. no wonder they haven't had problems.

i thought the entire reason for having an lsd in a FF car was so it would work in the turns. apparently not, just get a helical unit, like one from a type-R or one from Quaife.
 

B16

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quaife is the shizzy, when i pay off my CC some, that will be my next purchase :)
 

liquid00meth

Senior Member
you don't need limited slip for turning unless your spinning a tire in the turn. That is what a regular diff is for. a LSD is to transfer torque to a wheel that has traction, when the other wheel looses it.
 

phunky.buddha

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Originally posted by liquid00meth@Apr 10 2003, 03:17 PM
you don't need limited slip for turning unless your spinning a tire in the turn. That is what a regular diff is for. a LSD is to transfer torque to a wheel that has traction, when the other wheel looses it.

Yes and no. Your regular differential makes sure that you're not constantly scrubbing one tire, but it still sends power to the wheel with less resistance... so you get all your power at the inside wheel, and you understeer. With an LSD, you get the power to the wheel with more grip, so power goes to the outside wheel on a turn, and you have reduced understeer. It makes a difference in the turns whether you're spinning tires or not.
 

liquid00meth

Senior Member
Originally posted by Calesta+Apr 10 2003, 05:55 PM-->
liquid00meth
@Apr 10 2003, 03:17 PM
you don't need limited slip for turning unless your spinning a tire in the turn.  That is what a regular diff is for.  a LSD is to transfer torque to a wheel that has traction, when the other wheel looses it.

Yes and no. Your regular differential makes sure that you're not constantly scrubbing one tire, but it still sends power to the wheel with less resistance... so you get all your power at the inside wheel, and you understeer. With an LSD, you get the power to the wheel with more grip, so power goes to the outside wheel on a turn, and you have reduced understeer. It makes a difference in the turns whether you're spinning tires or not.

yea... thats all I was saying. The regular differental has a natural balance, and the "resistance" of the tire on the ground determines axle speed. exactly.

I see how an LSD applies to understeer now actually, I didn't think of it really. It was my understanding that there had to be a given gap of difference in resistance that turning, normally anyways, wouldn't exactly produce.
 

phunky.buddha

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Originally posted by liquid00meth@Apr 10 2003, 05:17 PM
yea... thats all I was saying. The regular differental has a natural balance, and the "resistance" of the tire on the ground determines axle speed. exactly.

I see how an LSD applies to understeer now actually, I didn't think of it really. It was my understanding that there had to be a given gap of difference in resistance that turning, normally anyways, wouldn't exactly produce.

Yup. A normal open differential is just a breakage preventer. It doesn't do anything but let the tires go where they want to go. :)

Each LSD is different- different designs have different threshholds that they operate within. I don't know where they all stand compared to each other, but I do know that my Honda LSD makes a big difference on the turns. You can really feel the front end of the car tuck in and turn much better than an open diff in a B swap. It makes a difference that you can feel pretty quick.
 

phunky.buddha

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Originally posted by saturn_boy96@Apr 10 2003, 10:04 PM
seriously..???? ima buy one soon...

Yup. That's the price I see them at most of the time.

So....

OEM LSD = $300

Random Grip = $300

Tough choice huh?
 

Slo86GT

Super Moderator
I wish I had a picture of it, but my friend in a 93 Green Civic Si GSR Turbo has a Quaiffe, and he did a few burnouts and put the videos on Honda-Tech...

In the second video, he started the burnout and did a complete U-Turn around a dumpster, Both tires still spinning their nuts off, never only spinning one.

It was badass, I'm SOLD on a Quaiffe, even if it is nearly double or 3x the price of the Phantom Grip and OEM LSD.

BTW, his user ID on Honda-tech is Hybrid901.
 
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