Thoughts on Anwr?

[efhondakid]

You need a FL3 license to buy MG's and full auto firearms.

I never said anything about buying them, thats why Im waiting on the riots.

 

[Sabz5150]

they dont give a shit they'll be dead by then

Now you know why we're up this particular creek.

Personally, I would *LOVE* to see a news report "Oil's Gone. No more left". Just to watch the fun ensue.

 

[BrutalB83]

Why is it a good idea to have low fuel prices?

To me this is like a prisoners dilemma.

I want low fuel prices. But I don't want the demand to be high if they go down. People will drive more if they go down and the environmental impact will be greater. Something I don't want. But am I willing to pay high prices, to lower the demand and to find alternative energy sources?

It's a difficult game, because the US could easily find alternative energy sources if they worked hard enough and directed the efforts and subsidies places on oil on other items. But that's a dream world and something I know the married government won't ever glimpse at.

I think you missed my point...

I didn't say low, I said "bearable". If opening up some additional oil wells can keep gas prices at least around what they are now (or possibly lower) over the next X number of years that it takes to develop a viable alternative energy source and swap our society over to run on it, then why wouldn't you do it?

At $4 or $5 a gallon people are going to bitch, but still suck it up and pay. At $10 a gallon people are going to fucking riot. I'm not arguing the need for alternative energy, I'm just saying we have no viable large-scale solution at the moment, so we probably need to tap into a few more fossil fuel sources in the meantime to keep prices bearable for the average American during the transitional period...

 

[Celerity]

$10 a gallon people will pay. $20 a gallon, people will riot.I bet that at $6 a gallon people would riot, but Europe is taking it like a comatose rape victim.

 

[3roe3]

I think you missed my point...

I didn't say low, I said "bearable". If opening up some additional oil wells can keep gas prices at least around what they are now (or possibly lower) over the next X number of years that it takes to develop a viable alternative energy source and swap our society over to run on it, then why wouldn't you do it?

At $4 or $5 a gallon people are going to bitch, but still suck it up and pay. At $10 a gallon people are going to fucking riot. I'm not arguing the need for alternative energy, I'm just saying we have no viable large-scale solution at the moment, so we probably need to tap into a few more fossil fuel sources in the meantime to keep prices bearable for the average American during the transitional period...

But drilling ANWAR is not a solution for now. With some research you will find that if they started drilling today, the oil would not add to domestic production for atleast ten years. - Wall Street Journal Real Time Economics : Don't Expect Too Much From ANWR

 

[nootrac22]

so sitting around and doing nothing is much better? It will take far more then a decade to change the worlds energy source. So it will help, maybe not today, but it will still never the less help. Even if the miracle energy source was discovered today it would take generations to change the worlds infrastructure over to the new energy source. The world is hooked on oil and there is no cold turkey cure. Face it we have to ween off. Why not make the weening less painfull.

 

[3roe3]

What help is it going to do ten years from now. What are gas prices going to be then? 10 bucks a gallon, 20 bucks a gallon? On a 15 gallon tank thats 150-300 bucks a gallon respectively, at two tanks a week thats half my shitty ass pay check. I'm not saying to sit around and do nothing, I'm not even against drilling. I just think that its a wasted effort of resources, time and money.

 

[Celerity]

We always know the opinion of the Defeatist.

 

[3roe3]

This coming from the man who's most intelligent post on this topic is stolen from a Chinese proverb, and maybe the fact that the alternative resources are out in sapce which we can't reach on millions of gallons of rocket fuel - a very good point actually, completely agreed, maybe we could reallocate the drilling funds to explore that option. But you know the opinion of the defeatist (if that's how you want to refer to me) because he tells you what his opinion is. But I haven't heard your opinion on this matter what so ever. Yea, you voted for drilling, but you haven't backed up your opinion with anything except for trying to make people look stupid for theirs, why? so you can add another post to your tally or gain another rep point!! You're like the government (the Bush kind), you suck the air out of any idea that's not your own and that you don't agree with. At least we have opinions, all I hear from you is regurgitated bull shit. Why don't you do some research and join the discussion with an good, intellectual opinion?

 

[Sabz5150]

I think you missed my point...

I didn't say low, I said "bearable". If opening up some additional oil wells can keep gas prices at least around what they are now (or possibly lower) over the next X number of years that it takes to develop a viable alternative energy source and swap our society over to run on it, then why wouldn't you do it?

At $4 or $5 a gallon people are going to bitch, but still suck it up and pay. At $10 a gallon people are going to fucking riot. I'm not arguing the need for alternative energy, I'm just saying we have no viable large-scale solution at the moment, so we probably need to tap into a few more fossil fuel sources in the meantime to keep prices bearable for the average American during the transitional period...

WHAT transitional period?

If we drill for oil, we're just gonna keep straight down the track we're on. Americans won't change on their own... they'll see a big pool of oil and keep on driving their SUVs through downtown traffic, squandering every drop.

Trust me... do you think people are selling their land yachts for sub-compacts because it's chic? You want Americans to change, you have to hit them in that back pocket in order for them to listen. And if this is the ONLY way, so be it.

I'm for putting a hole in it, but all that will come from it is the same problem... 15 years later. Funny how that always seems to be the way the Right plans things... screw the future, *I* want NOW.

 

[Briansol]

the transition needs to come in in forms of tax breaks/credits.

ie, if you install a hydrogen (or whatever replaces oil) furnace in your home, you get a 2k write off.

THAT is what is going to get people to convert.

 

[nootrac22]

Only if the equipment is affordable. 2k off a 20k furnace doesn't help me afford it. They are giving tax breaks for installing energy efficent stuff in your home.

 

[Briansol]

if oil goes to 7 bucks a gallon next winter, that's a 20k heating bill for one season. you bet your ass i'll buy the 20k furnace.

HELOC ftw

 

[nootrac22]

gonna be 5+ a gal this winter I'm gonna be poor and cold all winter.

 

[Briansol]

4.69-4.89
08-09 winter oil contract - HomeModders.com - DIY Home Owner Forum

 

[nootrac22]

I figure on using about 5k this winter for 5month (just a gestimate) sucks to be me.

 

[Sabz5150]

the transition needs to come in in forms of tax breaks/credits.

ie, if you install a hydrogen (or whatever replaces oil) furnace in your home, you get a 2k write off.

THAT is what is going to get people to convert.

No.

if oil goes to 7 bucks a gallon next winter, that's a 20k heating bill for one season.

That's what will do it, and it will be EXTREMELY effective at doing so.

Cheap health food won't get people to lose weight, but impending heart failure is one hell of a motivator.

 

[Celerity]

This coming from the man who's most intelligent post on this topic is stolen from a Chinese proverb, and maybe the fact that the alternative resources are out in sapce which we can't reach on millions of gallons of rocket fuel - a very good point actually, completely agreed, maybe we could reallocate the drilling funds to explore that option. But you know the opinion of the defeatist (if that's how you want to refer to me) because he tells you what his opinion is. But I haven't heard your opinion on this matter what so ever. Yea, you voted for drilling, but you haven't backed up your opinion with anything except for trying to make people look stupid for theirs, why? so you can add another post to your tally or gain another rep point!! You're like the government (the Bush kind), you suck the air out of any idea that's not your own and that you don't agree with. At least we have opinions, all I hear from you is regurgitated bull shit. Why don't you do some research and join the discussion with an good, intellectual opinion?

You eat too much red meat.

 

[Briansol]

Oil: New Drilling Wouldn't Cut Prices

 

[Celerity]

People need to realise that it will never go back. Not this time. It's no one thing causing it, unlike the OPEC embargo - it's a storm of stupid shit.

It'll never go down. Time to move on. Domestic drilling, if used properly, will make the future alittle brighter - But we'll just sell it to the Chinese instead of using it, because it's run by oil companies and any company will take it's product to where it makes more money.

Sorry charlie.