Capt. Orygun
Win the Day
he's fighting a former word HW champion who fights boring
Silvia fights boring, it's a common heavywieght afflcition
Silvia fights boring, it's a common heavywieght afflcition
Uh Oh, Lesnar Is In Trouble
- Thread starter B16RacerN2NR
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Cashizslick
!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!
As much as I h8 lesnar. I will concede that he has more talent than fumbling frank mir.
. .. and come on, the plane of MMA competition is rising so rapidly that being a "former" champ doesnt mean shit.
Gracie was a former champ . . but matt hughs made him look like a chump.
Capt. Orygun
Win the Day
different rules in the match, plus gracie was about 10 years out of his prime
had that been in the old rules the fight wouldn't have stopped, Hughes even said himself the only reson he started punching him was that he heard the ref warn Griacie he was in trouble
Beyond that the old Champs like Gracie/Abbott/ Severns were nothing like the champs of just a few years ago like Tito/Mir/etc, they were much more well rounded
I want to see Lesner and Arlofski
had that been in the old rules the fight wouldn't have stopped, Hughes even said himself the only reson he started punching him was that he heard the ref warn Griacie he was in trouble
Beyond that the old Champs like Gracie/Abbott/ Severns were nothing like the champs of just a few years ago like Tito/Mir/etc, they were much more well rounded
I want to see Lesner and Arlofski
Cashizslick
!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!i!
Well, gracie's prime < Hughes' prime.
Lol, while watching the match, i didnt need the ref to state the obvious. . . i dont think Hughes did either - he was just trying to be respectful to Gracie.
Thats a bet i will take . . unless arlofski decides to become worse lol.
5 years, 2 district medals, 2 region appearances, and I was a favorite to go to the state tournament my Senior year before I tore my MCL and damaged my meniscus. I'll say it again, If a fighter has a GOOD wrestling background they legs aren't coming out and it's near impossible to stand up.
[FONT="]In terms of wrestling, 5 years is nothing.
Most of us started off as little kids and wrestled up through high school or into college.
Legs are easy to defend against in the first place by tucking your hands in between your thighs as the person tries to throw them. Grab a leg and either do a switch, or if he's too high on your body, back out from underneath him.
Once they're in, they're not difficult to get out, either. And from a base, they're so much harder to throw in than to get a hook in when you're in the guard.
Most good wrestlers don't have people actually throw legs in on them. I'm not saying that it hasn't happened to me, but it certainly was something that unless the guy was an A+ with long dangling legs and was great at throwing legs, it wasn't a worry.
In MMA its a little bit different since you're defending against strikes, but since you don't have to worry about your shoulder blades touching the mat, or locked hands, or any of those rules you can work different techniques. Like I said, grab an ankle, put an elbow in the side of the shin and crank on the ankle. Anyone who leans over you, take their head.
If they ride high, get a base and shake them out.
This is basic, basic shit that I don't know how you're going to argue against. Plenty of fighters in MMA have legs thrown on them and then get out.
Thats not the issue, the issue is whether there's a distinct time where, say if you have wrist control or the person is riding high, that it makes sense to get a base and give up your back. My argument is if you have a hold of one wrist or both wrists and you're explosive and don't just sit there waiting to be choked out or striked against, then its not always a bad situation as Frank Mir suggests. thats all.[/FONT]
Legs are easy to defend against in the first place by tucking your hands in between your thighs as the person tries to throw them. Grab a leg and either do a switch, or if he's too high on your body, back out from underneath him.
Once they're in, they're not difficult to get out, either. And from a base, they're so much harder to throw in than to get a hook in when you're in the guard.
Most good wrestlers don't have people actually throw legs in on them. I'm not saying that it hasn't happened to me, but it certainly was something that unless the guy was an A+ with long dangling legs and was great at throwing legs, it wasn't a worry.
In MMA its a little bit different since you're defending against strikes, but since you don't have to worry about your shoulder blades touching the mat, or locked hands, or any of those rules you can work different techniques. Like I said, grab an ankle, put an elbow in the side of the shin and crank on the ankle. Anyone who leans over you, take their head.
If they ride high, get a base and shake them out.
This is basic, basic shit that I don't know how you're going to argue against. Plenty of fighters in MMA have legs thrown on them and then get out.
Thats not the issue, the issue is whether there's a distinct time where, say if you have wrist control or the person is riding high, that it makes sense to get a base and give up your back. My argument is if you have a hold of one wrist or both wrists and you're explosive and don't just sit there waiting to be choked out or striked against, then its not always a bad situation as Frank Mir suggests. thats all.[/FONT]
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Cashizslick
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Time has nothing to do with skill. My friend Matt started when we were freshmen. He hit up clubs and tournaments all the time. Right now he is the best wrestler in the line-up, at a D1 school, on a full ride, and was a national champion his freshman year. Lately he has been plagued by injury though. Wrestling is not about how long you have been doing it, its about how much time you have put in and the effort you put into that time.In terms of wrestling, 5 years is nothing.Most of us started off as little kids and wrestled up through high school or into college.
A GOOD wrestler gets the legs in. Get your hand between the arm and the body, then throw the leg, knee first, as hard as you can. I've bruised ribs doing it to teammates.
Most fighters in MMA were not state champion wrestlers in NJ, PA, or Iowa. Let alone any good at actual wrestling. They trained to defend it somewhat, but don't have years of experience.
Wrist control is easy to gain and easy to lose. I wouldn't give up my back just because I had a wrist. I'm not versed in MMA and wrestling knowledge, I have trained in both and have more than a few friends that are D1 wrestlers and Pro/Semi-pro MMA fighters. Hell both my coaches in high school were former Pro MMA fighters. One is back to doing it again too.
I'm not saying it doesn't work, I'm saying its not really worth the risk. Like back in high school I LOVED to pull a move called a Syracuse. When my opponent didn't know how to defend it, it worked great. When they did, I ussually had to fight off my back. It worked great when it worked, but I stopped doing it because the risk didn't out weigh the gains.
...
Its not that simple. In theory it is, because thats how you would demonstrate how to get your arms free but thats not how it realistically works or wrist control would mean nothing in wrestling because it would be so simple to loss. Wrist control in fact means a ton.
And of course everyone knows this way of just turning the arm to *try* to get out. If the guy is strong and physical - its not easy to get out.
Like I said, I didn't say for the guy to give up his back and lolly gag there. I said if he has wrist control and he's explosive. Getting a base and immediately exploding upward and shaking the guy out after he's on your hips, isn't a bad place to be in my opinion, especially like I said earlier if you have a weak guard.
You can disagree and have your own opinion, but I hope you understand that twisting your arm outward makes it easier to break his grip but many times you need two hands on the one, after you turn it outward to break the grip. In this time, my argument is you should be standing up and getting out of there.
If you're talking about the one with Ray Mercer, Kimbo won that fight but not how he said he was gonna win. He said he was gonna knock Mercer out, instead he took him to the ground, Ray reverses position, and Kimbo put his ass in a guillutine(sp?) It was an MMA match and he had every right to do so but it just means he's not a man of his word and that he under estimated how hard it is to actually knock someone out who has a good defense. If you watch any of Mercer's old fights, he likes to let people punch themselves out before he goes in for the kill. Kimbo ended up on his back, knew he was in trouble, and decided to take the win in the way it was given to him...
YouTube - Kimbo Slice vs. Ray Mercer (FULL FIGHT)
You know the "MA" in MMA? Yeah, you should try studying it.
My 5'1" wife can break free from my grip with the proper technique and I have a very strong grip from playing drums.
Quit being a pussy.
If we're on the same page, it wasn't a UFC fight - it was a fight with a previous UFC fighter, Tank Abbot.
Tank Abbot and Kimbo were supposed to fight in Atlantic City but the major investor of the organization backed out so the fight is off.
When talking to someone who was supposed to fight on that same card, apparently the league hasn't returned any fighter's phone calls and hasn't scheduled any fights since they announced the major investor backed out on their website. I just found that out last night.
The other information I posted in the last Kimbo thread if you want to search for the link to the actual website.
I also found out last night, when my buddy invited me to go watch his brother and law fight on a different card that Kimbo will be on that card in Atlantic City. I forget who he said he was fighting.
So basically Kimbo is fighting again, but not the big fight against Tank Abbot who is a famous brawler from UFC.
Also it looks like the IFL is going to sign Kurt Angle.
FOX Sports on MSN - Boxing - Angle eager to make move to MMA
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Okay, I had to rehash this thread.
No one seemed to understand the concept or technique which I was describing. I came across a highlight video tonight of "The Gracie Hunter" from Pride.
Check this video out at 3:54 seconds on how to defend against legs when you quickly get a base. This is textbook defense of what I described.
Kazushi Sakuraba Highlight[/FONT]
Okay, I had to rehash this thread.
No one seemed to understand the concept or technique which I was describing. I came across a highlight video tonight of "The Gracie Hunter" from Pride.
Check this video out at 3:54 seconds on how to defend against legs when you quickly get a base. This is textbook defense of what I described.
Kazushi Sakuraba Highlight[/FONT]
Sakuraba is pretty much done now.
He's getting older, now he's almost 40 and he fought for quite awhile.
Not that Royce is any younger, but I think they're both done at this point.
My aunt's husband has my little cousin's (his kids) enrolled at Gracie Jui Jitsu out here in Torrance and he was telling me that when the Gracie's found out Royce tested positive for roids they were pissed. They were fucking embarassed for him and as a family. He said they took it pretty hard and broke ties with him for the time being. I don't know if they've reconciled yet or not but i'm sure they will.
