F20C possible in a eg hatch???

[AHHVTEC]

the emobilizer on the ignition needs to match the ecu...

well then that i dont know..is the bar so tuff up there that they take the ecu out and check the numbers

 

[malexander]

i dont know exactly... that is just what a friend of mine said he is familiar with the bar system.

 

[BrutalB83]

I'm pretty sure that an OBD1 B-series is the only swap that's going to certifiable in California. Not only do the numbers on everything have to match, but I'm pretty sure that OBD conversions and reprogrammed/aftermarket ECUs are prohibited.

 

[FObangah]

True dat. Also, the F20C/F22C doesn't actually respond that well to bolt-ons. It's tuned so well from the factory that there's not really a lot you can do to it aside from turbo or supercharging.

.

Mine seems to respond well.....the parts are just more expensive^_^ . I would say the K20z is just as hard to extract ponies from as the F20C, allthough the lower powered K's have plenty of room left to extract power from. Now that I think about it, the K24 and F20 crankshaft ( and various other parts ) are interchangable. Honda Tuning just printed an artical not long ago calling it the " poor mans F20 stroker kit " .

Anyway, the only way I see this as being a good idea is if you were the owner of a Acura/Honda junk yard, happend to have a good EG shell, a wrecked s2000 ( with no drivetrain damage ), and had a shit-ton of welding/fabrication experiance. Then it would still only be for the " WOW " factor that comes with only one of the few RWD Civic's in the world, but it would sure as hell be alot cheaper.

And no offense, SEARCH "F20C RWD Civic" and you will find out everything you need to know. There's quite a bit of info out there about the few that already exsist. ( not to mention it's been posted here a ba-zillion times )

One more thing before you decide to stop reading my long-ass post, a decent quality AP1 (00-03 s2000) can be purchased anywhere from $12,000 to $20,000. It would be alot easier, wouldn't have a problem passing BAR, and chicks digg it when you put the top down Just ask CALESTA, he's got more booty thrown at him in a day then his ol' lady can beat off with a stick!!!

 

[K2e2vin]

The K20A2 and Type-Rs respond well to mods. A lot of the name-brand intakes add anywhere from ~6whp-15whp(I think Honda-Tuning or Import Tuners got 20whp gain with a AEM CAI).. Stock-ish K20As are hitting 200-230whp with a good tune.

There's plenty of K20A guys in California. Hit up K20A.org for more info. You can get the immobilizer removed also, so it wouldn't need to match the ignition.

 

[FObangah]

I would agree in the exhuast department.....but only due to the extreme time and care Honda put into the header and exhuast. Part for part, the ENGINES will respond similarly. The actual CARS will respond differently. WHP figures will differ when applied to opposing drivetrain layouts. Take that same 240 whp K and put it in an s2000 RWD layout and it will drop to what an F20 with the same mods and similar tune would make ( probally the 220-230 range). Maybe the greater aftermarket support of the K apposed to the F20c yields more R&D for certain parts than others, but all I'm trying to say is I don't see where the K would be "easier" to extract power from than the F20 other than easier on the pockets. Parts are cheaper and more readily available for the K than the F20. To get right down to it, If he were to properly swap in all the components of the s2000, he would have a far superior car than any K swapped civic with similar mods. He would stomp you from a digg and hold you off right up until 155 mph, through turns or on the straights.(driver skill permiting) Because after all, power isn't everything.
In this application the K would be better due to ease of installation, not because it's easier to extract power from.

 

[K2e2vin]

Where the K makes power more easily? Availability of a 2.4l block... Some shop or guy managed ~250whp All-Motor using a combination of stock K parts(and S2000 pistons), bolt-ons, and a good tune.

edit, found out the setup:
"his build yeild 293hp@7,500rpm at the axle on the dyno and 253hp@7,500 on a roller dyno at the national. there's more to the build but those are some serious N/A all motor numbers.

K24a1 block
'06 TSX rods
'05 S2000m pistons
RSX oil pump
Integra JDM Type R intake cam(oem)
'06 TSX exhaust cam(oem)
TSX VTC cam gear(the cam gear give a 40* advance)"

Far from bolt-on, but a larger displacement engine means more power can be extracted than from a smaller displacement engine.

 

[FObangah]

Now displacement is the arguement? You said its easier to extract power from the K20 and Type R motor (which are both 2 liters), not the 2.4 liter, which I clearly stated earlier when I said "...the lower powered K motors have plenty left to extract from" which would include the K24. I also wouldn't consider any of the mods listed above ( which are gapped severly, what octane? head work? other mods?FMU? ) as " bolt on" other than the exhaust and cam gear. Since we are getting into internals, I also stated that there has been a similar build performed on an F20C with the K24 crank and various other K parts that yeilded similar results. I'm not sure of the power output but Im pretty sure it was SIMILAR ( niether one superior to the other ).

As for "the setup" s2ki.com is a great place to find s2k's making 250 whp on ITB's, AEM managment( good tune of course ), test pipe/exhaust/header.

I'm not trying to ruffle your feathers, just trying to say these engines are very similar in design, make-up, and mod-ability. K-series is still the way to go for this particular application though.

Now that I think about it, easier to mod shouldn't come into consideration when comparing The K20 (200 FWHP) and the F20 (240 FWHP). Both motors are about the same price in the used engine market place, yet the latter makes more power. As for the K24.....40 to 80 FWHP naturally asperated is alot to make up.

On a lighter note..... s2000's owns joOoOo

 

[AHHVTEC]

the k series is honda latest and best motor, the new s2000 is even going to have a k series in it.

 

[FObangah]

Better motor probally, I know it doesn't have the oil starvation issues the F20C has.....that reminds me, I need an oil catch can!!!
As if this thread hasn't been jacked enough...what is this " new s2000 " and where on the net can I drool over it?

 

[AHHVTEC]

Better motor probally, I know it doesn't have the oil starvation issues the F20C has.....that reminds me, I need an oil catch can!!!
As if this thread hasn't been jacked enough...what is this " new s2000 " and where on the net can I drool over it?

it hasn't came out yet lol

 

[FObangah]

Oh I know not yet...I figured you were hinting at a concept. I think Honda scrapped the s800 idea they were hinting at not to long ago, so it would only be right to bring back the "anniversary car" that streched on over 9 years.

 

[AHHVTEC]

but to back up your claim,for the noobs lol,,the f20c and the k series are almost the same motor they have lots in common,,

 

[FObangah]

<<< Listen to the RSX own3r, he speaks great wisdom, even if he does look just like his avatar.^_^

He makes valid arguments though, the K is the way of the future now that the s2000 is gone.

 

[AHHVTEC]

<<< Listen to the RSX own3r, he speaks great wisdom, even if he does look just like his avatar.^_^

He makes valid arguments though, the K is the way of the future now that the s2000 is gone.

now how would you know what i look like lol, hey its smeagol in a freakin tux and glasses lmao, you cant go wrong lol

 

[FObangah]

Just to back up how similar they are......YouTube - Spoon Civic TypeR Hot Swap F20C

Wish I could rev to 10,000 rpm, but then again, we all probally do

 

[K2e2vin]

Wasn't saying displacement wasn't the only reason, just having a 2.4l block available makes it more more easier to extract power from.

That setup I believe was with stock head and pump fuel. Yes it may not be bolt-on, but it's still making some power. I'm just comparing how a K-series engine built together with stock parts can compete with a semi-built F-series.

ITB'd K-series are pretty common and make power too. And stock S2000s do not dyno 240whp. They're around 190-220whp(the 2.2l's making up the higher hp ones). The K20A-R puts down roughly around 200whp also.

They are similar in design, but what I'm getting at is the K-series readily bolt into a EG chassis and such, and have much more greater aftermarket support. Matter of fact, the Top Setup K20A EG was faster than a supercharged S2000 on a small track.

The K20s(at least older ones if not also the newer ones), have oil issues too. Has something to do with the hydraulic tensioner and the oil orifices. Benson I believe, or some other machining company, offers a "fix" for those blocks for roughly $3000.

Yes they're similar, but you'd have to take into consideration aftermarket support unless money is no issue. I'm willing to bet there's more high-powered K's than F's.

 

[K2e2vin]

Now displacement is the arguement? You said its easier to extract power from the K20 and Type R motor (which are both 2 liters), not the 2.4 liter, which I clearly stated earlier when I said "...the lower powered K motors have plenty left to extract from" which would include the K24.

[quote[The K20A2 and Type-Rs respond well to mods. A lot of the name-brand intakes add anywhere from ~6whp-15whp(I think Honda-Tuning or Import Tuners got 20whp gain with a AEM CAI).. Stock-ish K20As are hitting 200-230whp with a good tune.

There's plenty of K20A guys in California. Hit up K20A.org for more info. You can get the immobilizer removed also, so it wouldn't need to match the ignition.[/quote]

The comment about the 2.4l build was not about the 2.0ls being easier to extract power from.

You brought up extracting power, so I brought up the 2.4l block.

Thing is, S2000's don't respond well to just any mods. There's plenty of documentation of aftermarket parts reducing horsepower. You don't see much of that with the K-series.

 

[BrutalB83]

Thing is, S2000's don't respond well to just any mods. There's plenty of documentation of aftermarket parts reducing horsepower. You don't see much of that with the K-series.

That's what I said earlier and everybody jumped on it. Some of the motors that are super tuned from the factory (F20/22C, B18C5, etc.) just don' respond that well to bolt-ons. I've seen both S2000s and ITRs actually lose power after installing an intake, exhaust, whatever.

The K-series though, seem to respond really well to pretty much any kind of modification.

 

[reikoshea]

the s2000 is gone? what did i miss?

they just released the CR edition...i dont think its gone yet.