pics/illustration request: 4wd dc teg or eg/ek civic

[Riseagain97]

For the gas tank info im still waiting on that to i PMed him on youtube He either used the orthia or civic RTsi gas tank or he used a fuel cell

The only reason its stupid is because of what you end up with. You could get a nice fiting setup with an AWD Civic swap, but in the end you pay a lot for an inferior setup. Or you could with a homemade setup and not spend much, but then you wind up with a poor fitting setup that still doesn't perform well. Its just not worth it in the end.

People have been getting 400 hp out these things and they have held up fine personally i dont need more than 400 hp in a honda and for my reasons for doing a conversion has nothing to do with performance at all. The honda AWD is set up as an Automatic four wheel drive when the front wheels slip the back wheels take the traction Its ment for fuel milage, Its obvious its not an EVO or an STI im not saying it is, Its not ment for drag racing its ment for low traction conditions.. but when you like a car and want it to be awd i think people should do it.. and if you dont want to .. dont do it. simple as that.. People mod there cars for a reason, to fit them if some one wants an awd civi then by all means make one Cost effectiveness has nothing to do with it.. if your worryed about money and getting more bang for your buck go buy an old camaro and put a cam in it then race that

 

[Riseagain97]

This is what he used its from a 96-00 civic RTSi. Its an arched gas tank. This is the whole setup he received. Personally I would have used the crossmember because the rear differential is far to close to the ground for my taste and I can't image why he would have ordered the whole thing and only used the drive train components only. Thats sorta a waste I would hope he would use the gas tank atleast
here is the thread if any one can read polish
Honda civic coupe VI gen Turbo - Racingforum - Drag, Drift & Time Attack - Racing Forum
PS the Gas tank in the top picture is backwards the fuel pump is on the left side front normally

 

[Ethan]

What would be the use of converting to awd? Thats like converting one to rwd with a v8.

 

[Riseagain97]

no because the civic never came RWD with a V8. The civic did come with an awd system.. and the point would be to increase traction one kid has an awd eG hatch with over 400 hp. You wont have to worry about traction. In my case its for low traction weather

 

[Riseagain97]

Its like people get offended when the idea of a civic awd pops up People go CRAZY mad my opinion is let people mod there cars how they want. If some one wants to do as you said.. Which there is a video on you tube of someone putting a Corvette engine in a civic and making it rwd.. let them do it.. some one wants to put a factory offered awd system in their civic let em do it..some people like engine swaps some people like awd swaps..

 

[YBLEGAL]

Cool info with the gas tank. Ya that rear diff is way to close to the ground for my taste too.

Interesting info to know, thanks

 

[stmotorsports]

fuel tank info ~>
4WD Civic conversion - Ozhonda Forums

h-t awd threads ~>
HONTEC RS EVO......... - Honda-Tech
AWD CRX del Sol - CRV driveline swap - Honda-Tech

 

[stmotorsports]

Your 100% correct, I have never driven, been in, or seen one in person. But, I dont need to see one in person to know that the diff placement on that last one is shit. I dont need to drive one to know that the Honda AWD setups favor the front wheels. I dont need to ride in one to know that a used stock AWD car will still out perform an AWD swapped Honda.

dude, comon. You're saying a well designed and built awd civic with true lsd's front + rear + center, running a supercharged k-series, full race suspension and race tires is no match for a bone stock 93 impreza?

 

[Riseagain97]

They dont know the parts availabe for these cars Stmotorsports . the guy with the 400 hp hatch is working on locking the transfer case so its fultime awd thats just as good as any car.. its not like some one grabbed parts from 10 diff vehicles and slapped them on a honda they are all factory options... its like if some one were to do a b16 swap.. thats a factory option i think thats what they think... Rolls eyes That would be a chore getting a K 20 a in there youd have to use the RDX trans and use an SH-AWD system NOW THAT WOULD BE SICK!!!!!!

 

[AHHVTEC]

dude, comon. You're saying a well designed and built awd civic with true lsd's front + rear + center, running a supercharged k-series, full race suspension and race tires is no match for a bone stock 93 impreza?

is the 93 impreza even turbo ?

 

[Riseagain97]

lol no its like the 2.5 RS IF even that i think the engine is smaller so like were talking CRV hp maybe IF that

 

[newb]

dude, comon. You're saying a well designed and built awd civic with true lsd's front + rear + center, running a supercharged k-series, full race suspension and race tires is no match for a bone stock 93 impreza?

They dont know the parts availabe for these cars Stmotorsports . the guy with the 400 hp hatch is working on locking the transfer case so its fultime awd thats just as good as any car.. its not like some one grabbed parts from 10 diff vehicles and slapped them on a honda they are all factory options... its like if some one were to do a b16 swap.. thats a factory option i think thats what they think... Rolls eyes That would be a chore getting a K 20 a in there youd have to use the RDX trans and use an SH-AWD system NOW THAT WOULD BE SICK!!!!!!

Looks to me like as of now you cant lock the t-case.
Good luck with a K-swap and AWD. Now your talkin custom fab work. Not cheap.
Since you cant lock the t-case, what good would a rear LSD do since they dont see enough power to slip?
Do they make a rear LSD?

And, no, Im not saying a K powered AWD swapped civic is no match for an Impreza. It would lay waste to one. But, can you show me a K-swaped AWD civic, running and driving, anywhere in the world? Im gunna guess no. Can you do all this for less than buying a used Impreza and modding it? Prally not. Thats all Im sayin. I can see swapin all this for low traction conditions, thats why they were made. But, it seems like a lot of trouble. I cant see swappin for performance since you cant even control front/rear bias.

 

[stmotorsports]

its defintely alot of trouble, and in the end no, it probably won't have been worth it.

but think about it- people do k swaps all the time, so there's your k swap. It turns out that the awd k swap ends up being only slightly more complex than the b-series setup, and mostly just for different reasons. I already have my k trans practically all built and ready to drop in, all thats left is to finish machining the rear lsd and get the fulltime viscous unit in place of the stock center clutch pack. And if you really wanted to have adjustable front-rear bias, you could really just come up with a mechanism that would control preload on the factory clutch pack. Personally I'm not getting that far into it until I get the car all built and working the way I want it to.

 

[newb]

The hard part of an AWD K swap I was reffering to was the mounts and linkages. Just like a typical K swap, plus some lol.

all thats left is to finish machining the rear lsd and get the fulltime viscous unit in place of the stock center clutch pack.

What do you mean? Your modifying the stock carrier to accept clutch packs, or your machining your own LSD, and have to get the center (front/rear) clutch pack?

I used the wrong words. I dont mean be able to make live adjustments to the front/rear bias, but to be able to upgrade the center diff to improve front/rear bias.

 

[Riseagain97]

if you have some one do it it is expensive but i perosnally have acess to alot of metal tooling at school so if i were to ever take on a project like this i could have one of the students run the machine with the design i provide on cad with one of there CNC machines to it would only cost me the price of the aluminum or steel puc . But yes for some one who had no access to that it would be expensive. The Honda driveline has no direct connection to the back wheels. Its powerd by clutches to a sudden jolt is not felt in the rear end. thats why they can hold the hp because the system isnt putting the strain on the rear wheels however the rear wheels are engaged through clutches. there are 2 pumps powerd by the drive shaft in the T case and one in the Rear diff there is hydricic oil that sits in a line between the 2 pumps.. If both pumps are moving at the same speed there is no ,movement of oil and the pressure is equil because both front and rear wheels are moving at the same speed. However if there is a difference in pressure the front pump spins faster than the rear pump tripping the clutch pack assembly in the back activating the drive shaft. This is so the car can go in 2 wd normally however people who tune this drive trane like to lock up the rear diff so its a full AWD instead of an automatic 4wd. This is the case where you need the rear LSD and Parts made for the locking mechanism. There is a manual disengagement under the hood for towing purpuses so if some one were to connect a 4wd system and wanted all 4 wheels to spin at the same time but stil have the option of turning it off one could hook a lever up to make it like a 4wd truck to engage or disengage the trasnfercase. The center diff would be difficult because there is no need for one in a 4wd vehicle that dosnt use the 4 wheels at all times. However hondas new SH-AWD does have a center differential and would allow some one to place the parts in to any year honda with modification and the person would need to be sure to put the same differential in the front as the back. Its all relative to who you know if you have access to a shop and know how to weld then the project is very easy but if some one did not know how to weld and dint know any one with a machine shop then it would be very pricy especially if some one were the type who paid for every mod on there car. So if ST motorsports and i have access to shops like this then the job would be easy and inexpensive but the prices floating around the itnernet after prices of labor and having other people do it.

On the K swap issue. It would depend on what AWD system you are referring to. There are 2 AWD systems available with the K series engine. The older Real-Time 4WD and the newer SH-AWD. The Real-time doesn’t need a center diff because the clutches act as a one-way diff. However the SH-AWD has a center diff and in Japan I'm sure parts are already available for the Accord AWD and the Legend, which is our TSX and our RL. Another vehicle that come with the SH-AWD is the Acura RDX, which comes with an optional 2.3 liter K23a1 Turbo charged engine producing 240 Hp at 260 Ft Lbs of torque. This setup would be the ideal setup however at this stage it is to new and would be rather expensive to acquire however any thing is possible. If some one were to get a wrecked RDX and made sure it was a manual, which would be difficult even though they do come with a 6speed manual gearbox as an option, most people buy the automatics. So One of the systems would be worth investing in a Center diff however rear LSD in all would be a good investment and if I'm not mistaken some companies in Japan sell the LSD for the CRV and other Honda AWD vehicles in Japan so again it would be a matter if finding parts for these but in that case the clutch pack works as an ACD or Automatic Center Differential. But you wouldn’t be able to do a VCD setup witch is A Variable Center Differential You would need to acquire the SH-AWD system for that to work.

 

[newb]

Still waiting on St's answer.

Now that you explain the center diff like that, I really dont like it. Like you said though it would be good for no thought driving. But, I really dont think itll hold up good to power. I know, theres someone puttin down 400 horse, blah blah blah. To me that sounds like a 600 horse stock internal B16, very short lived. Im willing to bet that once power starts jumpin up, theres gunna be a lot of trouble with clutch packs and pumps.

 

[YBLEGAL]

Wow look at all the bitching...by both sides...

This whole thread is goin to shit if you keep bickering fellas....

Lets keep things informative

 

[Riseagain97]

Think what you want But i have yet to hear one break If you do find one that broke send me the link. Ne one can break a diff and Im sure its not as strong as a car made for a furltime awd but The description of people saying ( they can berily hold there own hp. None of those people have every played with them they are just guessing. But the Viscus setup is a buffer to keep the drive trane from trearing up the rear end . But If some one Doesent want to buy a subaru or STI because older subarus had there share of problems 2 they arent bullet proof and most people dont have money to buy an evo or STI why not mod your own car that you own thats paid off instead of buying a new car and having to start payments on it. If you have the tools why not. The Realtime 4wd sounds very economical im not dragracing i just want something to get through snow and im a broke collage kid that cant afford to get a new car This would onyl cost me the amount for parts and materials and that is far less than it would be to go out and buy an awd car even if i did sell this one.. I DONT WANT to sell it i like hondas I stick with hondas i dont go around to different car makers. some of these people out there have owned 6 different cars in 3 years
ive had the same car i bought when i graduated HS in 2003 ive had it for 6 years so for me it would be cheaper to make my car awd VS going out and buying one> besides i know whats done to the car and what has been replaced and what needs to be.. When you buy a USED awd car or any thing that has modding potential u dont know who is trying to screw you over with a potential blown turbo or busted half shafts because they think its a rally car

 

[Riseagain97]

IM TRYING!!! lol
People out there REALLY DONT want an awd civic to exist Im trying to Inform ST motorsports. Im not a Congressmen I want the info out there now if you dont like it then dont read it.. id love to keep this as an informational thread people pst what the know about the AWD system.. If people dont like it.. thats not contributing to the information

 

[newb]

Maybe you didnt see that long ass post explaining how the center diff works?