UFC 81 this saturday...Mir/Lesnar

[Capt. Orygun]

I think you're looking at it wrong

When shamrock thrived in MMA was before the actual evolution of MMA

in the early days mixed martial arts meant a Boxer would be fighting a Judo black belt

now it means that two people who are both versed in every form of weaponless combat will be fighting

BIG DIFFERENCE

it wasn't just Shamrock, Royce Gracie fell off and he didn't do WWF, Tank Abbott used to be top tier, now he's a joke really. I could go on but the point I'm making is that wrasllin had nothing to do with it, those old UFC 1 -6 fighters have had the game pass them by and that's why they aren't contenders anymore

I haven't predicted a win for Lesnar, but the fact remains that when you look at people breaking into the UFC the Wrestler's seem to have an easier transition when they're green.

Liddell, Tito, Couture, Sherk, Hammill, Hughes, Evens, Sanchez, Kozcheck, etc all were wrestler's first who largely learned MMA after their first fight. If Lesnar can follow suit it would be far from an anomaly, and if you consider that list Lesnar's wrestling resume trumps all of them remarkably

 

[Cashizslick]

Liddell, Tito, Couture, Sherk, Hammill, Hughes, Evens, Sanchez, Kozcheck, etc all were wrestler's first who largely learned MMA after their first fight. If Lesnar can follow suit it would be far from an anomaly, and if you consider that list Lesnar's wrestling resume trumps all of them remarkably

Heh, Sanchez, Kozcheck, Hughes, Ortiz, and Coture have all been owned recently by people with good standup, who are not pure wrestlers like they are.

EDIT: and when Shamrock entered MMA, he was worlds above what other people had to offer. He fought guys that were several weightclasses above him. He had more to overcome as nobody knew what the fuck was going on, and there were NO rules.For his time, he was the best. For lesnar's time, he is not the best. He is just a big WWE wrestler with 1 year of training.

 

[totalburnout]

Ok, so I personally think this fight can go either way. However, after watching an interview with Lesnar, I hope Frank Mir breaks his arm. He's a great wrestler and incredibly strong, but he has NO respect for what BJJ is. I understand being confident/trash talking(to an extent), but he came off as a total prick. He talks about Frank Mir breaking Sylvias arm and says who cares, Sylvia got beat by a 40 year old who walks around at 197. Dude doesn't even realize that Randy Couture is a natural heavyweight that walks around at 225-230 and cut massive weight to fight at 205. On top of that I'd put money on Randy to beat his ass. Anyway, I'm not going to make any predictions because nobody knows who will win. But I'll say that I hope Brock gets a very rude awakening and is submitted in the 1st round.

...Couture doesn't walk around very heavy. He put on weight for those fights. He's not a hulking big guy, which was Lesnar's point. A cut from 225 to 205 is not massive by the way. Its quite usual. At those weights you can drift 10lbs overnight just from initial fluid loss. Plenty of fighters that fight in the 155 division walk around at 170 or 175lbs on a daily basis and make weight, so for a heavyweight to cut 20lbs to make weight really is a non-issue and no big deal. Most of the fighters have been cutting weight like that since before high school wrestling.

Also Brock has trained in BJJ and although Mir is known as a BJJ guy, he grew up with an initial background in wrestling before he went to BJJ. When you hear him announce, he still uses wrestling terminology for many moves.

 

[B16RacerN2NR]

Silver, Total, Cash, Nick, and Blanco... we've been talking about Lesnar for god knows how long already lol let's move on to a fight that's actually worth a long debate... Hendo vs Silva. I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT!!!

 

[philyphreak2127]

I'm thinking Lesnar might be for real as far as the boxing aspect of it goes. He may not know how to fight but if he can throw a punch and connect they would be devastating.

 

[get_nick]

i wouldn't mind seeing a bj penn urijah faber fight. ya ya, i know faber isn't in ufc.

 

[totalburnout]

Silver, Total, Cash, Nick, and Blanco... we've been talking about Lesnar for god knows how long already lol let's move on to a fight that's actually worth a long debate... Hendo vs Silva. I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT!!!

One step at a time.

Of course thats going to be a great fight, but I'm excited for these fights first.

 

[totalburnout]

i wouldn't mind seeing a bj penn urijah faber fight. ya ya, i know faber isn't in ufc.

At this point, faber is weighing in a good 10lbs less than BJ. BJ looks like he's put on some pretty good size.

I would say that if BJ can hold on with the conditioning that he would beat urijah. Even though I love urijah, he gets himself into situations that he shouldn't and he only gets out of them because of his conditioning. I think thats admirable, from a training perspective, but when he faces someone with knock out power and the ability to end a fight like Penn can, then he will be in trouble.

Faber did some seriously stupid moves in his last fight, even giving up his back when the legs were in. Its one thing to shake someone thats riding high with their hips on your back, but if they have the legs deep, its just stupid to be rolling to your back especially when its early in the fight and they're not sweaty yet.

 

[VTEC_CBR]

 

[jeffie7]

I'm big into martial arts, thats why I try to stay out of these threads. however I don't mind seeing them.=)

btw I agree handsonkitchen.com post are not to shabby.

 

[totalburnout]

I'll post here to hear the comments from guys acting as though Lesnar had his ass handed to him.

I told my friend before the fight if Mir won that it was going to be from an ankle lock. Lesnar had the fight, in fact most people thought the fight was over when it was stopped for Lesnar's shot to the back of Mir's head. When they were restarted, Lesnar basically knocked him out on his feet, with a straight right and due to his overzealousness he kept standing over top of Mir like a fool. Why on earth he would be so impatient and wouldn't simply wait to stand up and knock him out on his feet, or to take him down and slam him, I have no idea.

 

[E_SolSi]

why?? 2 words: no technique

Frank Mir x Brock Lesnar UFC 81


hes just a brawler (no different than Tank Abbott back in the day)... he just tries to over power his opponent with a lot of heavy punches... worked in the first fight against the tomato can... obviously didn't work against someone with some level of skill

i said it before and i still hold to it...i give him about as much credit as i give the steroided out juice heads that i see getting into fights at the clubs... they both show the same "skill" and "technique"

and if he doesn't come to the table with more than a lot of power and some fast hard punches,he will continue to be beaten by people who use technique

 

[jp_p5]

why?? 2 words: no technique

Frank Mir x Brock Lesnar UFC 81


hes just a brawler (no different than Tank Abbott back in the day)... he just tries to over power his opponent with a lot of heavy punches... worked in the first fight against the tomato can... obviously didn't work against someone with some level of skill

i said it before and i still hold to it...i give him about as much credit as i give the steroided out juice heads that i see getting into fights at the clubs... they both show the same "skill" and "technique"

and if he doesn't come to the table with more than a lot of power and some fast hard punches,he will continue to be beaten by people who use technique

if he was to get into a good training camp he might amount to something. but if he keeps thinking he is just going to over power his opponent he will keep on losing .

 

[Briansol]

he looks a lot smaller in that vid. last time i saw a pic of him he was f'ing huge. probably had to put the roids away to pass the drug screene.

and yeah, he pretty much just pounded away.... no technique at all. Frankly, if i didn't know he was a wrestler, i would say he had 0 wrestling skill.

 

[Capt. Orygun]

yeah he didn't show his wrestling skill, he was shoot/ground and pound all the way. I thought they were gonna stop the fight after brock's second shoot. But Mir weathered it and Lesnar got got which was one of the way's I saw the fight ending.

I'm still psyched for Lesnar in the UFC, but Mir as a first fight was a bad idea. Congo would have been a better foot wetter

 

[totalburnout]

why?? 2 words: no technique

Frank Mir x Brock Lesnar UFC 81


hes just a brawler (no different than Tank Abbott back in the day)... he just tries to over power his opponent with a lot of heavy punches... worked in the first fight against the tomato can... obviously didn't work against someone with some level of skill

i said it before and i still hold to it...i give him about as much credit as i give the steroided out juice heads that i see getting into fights at the clubs... they both show the same "skill" and "technique"

and if he doesn't come to the table with more than a lot of power and some fast hard punches,he will continue to be beaten by people who use technique

Uh... he had Mir knocked out on his feet. Essentially this fight was about Mir getting lucky, after Lesnar who dominated the fight, left a huge opening.

To not give someone credit, after he came into his first fight and dominated the initial portion of the fight with arguably the best heavyweight there currently is in the UFC, is pretty silly.

 

[totalburnout]

if he was to get into a good training camp he might amount to something. but if he keeps thinking he is just going to over power his opponent he will keep on losing .

He *is* in a good training camp and has trained with some of the best in the sport.

Research before you speak.

 

[totalburnout]

yeah he didn't show his wrestling skill, he was shoot/ground and pound all the way. I thought they were gonna stop the fight after brock's second shoot. But Mir weathered it and Lesnar got got which was one of the way's I saw the fight ending.

I'm still psyched for Lesnar in the UFC, but Mir as a first fight was a bad idea. Congo would have been a better foot wetter

I disagree.

Right now, unless Cro Crop shows new life blood, I would say that the best heavyweight is Mir or Congo.

Sylvia is a joke and always has been a joke.
Nuerega is past his prime and a human punching bag.
Couture is gone.
Cro Crop looks like he should have been gone years ago. (Although, allegedly he put on 20lbs and is revitalized after his last losses and the end of a messy relationship.)

 

[get_nick]

if that doesn't happen, it will probably be over early in the first round with either guy finishing it quickly.

i know that mir won, but he got beat up. i think if mccarthy was the ref, he would have stopped the fight because of those blows.

lesnar isn't done. he needs to practice a lot.

 

[get_nick]

he just tries to over power his opponent with a lot of heavy punches... worked in the first fight against the tomato can... obviously didn't work against someone with some level of skill

and if he doesn't come to the table with more than a lot of power and some fast hard punches,he will continue to be beaten by people who use technique

true. hopefully he realizes this and gets to work on his defense.