My own Breakfast

[Celerity]

ok: Update from the home front. THIS JUST IN


Someone here told me that I may not like what I see behind the huge emotional walls. The first few bricks are coming down, and I'm trying REALLY HARD to put them back.

There is some evil in the world that really shouldn't be underestimated. I find that people do horrible things to cute little girls that you read about in the bible. While my own brand of sinister is also pretty fuckin dark, The difference is that I have exposed myself to people who really weren't interested - and furthermore, didn't mirror my mind and play off of it until it snowballed out of control.

Hers did snowball out of control.

Family ? Yeah. I have to kill these people. It's not a family. It's a fucking cult. These people disgust me to tears, and are really making me consider something I don't appreciate: My own anger.

But we had a very nice time Friday night, after I posted. I took her to the lake and watched the fog roll in . We had some decent moments. Things moved well forward. She got sober, wanted to go home. Then I find at 3:00 am she's not only awake, but got an offer to go to a party (I call them rape parties, for a very clear reason) and drink more. She hurt herself more that night and came back.

Had some sweet moments online, but pushed off my offer to come up and spend time with her. Then I found out she was back at another rape party boozing it up. She left me online saying "I'm going to do horrible things to myself again, you won't like it and you won't recognise me (sic)" I just told her "Have fun"

Now I need to know if this sort of thing is a cry out for help, or if it's a cry out for attention. Both need a different response. Oh, and this girl, even sober, is very ... "welcoming" of me.

 

[UNDR8D]

To say "walk away" means that I would only give my attention to someone who would offer me a payment of some sort. To say she isn't worth it is unfair, at the least.

To say that my help to her won't offer payoff is disingenuous at best. When you help someone, you help them. You don't expect payoff. If you expect payoff, you're only helping yourself through someone. And that's not helping at all.

I was not at all insinuating that you should get something in return for helping people. Help is a selfless act. This is different. If you want to help her then you can't be involved with her because a relationship requires that the two people make an exchange of some sort. So, you will be getting something. If you want to be an older voice of reason, great. Don't try to make a long meaningful relationship out of this. Haven't you learned enough in your 30 years to know where this will end up?
I'm 23 and I would never date a 19 year old girl, let alone this one. A lot happens in three or four years. Shit, my gf is 21 and sometimes she is way too immature. The moments are rare and fleeting but they are still there. I'm just holding out for when she's 24+. She'll be even better when she's finally grown up.

ok: Update from the home front. THIS JUST IN


Someone here told me that I may not like what I see behind the huge emotional walls. The first few bricks are coming down, and I'm trying REALLY HARD to put them back.

There is some evil in the world that really shouldn't be underestimated. I find that people do horrible things to cute little girls that you read about in the bible. While my own brand of sinister is also pretty fuckin dark, The difference is that I have exposed myself to people who really weren't interested - and furthermore, didn't mirror my mind and play off of it until it snowballed out of control.

Hers did snowball out of control.

Family ? Yeah. I have to kill these people. It's not a family. It's a fucking cult. These people disgust me to tears, and are really making me consider something I don't appreciate: My own anger.

But we had a very nice time Friday night, after I posted. I took her to the lake and watched the fog roll in . We had some decent moments. Things moved well forward. She got sober, wanted to go home. Then I find at 3:00 am she's not only awake, but got an offer to go to a party (I call them rape parties, for a very clear reason) and drink more. She hurt herself more that night and came back.

Had some sweet moments online, but pushed off my offer to come up and spend time with her. Then I found out she was back at another rape party boozing it up. She left me online saying "I'm going to do horrible things to myself again, you won't like it and you won't recognise me (sic)" I just told her "Have fun"

Now I need to know if this sort of thing is a cry out for help, or if it's a cry out for attention. Both need a different response. Oh, and this girl, even sober, is very ... "welcoming" of me.

Look, I don't really know you well enough to say anything finite. Maybe you are a functional lunatic and you and this basket case are perfect for each other. I don't think so though. At 31 aren't you done with this shit? I had my dose of it a long time ago and realized that I didn't want to have to hold some mental patient's hand through all their self-loathing and repeated mistakes. "I'm going to do horrible things to myself again" Bullshit. Hopefully one of them is running onto the freeway disguised as pavement.

 

[awptickes]

By 'Hurt herself' do you mean physical trauma, as in cutting/punching/scratching, or via drugs/alcohol?

She got sober, wanted to go home.

Srsly. I'd stay away from this one.

 

[Celerity]

What you say is perfectly acceptable, and I totally agree . I know you're reading that and sayind "Fuck you, yankee blue-jeans, you say you agree, but here you are anyway". Again, you would be accurate.

What my mind tells me what to do is very different from what my emotions or wind-up clockwork heart tell me to do. I'm obsessed with this girl. And I chose it as much as I choose to step in dog shit. It happens. My mind clicked over one day and BAM. There it is.

So when she's stressed she cuts or drinks herself into a coma. When I'm stressed I take my bike out for 120+mph blasts. Which is better ? Which is safer ? Which is a better homage to my parents and friends who care about my health and wellbeing ?

I used to be pretty dark too. I was goth before it was cool or even named. (Is it cool yet?) but it passed, and it didn't pass answering to a schedule (This will only last a year) it passed because I found a way to express myself that was more accurately tuned into the people I was around.

Yeah, I play like that. I am affected by the people I associate with. big whoop. Wanna make a big deal about it?

When I had my stylings I had no one to associate with. And because I had no one to play off of, I never continually escalated the artform to an obsession. That's all I want to do for this girl, and I have reason to believe it's working. When we're around, I keep her distracted while she sobers up, and she stops being "fun" and starts being "real" and letting me into her past. Comparitvely ( And I've been working a LONG time on this, so if you don't read my post, read at least this: ) It's as if I love my bike. love love love. Tell everyone how I go out riding. Always ride. Wheelies, skitching, endos you name it. And when I meet a girl - and I'm around her, I "don't want to ride anymore". The question needs to be asked: Will I be a biker in a few years?

I'll either get real about my wants, or I'll slam into a bridge abutment at 110.

 

[Celerity]

By 'Hurt herself' do you mean physical trauma, as in cutting/punching/scratching, or via drugs/alcohol?


Srsly. I'd stay away from this one.

Cutting. Not sure if I mentioned this in this thread or during a few PMs around theforum. Either way, it's out there now.

I have the history of hitting myself.

 

[awptickes]

Everyone does something to 'let off steam'.

Everyone is effected by the people they are around. Christ, I've been with my girlfriend so long that we smile the same way, even laugh the same, even use the same words to swear with. (I'm not talking normal words, I'm talking about things like "damn black pig" or shit like that.)

It's just in the nature of the human race to pick up things from the surroundings. It's how we adapt to our new surroundings. Some people adapt quickly, others not so much.

 

[UNDR8D]

What you say is perfectly acceptable, and I totally agree . I know you're reading that and sayind "Fuck you, yankee blue-jeans, you say you agree, but here you are anyway". Again, you would be accurate.

What my mind tells me what to do is very different from what my emotions or wind-up clockwork heart tell me to do. I'm obsessed with this girl. And I chose it as much as I choose to step in dog shit. It happens. My mind clicked over one day and BAM. There it is.

So when she's stressed she cuts or drinks herself into a coma. When I'm stressed I take my bike out for 120+mph blasts. Which is better ? Which is safer ? Which is a better homage to my parents and friends who care about my health and wellbeing ?

I used to be pretty dark too. I was goth before it was cool or even named. (Is it cool yet?) but it passed, and it didn't pass answering to a schedule (This will only last a year) it passed because I found a way to express myself that was more accurately tuned into the people I was around.

Yeah, I play like that. I am affected by the people I associate with. big whoop. Wanna make a big deal about it?

When I had my stylings I had no one to associate with. And because I had no one to play off of, I never continually escalated the artform to an obsession. That's all I want to do for this girl, and I have reason to believe it's working. When we're around, I keep her distracted while she sobers up, and she stops being "fun" and starts being "real" and letting me into her past. Comparitvely ( And I've been working a LONG time on this, so if you don't read my post, read at least this: ) It's as if I love my bike. love love love. Tell everyone how I go out riding. Always ride. Wheelies, skitching, endos you name it. And when I meet a girl - and I'm around her, I "don't want to ride anymore". The question needs to be asked: Will I be a biker in a few years?

I'll either get real about my wants, or I'll slam into a bridge abutment at 110.

First, I would never say fuck you yankee blue-jeans because I am more of a yankee than you. If you really enjoy this thing and it does something good for you then great. This one is going to be a long time in the making.

 

[Celerity]

It's just in the nature of the human race to pick up things from the surroundings. It's how we adapt to our new surroundings. Some people adapt quickly, others not so much.

After dealing with my ex's depression for so long, I can mirror this sentiment. However, it is FAR more difficult for the depressed person to adapt and rise to meet the more completed person. It's far easier, and likely, that the completed person will disintegrate and fall to meet the depressed one.

I will not go down that road again. If I wasn't getting the response that I am getting then I wouldn't be doing it. The moment I feel that I am NOT bringing her out of this depression, I will stop. I've given myself milestones and definate times to reach those milestones. If progress isn't being made, I now fully understand how important it is (To both parties) to walk away.

And that shit hurts. It hurts more than anything. I would rather dig my eyes out with a fork. But the right thing and the easy thing aren't ever the same thing.

 

[awptickes]

If you're becoming unhappy by being around her. Walk away. If being with someone messes your psyche up worse, there's no way I'd be around them anymore. Unfortunately it's hard to tell the difference, unless you take the GDQ every week.

It seems like you've set a plan in motion already; so in that regard, you're either really creepy, or intelligent.


In my experience (trying to draw parallels here) if you let her dwell on crap like that, you're going to allow her to sink down even further. Something that I've found to be quite effective to help gauge progress is to decline having sex. Intercourse releases tons of endorphins, and can make you feel better, so the natural instinct is to have more sex. The sex ends up masking the underlying phsycolgical issues, and phisiological issues of daily activities not generating enough pleasure.

Take a good look at where this is going, or could go. Have escape plans mapped out, and have an emergency plan should she do someing seriously stupid. Nothing is worse than getting into a car accident trying to get to where someone you care about is, because they've hurt themself.

 

[Celerity]

If you're becoming unhappy by being around her. Walk away. If being with someone messes your psyche up worse, there's no way I'd be around them anymore. Unfortunately it's hard to tell the difference, unless you take the GDQ every week.

It seems like you've set a plan in motion already; so in that regard, you're either really creepy, or intelligent.


In my experience (trying to draw parallels here) if you let her dwell on crap like that, you're going to allow her to sink down even further. Something that I've found to be quite effective to help gauge progress is to decline having sex. Intercourse releases tons of endorphins, and can make you feel better, so the natural instinct is to have more sex. The sex ends up masking the underlying phsycolgical issues, and phisiological issues of daily activities not generating enough pleasure.

Take a good look at where this is going, or could go. Have escape plans mapped out, and have an emergency plan should she do someing seriously stupid. Nothing is worse than getting into a car accident trying to get to where someone you care about is, because they've hurt themself.

Perhaps now that you know a piece of the history, you can re-evaluate the logical stance on sex. It may release pleasure chemicals until the moment it does not and then things go very bad. I have to be very careful in this arena, knowing that I am just sick, intelligent, and experienced enough to do amazing things, but also knowing that those things have a lasting effect that may not do what I need them to do.

 

[awptickes]

Perhaps now that you know a piece of the history, you can re-evaluate the logical stance on sex. It may release pleasure chemicals until the moment it does not and then things go very bad. I have to be very careful in this arena, knowing that I am just sick, intelligent, and experienced enough to do amazing things, but also knowing that those things have a lasting effect that may not do what I need them to do.

Hrm. Lemme think this one over on the drive home. I'll get back to you.

 

[awptickes]

Most of the time, sex can help you feel better. It makes the blind see, the deaf hear, and the retarded reproduce....

Ok, so not like that, but in your case, the sex is one more crowbar in your tool-kit to get inside her head. It's very good that she's not walled-off herself from sex because of previous events.


About you still not knowing her name:

Tread lightly. She'll tell you these things when she feels the time is right. If she happens to be sloshed when she tells you, don't mention it again until she does. Unfortunately when the guard goes back up again, the memory tends to go away.

 

[Celerity]

She downed an entire huge bottle of Bacardi and manages to not even slur. She walks a little listed, but still makes it around from place to place. It's amazing. I've never seen someone drink like this.

My mind works in much the same way as anyone elses - Only I feel it works in overdrive. Most of the time what goes on in my imagination is FAR worse than reality. This girl comforts me all the time, "If I didn't like you, really really like you, I wouldn't be here" "Stop worrying about this. I really do like you" and points out "There are people I can tolerate. I don't even talk to those people. I like being around you"

The truth of the matter is this. I think this girl does like me. She has said "You're well to do" which is the strangest thing, because that's a pennsylvania-dutchism. I'm worried about her to the point of panick. I feel a compelling need to pull her out of a lifestyle that I view as wholeheartedly unhealthy, and supplant with a creation of my own that I think is far better.

 

[awptickes]

The truth of the matter is this. I think this girl does like me. She has said "You're well to do" which is the strangest thing, because that's a pennsylvania-dutchism. I'm worried about her to the point of panick. I feel a compelling need to pull her out of a lifestyle that I view as wholeheartedly unhealthy, and supplant with a creation of my own that I think is far better.

You know, the best 'out' I see for her is to go to another state.

 

[Celerity]

It rarely helps. Absence makes the heart grow fond.

 

[Aleaf.CRX]

You know, the best 'out' I see for her is to go to another state.

Giggles. Another state.

Well, you've heard my side on all this. The whole "I'm gonna hurt myself so you'll pity me and I can get at least some kind of attention" is DEFINATELY a cry for attention. I'd do that with my ex ALL the time.
"Well, if you don't start seeing it my way, I'm going to go hang out with these boys" (I didn't have any guy friends almost my entire time dating him). It's blackmailing. Plain and simple. If you don't give her the attention she crave (I'm pretty sure she doesn't know tactics to get positive attention yet), then she'll hurt herself, knowing your "daddy syndrome"'ll kick in.

 

[awptickes]

I wasn't talking about either of you, I was speaking of both of you.

It just depends on how badly you want to help her.

 

[Celerity]

The "Why" of what I do, lies now in the Spin-off thread.

 

[Celerity]

Quick thoughts about age differences;

I don't look nor act as a 32 year old guy, so it helps. Most of the girls I've dated so far bore the shit out of me. This one is the same heavy drinker with sexual issues, but shes very easy to look at and a total mink. That, and she "behaves" poetically, which I find a total turn-on.

The other thing about being a guy trying to get into a girl, is that she opens up to me slightly and occasionally. It makes me feel special.

So that's the good of this. A few of you have been IMing me about it, so I decided to post the response in thread.

 

[invisibledemon]

she needs an intervention. shes an alcoholic and if its not taken care of soon, it will control her whole life.
this is something that she will never get over, ask any sober alcoholic, you may be sober but theres not a moment that passes that you dont want to get a drink.

you want to help her, convince her to go get help.